Is Favors in the long-term plans at this point?

[Siro]

There are many... frequently the sum of the parts don’t add up.

Lack of shooting, an obvious defensive weak link, or too many guys that need th ball are the culprits.

Minny, OKC

Honestly the Heat teams were way more talented than their performance... things didn’t fit perfectly but those were super duper stars and they were elite defensively.

Lack of shooting/space murders offenses.

Lakers adding Malone and Payton made them a lot worse. Pippen joining Barkley and Hakeem did not work out. The Nets super team a few years ago did not work out.

Ron Mexico is right, I think, in that people overestimate chemistry a bit. But like when he says "height doesn't matter, only reach does", he's taken a good idea too far.

 

[NUMBERICA]

Tell me some examples of player who are really good that have not fit together? What makes those players not fit together?

The 2013 Lakers? The 2004 Lakers? The Thunder this year? The 2013 and 2014 Nets? The Timberwolves last year, the year before, during the Kevin Love era, arguably this year's Timberwolves?

Spacing. There's one ball. Experience. Chemistry.

Lack of spacing will kill just about any mojo and talent. Fortunately, Favors isn't paint-bound, but the success of his pairing with Gobert hinges largely on the quality of shooters and passers around them. Rubio is a non-starter (double-entendre).

 

[NUMBERICA]

Tell me some examples of player who are really good that have not fit together? What makes those players not fit together?

The 2013 Lakers? The 2004 Lakers? The Thunder this year? The 2013 and 2014 Nets? The Timberwolves last year, the year before, during the Kevin Love era, arguably this year's Timberwolves?

Spacing. There's one ball. Experience. Chemistry.

Lack of spacing will kill just about any mojo and talent. Fortunately, Favors isn't paint-bound, but the success of his pairing with Gobert hinges largely on the quality of shooters and passers around them. Rubio is a non-starter (double-entendre), and even then, I can't be convinced that the pairing is an ideal one.

 

[Ron Mexico]

OKC.

Is Carmelo good?

Is Paul George putting in a solid effort?

Do they have any depth around them?

Who is the good players that don't fit together?

 

[NUMBERICA]

You have to have talent, spacing, and chemistry on both sides of the floor. For example: Mitchell, Porzingis, Gobert, and whoever else the Jazz drudge up/develop is probably a pretty good ****ing team.

 

[NUMBERICA]

Is Carmelo good?

Is Paul George putting in a solid effort?

Do they have any depth around them?

Who is the good players that don't fit together?

Dude, you got what you asked for. You posited - rather ignorantly - that talent always figures itself out. You were provided with many examples where that wasn't the case. Give it up.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Lakers adding Malone and Payton made them a lot worse. Pippen joining Barkley and Hakeem did not work out. The Nets super team a few years ago did not work out.

Ron Mexico is right, I think, in that people overestimate chemistry a bit. But like when he says "height doesn't matter, only reach does", he's taken a good idea too far.

Did they make them worse or was it just getting to be peak Shaq/Kobe cant stand each other and Malone was hitting on Kobe's wife? Weren't they dominating with Malone until he got hurt?

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Did they make them worse or was it just getting to be peak Shaq/Kobe cant stand each other and Malone was hitting on Kobe's wife? Weren't they dominating with Malone until he got hurt?

If Malone is healthy they win... that's a bad example.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I think because teams are smarter you can't just mash together a big 3 and go win. The pieces have to fit.

Jerebko is not an offensive savant, but putting his shooting on the floor in the place of a non-shooter really helped the offense. Add in that DM and AB got good at creating and viola... what was a train wreck becomes the Spurs offense.

You don't need a ton of isolation scorers and there is a diminishing return on guys that need the ball... OKC struggles in part because Carmelo and RW don't provide a lot of value off ball... add in non-shooters like Roberson and Adams... what happens... losing.

 

[Ron Mexico]

Dude, you got what you asked for. You posited - rather ignorantly - that talent always figures itself out. You were provided with many examples where that wasn't the case. Give it up.

Some times there are rough fits and they work themselves out over time. I have yet to see a good example given though. Some examples of players past their time teaming up does not really convince me much of the argument. Or using OKC as an example or a very young Twolves team.

Look at Miami. Lebron and Wade were a terrible fit. Two players that at the time were not good shooters playing the 2 and 3. They also had 4 and 5 that could not shoot threes back then. But they are elite players and figured it out and made it work. 4 players that could not shoot threes yet they did okay because they had elite talent.

Yes, some lower talent can struggle to fit together. But for the most part I will always take the better player over fit.

I think Gobert and Favors together with Rubio does not work well right now because Rubio is not good enough to play with them. He is a sub par player. Maybe he can improve and fit in but it will take time. Like Miami with the example above it took a little while to figure it out. Although in our case I simply think Rubio is not good enough.

Ultimately what matters here is that Ill take a healthy Favors over a sub par player that can shoot threes for the team.

 

[str8line]

Hayward did not help us win his rookie year. Maybe in a couple games but across the season he hurt us more than he helped. 90% or more of rookies are a liability on the court across the season.

I disagree on that Favors and Hood are higher risks. Most players drafted don't turn out as well as them and even if they do it's after a few years.

Really? I was hyped on him and thought he played well. Rose-colored glasses?

 

[Ron Mexico]

Really? I was hyped on him and thought he played well. Rose-colored glasses?

I am not saying he was bad as a rookie but he was not a factor for us to win. I am not sure what people think about rookies but a guy putting up 5 ppg is not really a factor. More often he hurt us by being on the court, just like the vast majority of rookies. It is a sacrifice to play rookie usually. That is why young teams generally suck.