Does Lauri Get Traded?

[KqWIN]

What value are you assigning to Podz and Moody here? They can offer like 2.5 firsts or 2.75 firsts. I don't know that there would be a first out there for Moody headed into his final year of his rookie deal.

We also need to stop saying a big offer is a godfather offer. Moody plus picks is a good offer. It is not a godfather offer.

I counted all 3 firsts, Moody is 1, Podz is 1-2. So you can change that to 4.75-5.75 if you want. I don’t care to bicker about 0.25 worth of FRP value….the point is the same, it is an insane amount of value coming our way.

You can feel some way about the value or the semantics around the term “godfather”. Most who are not on a Jazz forum consider the lower package a a massive package to begin with. And it would align with everyone saying the Bridges package was a godfather package.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I counted all 3 firsts, Moody is 1, Podz is 1-2. So you can change that to 4.75-5.75 if you want. I don’t care to bicker about 0.25 worth of FRP value….the point is the same, it is an insane amount of value coming our way.

You can feel some way about the value or the semantics around the term “godfather”. Most who are not on a Jazz forum consider the lower package a a massive package to begin with. And it would align with everyone saying the Bridges package was a godfather package.

Yeah I'd quibble with Moody and the full 3 firsts part. I'd say its 4.5-5 firsts type value plus the swaps. Take Podz out and its like 3-3.5 1sts plus swaps... its good but the middle ground imo is they keep Moody. If they can get a first for Moody I'd say they should do that with a third team and route that pick our way. A godfather offer is one you HAVE to take. You have no choice because its so good. Without Podz it ain't a godfather offer. Its a solid offer. It doesn't have to be a godfather offer to make sense though.

Bridges got 5 firsts that are largely unencumbered and a swap plus Bogey (not sure there is much if any value there but maybe if healthy).

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Can we say that maxing out owning their draft (meaning super swaps) is a great, nearing godfather offer? That’s pretty bananas.

Its good... but just like a beach house sells for 25M and that is bananas... it still might be able to sell for more... we have the beach house... they want to buy it... we said we didn't want to sell it... they made a fair offer... we want more than fair cuz we really like the beach house.

 

[NUMBERICA]

I counted all 3 firsts, Moody is 1, Podz is 1-2. So you can change that to 4.75-5.75 if you want. I don’t care to bicker about 0.25 worth of FRP value….the point is the same, it is an insane amount of value coming our way.

You can feel some way about the value or the semantics around the term “godfather”. Most who are not on a Jazz forum consider the lower package a a massive package to begin with. And it would align with everyone saying the Bridges package was a godfather package.

Lemme play!

Podz and Moody = 2.5 unprotected picks
3 super swaps (25/27/29) = 2 unprotected picks
3 basically unprotected (26/28/30) = 2.75 unprotected picks
1 normal swap way out in 2031 = 0.75 unprotected pick (due to how far out it is and upside value)

I count at least 8 picks worth of value there.

 

[sip]

Yeah I'd quibble with Moody and the full 3 firsts part. I'd say its 4.5-5 firsts type value plus the swaps. Take Podz out and its like 3-3.5 1sts plus swaps... its good but the middle ground imo is they keep Moody. If they can get a first for Moody I'd say they should do that with a third team and route that pick our way. A godfather offer is one you HAVE to take. You have no choice because its so good. Without Podz it ain't a godfather offer. Its a solid offer. It doesn't have to be a godfather offer to make sense though.

Bridges got 5 firsts that are largely unencumbered and a swap plus Bogey (not sure there is much if any value there but maybe if healthy).

Do you value those knicks firsts more than the warriors firsts? I expect the knicks to be very good for the next 5 years based on the age of their core.

 

[KqWIN]

Yeah I'd quibble with Moody and the full 3 firsts part. I'd say its 4.5-5 firsts type value plus the swaps. Take Podz out and its like 3-3.5 1sts plus swaps... its good but the middle ground imo is they keep Moody. If they can get a first for Moody I'd say they should do that with a third team and route that pick our way. A godfather offer is one you HAVE to take. You have no choice because its so good. Without Podz it ain't a godfather offer. Its a solid offer. It doesn't have to be a godfather offer to make sense though.

Bridges got 5 firsts that are largely unencumbered and a swap plus Bogey (not sure there is much if any value there but maybe if healthy).

