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Jazz and Knicks discussing Donovan Mitchell trade per Shams Charania and Tony Jones

Most draft picks are a crap shoot but that is not a popular view on this board. As Locke has said, draft picks are way overrated in terms of what you really get because so many draft picks dont pan out. I think the analytics make that clear. There are cases where people hit the jackpot like Danny in Boston with his picks becoming lotto picks. I do agree with what many have said that one of the greatest value of draft picks is that you can package them in all kinds of trades to get what you want. That works because everyone overvalues them. Flame away.
The expectation isn't that you get a bunch of great players with the picks - it's that the odds of getting one great player with such a high volume of picks is pretty good.

Plus, picks can be used in trades to build our roster once we're ready to compete again.
 
Most draft picks are a crap shoot but that is not a popular view on this board. As Locke has said, draft picks are way overrated in terms of what you really get because so many draft picks dont pan out. I think the analytics make that clear. There are cases where people hit the jackpot like Danny in Boston with his picks becoming lotto picks. I do agree with what many have said that one of the greatest value of draft picks is that you can package them in all kinds of trades to get what you want. That works because everyone overvalues them. Flame away.

We're in asset acquisition mode right now. If we can acquire players who would be positive assets, then we should do that. Players are a little more risky as assets because they can get hurt / lose value, whereas draft picks usually increase in value.

Since we are still at least 3 years out from competing, it doesn't make sense to be thinking about players as pieces within a competitive team. For most players we would need to pay them before we are ready or get stuck with players who might not fit in with what our hopefully future stars will be.
 
We're in asset acquisition mode right now. If we can acquire players who would be positive assets, then we should do that. Players are a little more risky as assets because they can get hurt / lose value, whereas draft picks usually increase in value.

Since we are still at least 3 years out from competing, it doesn't make sense to be thinking about players as pieces within a competitive team. For most players we would need to pay them before we are ready or get stuck with players who might not fit in with what our hopefully future stars will be.
As of right now we have zero guys I'd expect to be on the roster when we make the playoffs again. Don't get attached to any dudes... enjoy the fun they provide while here... but no one is marriage material atm.
 
The expectation isn't that you get a bunch of great players with the picks - it's that the odds of getting one great player with such a high volume of picks is pretty good.

Plus, picks can be used in trades to build our roster once we're ready to compete again.
People will point to the MANY picks Boston and Philly either missed on or squandered... and they still had enough to end as contenders. You can luck out like Milwaukee every now and again, but it is much better to play with a stacked deck.
 
Still trying to figure out what is wrong with that picture. Hmmmm....
Nothing's wrong with it. The whole system is based around making that woman look good. She wouldn't be able to look as good if her husband and everyone else wasn't giving her tasks to let her shine. It's all about her. The husband deserves to finally have a family that's built around him and plays to his strengths because nobody has done that for him yet.
 
this year is full asset accumulation... next year is asset accumulation too but the outline of the roster should start taking shape. Year 3 is pending... hit a home run or two and you might be play in team frisky... or you might have had bad luck and need to avoid moving to the middle for a year.
 
this year is full asset accumulation... next year is asset accumulation too but the outline of the roster should start taking shape. Year 3 is pending... hit a home run or two and you might be play in team frisky... or you might have had bad luck and need to avoid moving to the middle for a year.
I'm guessing a three year "suck and ****" to get assets, young talent, and rebuild the roster. Fourth year should start the payoff. Assuming we get some unprotected picks extended out for Don, Ainge can probably build a decent enough roster with great assets leftover to fill in the niches or continue to "build the farm system" out.
 
We really need/deserve Obi in this deal. We need the entertainment. He will at least make us sorta fun.
 
Let’s get Obi/Grimes/Reddish/Fournier
3 knicks unprotected picks
Two of the other picks and two swaps


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The next person to post this trade proposal or the other 12 slight variations as if it was a novel idea...

will have their memory glands swell with gobs of STANK PUTE juice. Then a single neon pink pube will grow right off the tip and it won't even stop growing if Spida gets traded.
 
Proposed on Bleacherreport (yes, I know). Would you do it?

Cleveland Cavaliers Receive: SG Donovan Mitchell, F Rudy Gay

Utah Jazz Receive: SG Collin Sexton, G/F Ochai Agbaji, F Lauri Markkanen, F Isaac Okoro, 2025 and 2027 first-round picks, 2024 and 2026 first-round pick swap rights
 
The next person to post this identical trade proposal as if it was a novel idea will have their memory glands swell with gobs of pute juice. Then a single neon pink pube will grow right off the tip and it won't evrn stop growing after Spida gets traded.
Lol

And yeah, I don't think we are getting Obi, Grimes and Reddish and 3 unprotecteds and 2 other 1sts and swaps too.

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System

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Sorry your "System" comment unearthed an iceberg.

I've tried to keep this negative view away, but it nags me at the back of my mind as possible... and I don't like it.

