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Discussion in 'Utah Jazz' started by dalamon, Apr 5, 2019.
Umm yea, Thriller is going on ignore immediately. such stupid stupid points. can't call any rookie a bust after until at least 2 full seasons and probably closer to 3.
Honestly I look at that pic and think this is a guy that if he took his shirt off you'd see cigarette burns and lash marks and probably some knife wounds... all **** his step-dad did to him before the age of 16.
You have anger and rude thoughts.
Crazy this dude has been very, very bad all year. And all of a sudden he scores more points than exum has ever scored in 5 seasons...
My point is what I thought the point of this thread is; Grayson Allen might be an NBA player.
This isn't that nuanced of a point.
Joe Harris was a 4 year college player who averaged 2 points his first NBA year, and now averages 13.6 and leads the league in 3 point shooting at 47%.
There is no "magic formula" to figure this out.
Is this true?
not quite. Exum has scored 22 points before and 21 points another time or two.
Didn't Allen score 23?
I think if g allen played on a absolute *** team he could put up some numbers
Here’s my thing with Grayson— before these last two games, every time he was out there on important minutes he was such an obvious negative. It hurt to watch. He wasn’t even average. Other than his three point shot there was nothing that I saw that I liked.
He’s totally switched that script. Chances are he’ll still bust but for me it went from 80% odds to like 20%.
He picked up some confidence playing with the Stars.
hahaha, only Thriller is so sure of his own evaluating talent that he'll argue with the entire on board on whether a rookie is a bust or not. A rookie that's looked like an actual NBA player for 2 games now. Not saying he's ever going to be more than a fringe rotation player, but that's about what you should expect from a pick that low.
Frankly at pick 21 just staying in the league for 3 consecutive seasons means you are not a bust. Like all the idiots claiming CJ was a bust. Here is a clue for you he wasn't, he's still in the league after the Jazz, like I said he would be during those laughable arguments with Loggrad and Thriller back then. He wasn't great for the Jazz he's never been close to great. But my argument then is that he was not a bust and that he was an NBA player. Claiming a victory in the CJ argument when he's still playing in the league 10+ years later is a stupid move by Thriller and Loggrad.
for example-- this two game stretch is better than anythign Trey Lyles ever put together during his time with the Jazz imo.
I never cease to be amazed at how heated and personal things can get discussing trivial matters, such as whether the 21st pick in the draft is a bust. As for my two cents, it seems to me that the term “bust” in this case refers to performance relative to some set of expectations. It’s hard for me to imagine that anyone would have super high expectations for the 21st pick in the draft, after all, they were picked 21st for a reason. It’s rare to find rotation players this low in the draft, so if he’s not a rotation player in the end, that doesn’t mean he’s a bust, it means that he met expectations. Merely sticking in the league would meet or exceed expectations, depending on the context, while being a rotation player would greatly exceed expectations. Personally, I am not confident that Allen will ever be a rotation player, but I think there is a reasonable chance that he might stick in the league for a few years. Either way, the success or failure of the Jazz is highly unlikely to hinge on what happens with Grayson Allen.
i've said the same damn thing all season. let him be getting reps all year and room/leash to fail early on, and he'd be playing as well or better than guys like huerter in ATL or okogie in minny, or on lots of other teams who weren't going to make the playoffs or teams with little guard/wing depth who may also be competing for playoff positioning.
if your odds went from 80 to 20 percent, then the chances are that he actually won't bust. he's too good a shooter and all-around offensive player in my mind to bust, his problem has always been on the defensive end.
I never said he wouldn't be an NBA player. You downplay yours and others argument that CJ was the missing link, the next Jordan, who just needed a chance to show he was really the next GOAT. It got very stupid on that side of the argument. My claim was always that CJ would be a fringe role player at best, against all those arguing he was destined to be a perennial all Star. So who was closest in that estimation again?
precisely-- I went from thinking "this dude has no chance of sticking with this team" to "hmm. could become joe harris"
I never said he was more than a decent role player. You and others were claiming him to be the worst player on all of those rosters. He wasn't. He was a borderline rotation player and has stayed in the rotation of NBA teams for years since. The arguments back then from the haters that he was to blame for every loss. I just went back and looked through some old threads and the vitriol shown towards him during his time here was ludicrous. Again he wasn't great, but he was better than most of the players others wanted to play instead of him. I didn't see a single post by a single person claiming more than CJ was a rotation player at best. I saw a ton saying he was trash, a bust, and needed to go for anything. So again, I was closer than the other side of the argument. There were some posts stating he had a huge upside early on with lots of potential, that was about the most positive I could find in a quick scan.
Same goes on with a lot of rookies by some members of this fan base. Claiming Grayson is a bust because he couldn't get minutes for a playoff team is stupid as well. Most 21st picks don't play, most don't last more than a few years and very few become more than serviceable rotation players. Grayson looks to have the skills and mentality to beat those odds IMO, But we'll have to see.