If you say so. I don't even know what pick you want to count as half. Is it 26 or 30? I'd rather have 30. I'd also rather have both 26 and 30 over some of the picks that the Nets got from the Knicks. However you want to quibble with the picks, it's a **** ton either way. Having 4.5-5 + 4 swaps as your hard line, nothing else below this can be accepted offer is crazy expectations IMO. But you do you. The expectations outside of the Jazz bubble are much different.

Me personally, I don't think the middle ground should be on Moody. When it comes to how much they should value Moody vs how much we should value Moody, Moody is the best value. I can see how they want to keep Podz and how it would take an "overpay" to get him. Moody should be in the deal not because we have to have him, but because he will be the best value.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Do you value those knicks firsts more than the warriors firsts? I expect the knicks to be very good for the next 5 years based on the age of their core.

Life comes at you fast. They have a lot of cap issues coming and will need to consolidate. Who knows.

 

[KqWIN]

Lemme play!

Podz and Moody = 2.5 unprotected picks
3 super swaps (25/27/29) = 2 unprotected picks
3 basically unprotected (26/28/30) = 2.75 unprotected picks
1 normal swap way out in 2031 = 0.75 unprotected pick (due to how far out it is and upside value)

I count at least 8 picks worth of value there.

We can quibble all we want about just how accurate this is....the package we're talking about is so far beyond what Bridges got. Bridges offer was already seen as a crazy haul. I love Lauri, he's not Luka on a 5 year deal and while I don't see tank+Lauri as bad, it's not something that you need to have 8+ FRP value to budge from.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

If you say so. I don't even know what pick you want to count as half. Is it 26 or 30? I'd rather have 30. I'd also rather have both 26 and 30 over some of the picks that the Nets got from the Knicks. However you want to quibble with the picks, it's a **** ton either way. Having 4.5-5 + 4 swaps as your hard line, nothing else below this can be accepted offer is crazy expectations IMO. But you do you. The expectations outside of the Jazz bubble are much different.

Me personally, I don't think the middle ground should be on Moody. When it comes to how much they should value Moody vs how much we should value Moody, Moody is the best value. I can see how they want to keep Podz and how it would take an "overpay" to get him. Moody should be in the deal not because we have to have him, but because he will be the best value.

Its more like part of a pick for 2030 and part of a pick for Moody. The evaluation and comparison to Bridges is a little flawed based on what we reportedly know. Bridges did not want to be there. Brooklyn has been able to have some success in FA. Pivot. We have a guy who was an AS a year ago. He also likes it here and wants to be here. If that changes I'd settle. We have a hard time retaining AS talent in this market... so I'm not settling on the picks or Podz. Sorry.

 

[NUMBERICA]

So who plays the Cavs-equivalent role in this scenario and what do they offer?

-Houston’s been floated and it makes some sense
-I still wonder about Sacramento even though they’d be in salary cap hell to do it (they’re only down a ‘31 swap and some seconds, after all)
-Sixers feel like they don’t have the package (saying nothing of salary issues)
-… Lakers? Unprotect ‘27 + ‘29 and ‘31 + 28 and 30 swaps? And Reaves? He would be a killer fit there.
-Are the Spurs too smart to **** with Danny?

 

[sip]

Life comes at you fast. They have a lot of cap issues coming and will need to consolidate. Who knows.

There cap issues are far less significant with Brunson and Bridges taking under market value.

 

[KqWIN]

Its more like part of a pick for 2030 and part of a pick for Moody. The evaluation and comparison to Bridges is a little flawed based on what we reportedly know. Bridges did not want to be there. Brooklyn has been able to have some success in FA. Pivot. We have a guy who was an AS a year ago. He also likes it here and wants to be here. If that changes I'd settle. We have a hard time retaining AS talent in this market... so I'm not settling on the picks or Podz. Sorry.

I don't care about these leverage conversations, you can list out a bunch of things that made it go the other way. Who cares, is the goal of our franchise to win the leverage battle as much as possible and squeeze out every ounce of trade value? I care about the deal that is acceptable and if completed puts the franchise in a better spot. I'm not going to turn down a deal that makes us better because we think we ought to be able to leverage out a little bit more.

What I see when I see this extremely high bar for an acceptable deal is an extreme enthusiasm for tank+Lauri plan. Do you value it that much? Aren't you scared about Bazley and Juzang ruining our tank? From my perspective, I do not care about getting the last drop possible out of a trade. I care about the position the Jazz are in as a franchise. Tank+Lauri is fine, but I don't need more than 8 FRP value (or whatever you want to call that extreme Podz+Moody+all picks offer) to move me from that position.