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How are we going to score without Al?

DutchJazzer said:
your reasoning dont make sense
if corbin cared about a crisp offense he would have benched big al
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Yes and every other team with a volume scorer would bench them as well. Great point guy. The challenge is to use your dominant scorer while keeping everybody else involved and using an actual offense.

If you want to win ugly games you have to have a guy that creates offense by himself, if not two of them. We won the ugly game too.
 
Brown Notes said:
Yes and every other team with a volume scorer would bench them as well. Great point guy. The challenge is to use your dominant scorer while keeping everybody else involved and using an actual offense.
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a actual offense and keeping evryone involved renders big al useless as a dominant volume scorer.
those things cannot co exist.
if al does not get the ball because of ball movement. he wont score much.
and still will suck on defense as a center.

lack of defense from a point guard is acceptable but from a 30+ minutes a night starting center it is NOT.

he needs to go for that reason alone.

his passing might improve.
but his lack of trying on defense. and inabilty to defend won't chance
 
Brown Notes said:
It was a very timely win, fun and great to watch. Not an indictment of anybody though. Just another thought, where's the thread congratulating Corbs on winning huge without 2 key players? It cannot exist on JF.

So, if part of enjoying the win is pushing an agenda, hey have a great time. If not, it can be just as fun.
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Not pushing an agenda, just reflecting on how nice it felt to have a change of pace, and put to bed the constant notion that broadcasters including 1280 peeps have that we need big Al to score.
 
Cope said:
Yes I would... And completely expect an OLE like he does all the time.
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hahaha correct. There is difference between big man (Howard) and big man (Big Al). If Steve nash was a post player with current size, he would be a more scary guy for me than Big Al, at least i knew he would attempt to do something , like try to steal the ball maybe ?
 
Yes, because we won a game where we hit ~20 3s without Al, definitely means we don't need him.

Or Favors for that matter.
 
DutchJazzer said:
a actual offense and keeping evryone involved renders big al useless as a dominant volume scorer.
those things cannot co exist.
if al does not get the ball because of ball movement. he wont score much.
and still will suck on defense as a center.

lack of defense from a point guard is acceptable but from a 30+ minutes a night starting center it is NOT.

he needs to go for that reason alone.

his passing might improve.
but his lack of trying on defense. and inabilty to defend won't chance
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I agree with anything but the PG part. Remember we sucked in defense when Deron wasn't in mood to play defense back in the days. I think defense starts from perimeter, but of course big men create more of a Vulnerability. You can compensate lack of defense of PG with a shot blocker behind, but you cant compensate the Big Black Hole no matter how many good perimeter defenders you have.
 
LunaticWolf said:
Yes, because we won a game where we hit ~20 3s without Al, definitely means we don't need him.

Or Favors for that matter.
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We need Favors my friend, but not Big Al, i know it is sad but true story. Only thing we need from Big Al is getting 15 million salary cap room.
 
Brown Notes said:
Maybe show a trend against teams that play defense. Just a thought. GLHF.
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Would love to see this team w/out Big Al playing against teams that are actually not 4/16.

DutchJazzer said:
I would rather watch this team if they go 35-47 and miss the playoff.
than a big al led team going 41-41 and getting swept by spurs
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yes. Big Al is a nice enough guy, but OMG, our team is so boring to watch with him on the floor. I think most Jazz fans are frothing at the mouth to see what we saw tonight. They want the young guys, Favors/Kanter playing and they want to see crisp passing with great defense (obviously the Raptors are 4/16 so it was easy tonight). I would love to see an AJ-less team playing against teams like the Thunder, Memphis, Spurs, etc.

One thing about AJ is down the stretch he is pretty clutch (Sap is too, or at least has been) and you can always count on a bucket when one is needed, but the offense generally breaks down because of him, so it's dammed if you do and dammed if you don't.
 