(dark view- could be right)

If that's true( it's the system), then the team did a crap job of funneling anyone to Rudy. If you ask me it was a classic snow job that all year led up to. It was a divided locker room that played out on the floor and some players thought that if they made Rudy look like an idiot that they could "get rid of him". Well it worked only because Quin saw it coming and left first because the players wouldn't listen to him and didn't see his vision and clearly argued with him verbally and in their actions. Why stick around. I'm guessing Ainge has seen it all as he's played ball at every level and has been in front offices at every level so he could tell what was going down. If he thinks it needs to be blown up, then he probably has a reason. He has always been fiery and a jerk tbh, so he has what it takes to do what needs to be done. Back in his day he was an Ingles in that he got under peoples skin, but not in a funny way but in a "I want to punch your face in" sort of way. I think Ainge knows when a player doesn't want to be here. Even when a player wants to be here remember what he's capable of. Look at what he did to Isaiah Thomas after his great year with the Celtics. Don't mess with him.

If Don stopped giving effort on purpose, to me that's worse than saying he doesn't have talent. That means he's a conniving selfish jerk. Saying he can just fix it when he gets to New York is not making Don look better, it's making him look like a prick or in the least not a professional. I work with people I really really don't like a lot, and I can keep it professional for a fraction of the money and way more time spent with them. To get mad and refuse to make a pass is stupid. To get mad and get lazy on defense is stupid. That's grounds for firing in any other professional field.

That's the negative view that's deep inside and as time rolls on, as I have time to think about things, and as I see how his actions and words have changed and as I've seen the cryptic tweets lately I go more and more to the dark side.

All this smoke can't be denied and most likely means he's just been trained to wear his mask since he was little and hanging out with his pops and the Mets pro players. He knows what's up, he knows what he's doing, he knows how to network, and he knows how to get paid... and he knows how to bide his time. This stuff scares me about people more than someone that is fiery and you know how they feel.

(/dark view)

I try to see the best in people and see the good in people because people are complicated and are a mix of both but I think he and others did this team and Rudy wrong and most of it probably won't actually come to light... but man I have to trust my gut. I've been burned by people in the past and it felt like this. This doesn't have much of an impact on me because I have my life and I'm only a fan but it takes me back to the days of people stabbing my back and snakes working in the dark. Not a good memory.

If I'm wrong, I'm wrong... I hope I'm wrong. My gut tells me I'm not, sad to say. :(

How is it possible I can like DM a lot and not like him at the same exact time just as much lately? People are complicated.

Bring on the tank.
 
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Proposed on Bleacherreport (yes, I know). Would you do it?

Cleveland Cavaliers Receive: SG Donovan Mitchell, F Rudy Gay

Utah Jazz Receive: SG Collin Sexton, G/F Ochai Agbaji, F Lauri Markkanen, F Isaac Okoro, 2025 and 2027 first-round picks, 2024 and 2026 first-round pick swap rights

If this was better than what the Knicks had on the table I'd do it. Some decent young players in that group and the 2027 pick is probably good once Donovan leaves Cleveland. Would prefer 2026 and 2028 pick swaps though.
 
Sorry your "System" comment unearthed an iceberg.

I've tried to keep this negative view away, but it nags me at the back of my mind as possible... and I don't like it.

(dark view- could be right)

If that's true( it's the system), then the team did a crap job of funneling anyone to Rudy. If you ask me it was a classic snow job that all year led up to. It was a divided locker room that played out on the floor and some players thought that if they made Rudy look like an idiot that they could "get rid of him". Well it worked only because Quin saw it coming and left first because the players wouldn't listen to him and didn't see his vision and clearly argued with him verbally and in their actions. Why stick around. I'm guessing Ainge has seen it all as he's played ball at every level and has been in front offices at every level so he could tell what was going down. If he thinks it needs to be blown up, then he probably has a reason. He has always been fiery and a jerk tbh, so he has what it takes to do what needs to be done. Back in his day he was an Ingles in that he got under peoples skin, but not in a funny way but in a "I want to punch your face in" sort of way. I think Ainge knows when a player doesn't want to be here. Even when a player wants to be here remember what he's capable of. Look at what he did to Isaiah Thomas after his great year with the Celtics. Don't mess with him.

If Don stopped giving effort on purpose, to me that's worse than saying he doesn't have talent. That means he's a conniving selfish jerk. Saying he can just fix it when he gets to New York is not making Don look better, it's making him look like a prick or in the least not a professional. I work with people I really really don't like a lot, and I can keep it professional for a fraction of the money and way more time spent with them. To get mad and refuse to make a pass is stupid. To get mad and get lazy on defense is stupid. That's grounds for firing in any other professional field.

That's the negative view that's deep inside and as time rolls on, as I have time to think about things, and as I see how his actions and words have changed and as I've seen the cryptic tweets lately I go more and more to the dark side.

All this smoke can't be denied and most likely means he's just been trained to wear his mask since he was little and hanging out with his pops and the Mets pro players. He knows what's up, he knows what he's doing, he knows how to network, and he knows how to get paid... and he knows how to bide his time. This stuff scares me about people more than someone that is fiery and you know how they feel.

(/dark view)

I try to see the best in people and see the good in people because people are complicated and are a mix of both but I think he and others did this team and Rudy wrong and most of it probably won't actually come to light... but man I have to trust my gut. I've been burned by people in the past and it felt like this. This doesn't have much of an impact on me because I have my life and I'm only a fan but it takes me back to the days of people stabbing my back and snakes working in the dark. Not a good memory.

If I'm wrong, I'm wrong... I hope I'm wrong. My gut tells me I'm not, sad to say. :(

How is it possible I can like DM a lot and not like him at the same exact time just as much lately? People are complicated.

Bring on the tank.
Good post. Spot on.
 
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