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Is Isiah Collier finally our new Stockton?

I feel like I’m getting too old for this board.

Any other long time posters feeling this way?

Some of these conversations seem insane to me.
 
I literally just defined what I think a playmaker is. Keyonte has been getting lots of assists lately but he is not my definition of a playmaker.

Some point guards initiate the offense but they arent asked to playmake. Perhaps they pass the ball to a player on the wing who scores. They get an assist. Neat. Tony parker has +7000 career assists but he initiated the offense. Many times that was a very simple pass to Tim Duncan who scored very efficiently. I watched a TON of Spurs ball back in the day.

Others show Mastery of how to move players out of their position through their play. Dragging defenders out of position to setup 2 v 1s or a mismatch or an easy bucket. The masterclass playmaker constantly works as a setup man. Stockton was the epitome of this. Jokic is a playmaker.

I enjoy watching playmaking. Deron was not a master.
You are weird
 
This “playmaker” and “true PG” talk is a prime example of why I think stressing about positions and labels is completely stupid.
 
Let's compare apples to apples: rookie season stats--



If Isaiah maintains similar production to his last 10 games- for the rest of the season-- he will jump up to about 20th on the list- about even with Magic Johnson. John Stockton is not on this list- because he only played 18 min a game as a rookie. If you adjust his numbers to per/36 min, Stockton had 10.09 in his rookie year. I project Isaiah will end at about 10.01.


Btw... Isaiah's shooting percentages would be better than Stockton's and his points per 36 min would be about the same- if he weren't taking 3 point shots. Stockton only took one 3 pointer every 3 games in his rookie year. Otherwise their stats would be about equal on shooting and points. (That doesn't mean I want him to stop. Stockton only hit 18% of his threes in his rookie year- but finished his career at 38%).

Isaiah is a better rebounder- but Stockton had twice as many steals. Turnovers per 36 min are in Stockton's favor- but not by that much.

As I mentioned in another post-- we should also factor in that Isaiah is getting his numbers on a hard-tanking team- with many of his passes going to G leaguers and cast offs from other teams...

51 games is a small sample size- but if you compare rookie season stats only-- adjusted to per 36 min--- Isaiah is very comparable to John Stockton.

One player on that list was Ennis Whatley who had better adjusted assist numbers than Stockton in his rookie year (11.07). Whatley played in the league 10 years as a back up. So of course that could happen with Isaiah.

But look at the other names on that list. Isaiah's adjusted per min assists in his rookie year will surpass Oscar Robertson, Magic Johnson, Chris Paul, Trae Young and pretty much every other great passer you can name...

If you thought this thread was a ridiculous premise-- the stats say otherwise. Of course no one can predict which players have the drive and determination to keep getting better year after year like Stockton and Malone-- but I sure like Isaiah's demeanor and confidence. He has consistently improved throughout his first season... so I for one am very excited to see how high his ceiling will eventually be!
 
When I stuck up for Collier in December the boo birds all came out. Nah.. he is the worst player in the league they said

Now people see what I was seeing. Call it what you will, Collier runs a great offense and is a setup man. It is fun to watch.
 
Pooh >>> Deron, Curry, Paul, Kidd, Nash, and Stockton cuz per 32.4 minutes in the third quarter of back to back games against the Vancouver Grizzles, he averaged more assists than those guys.

He was a superior playmaker.
I liked the graphic. There are a lot of great PGs since 1990 who didn't make that list. This was praise for Collier, not Pooh.
 
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