Dear Fat People

[NAOS]

I can't wait for magic to come back in here and tell us how he isn't a fascist.

 

[RJF]

NAOS, alt13, oh my...

 

[TroutBum]

not everybody can eat as much dick as you can keep a trim waist.

I've been saying almost this exact thing to PKM for years.

 

[jimmy eat jazz]

I do not think it appropriate or in good taste to engage in public fat shaming. One thing about fat shaming--it's usually directed toward women. Kelly Clarkson is shamed for gaining weight, has anyone noticed, or cared, how fat Billy Joel or Elton John have gotten? If it's not an issue for them, why is it an issue for Clarkson?

With the said, obesity is a real and serious public health issue in the US, and it is absolutely appropriate to talk about it. However, I'm very skeptical that fat shaming will accomplish anything productive toward any public health goal of reducing obesity.

 

[jimmy eat jazz]

Do you think if the answer is yes, then it is acceptable? I'm curious. I had a discussion with a friend about the ethics of the anti-tobacco campaign of the last 2 decades. We both agreed that much of it can be considered a form of public shaming, and that they proved effective in significantly decreasing the number of smokers (in part). In fact, they created a cultural change of attitude toward smoking that isn't seen in the rest of the developed world, specially among the young (how does your son feel about it?). But do the ends justify the means? It is a really difficult calculation to make.

If the anti-tobacco campaigns have been successful, are you confident about your intepretation of the causal mechanism? Maybe there's something else going on here to explain the results other than public shaming is an effective technique to change unhealthy health/lifestyle habits.

 

[jimmy eat jazz]

But surely critics also have as much of a right to voice their opinion as they please. Your original argument was that it would not induce change. I am not so sure. I have lived in two different cultures, and I know the depth at which cultural norms influence people's behavior. Forget about vicious shaming and bullying. We're talking about people expressing disapproval of being seriously overweight in order to change social norms. Now assuming it does work, what would be the disadvantage of going down that road, as opposed to accepting fatness as a neutral personal choice?

Fat shaming has been going on for a very, very long time. My sister was overweight as a child and mercillessly ridiculed by her peers. Guess what? She got fatter. I'm not trying to generalize from an N of 1, however, I'm skeptical that public shaming and ridiculing fat people will change behavior significantly. As I said, making fun of fat people has been around since I was a child, and today there is a mutlti-billion dollar diet industry, meanwhile, we (as a society) have only gotten fatter.

 

[jimmy eat jazz]

I think we underestimate how much influence celebrities and famous people can have on kids. Now she is fat and that sends a message to kids that, hey if Clarkson with her 30 mil net worth can remain fat, why would I bother to eat healthy and exercise or worry about my health? Would we shame somebody for smoking and doing drugs? Equally unhealthy life style choices IMHO.

I think we underestimate how much influence celebrities and famous people can have on kids. Now she is fat and that sends a message to kids that, hey if Clarkson with her 30 mil net worth can remain fat, why would I bother to eat healthy and exercise or worry about my health? Would we shame somebody for smoking and doing drugs? Equally unhealthy life style choices IMHO.

Or,on the other hand, kids who struggle with weight and who are consistently reminded of this and who, as a result, suffer from low self-esteem and self-loathing might look at Clarkson as a good role model, showing them that being overweight does not diminish one's inherent worth. I guarantee you, fat children already know they're fat, as they are reminded about it on a daily basis. If this type of ridicule worked, no one would be fat. But having lived with a sibling who's suffered from fat shaming since childhood, I can say first hand just how devestatingly destructive this shaming can be on one's sense of self-worth. No minor public health benefit the might accrue from ritualized fat shaming can ever come close to compensating for the human emotional and phsychological damages it causes.

 

[VINYLONE]

 

[Gameface]

Or,on the other hand, kids who struggle with weight and who are consistently reminded of this and who, as a result, suffer from low self-esteem and self-loathing might look at Clarkson as a good role model, showing them that being overweight does not diminish one's inherent worth. I guarantee you, fat children already know they're fat, as they are reminded about it on a daily basis. If this type of ridicule worked, no one would be fat. But having lived with a sibling who's suffered from fat shaming since childhood, I can say first hand just how devestatingly destructive this shaming can be on one's sense of self-worth. No minor public health benefit the might accrue from ritualized fat shaming can ever come close to compensating for the human emotional and phsychological damages it causes.

And I wonder what MVP thinks fat shaming, particularly of female celebrities, does to fix the problem of obesity. Is it honestly a matter of counterbalancing the negative influence that an overweight successful female has by calling her names and defining her by a singular failing?

That's what fat shaming is. Calling female celebrities names and attempting to define them by a single physical attribute in order to diminish their accomplishments so that no one will look up to them and attempt to be fat like they are.

 

[Deleted member 848]

God, America is becoming so ****ing dumb. If you're fat, save for a thyroid disease, you deserve to be called fat. Especially if you're in an industry where "looks" is a major component of your job. As time progresses, it seems like people to want to be held less and less accountable for their own actions.

as long as the obesity epidemic is individualized and depoliticized, it will both continue and worsen.

 

[VINYLONE]

 

[magic]

as long as the obesity epidemic is individualized and depoliticized, it will both continue and worsen.

there really isn't a way to stop obesity in america. that would require a restriction/ban on sugary, high carb, low nutrition foods and/or force people to exercise. neither of those things will ever happen.