DutchJazzer said:
a actual offense and keeping evryone involved renders big al useless as a dominant volume scorer.
those things cannot co exist.
if al does not get the ball because of ball movement. he wont score much.
and still will suck on defense as a center.

lack of defense from a point guard is acceptable but from a 30+ minutes a night starting center it is NOT.

he needs to go for that reason alone.

his passing might improve.
but his lack of trying on defense. and inabilty to defend won't chance
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Al is not incapable of defending, he is susceptible to being fatigued and also cannot be exposed very far from the basket. Al rotates very well, just not very often. That has to improve and while it has come from a very low point he's clearly improved. As has been beaten to death it's ridiculous to expect any center to guard a pg out past the foul line. Kanter got absolutely smoked at least once tonight in the exact same situation Al was in the other day.

You play your players to their strengths and try to hide their weaknesses. Very few players are great on both sides of the ball. Get your head on straight. Al contributes by putting so much pressure on a defense. They have to deny him the ball, double him or send somebody backside to try for a steal. Now against guys like all-world post defense Duncan it doesn't help much but then again this is not a HOF player we are talking about here.

Al is an offensive focus. You preach that everything would be peachy without an offensive focus but look around the league at the teams without one. They have no chance.
 
Brown Notes said:
Maybe show a trend against teams that play defense. Just a thought. GLHF.
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As much as I'm not an Al fan and as much as I think offense and defense would improve without him....I still have to agree with this.
Watching Toronto play defense is excruciating painful. I mean tinsley got a wide open layup. Tinsley even hesitated for like a second and couldn't even believe himself that he was so wide open. Without even looking at defensive ratings, I do think Toronto is one of the worst teams I"ve seen defensively.
 
So Jefferson = Black hole and Kanter equals great ball movement?

This game had nothing to do with Jefferson being out of the game. Toronto is a bad team.
 
The jazz basketball can be identified with physical and dominant front court, hard screens, cutting players, motion offense, unselfish players who know how to share the ball and if necessary hard fouls under the rim so without Al, all these things happened so flow of the offense was much quicker and the ball movement from side to side was better so lots of 3 point shots made. Of course it's about Craptors defense and frontcourt too but still in a long period, i prefer watching Al-less team fighting till the end, struggling on the offensive side but improving overall cause it's the true thing we gotta do, earlier it's better.
 
m3at said:
Would love to see this team w/out Big Al playing against teams that are actually not 4/16.



yes. Big Al is a nice enough guy, but OMG, our team is so boring to watch with him on the floor. I think most Jazz fans are frothing at the mouth to see what we saw tonight. They want the young guys, Favors/Kanter playing and they want to see crisp passing with great defense (obviously the Raptors are 4/16 so it was easy tonight). I would love to see an AJ-less team playing against teams like the Thunder, Memphis, Spurs, etc.

One thing about AJ is down the stretch he is pretty clutch (Sap is too, or at least has been) and you can always count on a bucket when one is needed, but the offense generally breaks down because of him, so it's dammed if you do and dammed if you don't.
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Last year we saw them vs a very good lakrs team in LA. Annd for the first time in a gazzilion years jazz beat th lakers in LA
 
sepanol said:
We need Favors my friend, but not Big Al, i know it is sad but true story. Only thing we need from Big Al is getting 15 million salary cap room.
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Way to miss the point. Any evidence from this game that we don't need jefferson is similar evidence against Favors. However, cognitive biases tend to run pro-Favors and anti-Jefferson, so people are interpreting the game in a manner to reinforce those biases.

This is one game. The Ewing theory is in effect.
 
One Brow said:
Way to miss the point. Any evidence from this game that we don't need jefferson is similar evidence against Favors.
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No, no, no, and no. Favors plays defense, a critical need in your bigs, especially you C. Al doesn't. Also, favors is not the black hole. The offense does not stagnate like with BA.
 
zman1527 said:
No, no, no, and no. Favors plays defense, a critical need in your bigs, especially you C. Al doesn't. Also, favors is not the black hole. The offense does not stagnate like with BA.
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Actually, you could argue that the offense does stagnate with Favors, as his offensive numbers are pretty abysmal.
 
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