Keyonte George Hype & Appreciation Thread

[HermanG]

Holy **** some of y'all try to dumb.

Keyonte is already a good shooter. The dude is shooting 38% on off the dribble 3s. His issue is he's missing catch and shoot attempts. That won't continue

Looking at the tape its pretty obvious he is going to be really good. I wanted to challenge the stat starers to see if they had something more than the numbers.

I think I'll do a breakdown on the margin of error the way I did with Wemby. I'm pretty sure KG just a few airballs all year and a lot of in-and-outs. It feels like he is just adapting to NBA 3P range and hasnt gotten comfortable or found his spots yet. It was just 1.5 years ago he was still shooting 20ft 3 pointers from HS line.

 

[sip]

I feel pretty confident that not only will Key be viewed as a good 3pt shooter but he will have stretches where he is flat out dominant from the outside.

 

[Tremendous Upside]

Oh there are plenty of good examples, even among star level players. These guys come to mind as classic examples:
Kawhi shot 25% from 3 and 74.4% from FT line in college. Been a tad bit better in NBA.
Jason Kidd shot like crap in college and as a rookie (including under 70% from FT)
KAT didnt even take 3s in college (was a great FT shooter though)

Kawhi and Kidd are the usual suspects that always come up when this issue is discussed. Chip Engelland reworked Kawhi's shot and Bob Thate fixed Kidd's. Look it up. It's not like they just magically improved with time.

KAT doesn't count, as you said he never had a problem shooting the ball. That just wasn't his role in college.

And just randomly browsing familiar names I see that Mike Conley (shot 30% from 3 and 69% from FT in college) and Jordan Clarkson (averaged 32% from 3 in 4 years of college)

Clarkson is a career 34% shooter from the perimeter! That's worse than league average. In other words, the guy definitely didn't become a good shooter in the NBA. In fact it's been years since he last broke the 35% barrier for a full season. When you look at his shot volume, Clarkson is one of the least efficient 3pt shooters in the league. Not something Key should be emulating.

Mike Conley played one year of college (very small sample) and barely shot from the perimeter his rookie year (unlike Keyonte). From his 2nd year on, he was a pretty good shooter.

You sure? I mean, analyze his form, mechanics, how he sets his feet, balance, release quickness, average margin of error on misses, shot quality and decission making. You might find plenty of reasons for optimism.

I dunno. The only thing that really matters is putting the ball in the basket. Wemby's shot looks very good, and he can't hit anything.

I hope the Jazz coaches recognize that Keyonte may need some outside help with his shot. It may be the difference between him becoming and All Star and staying a role player.

 

[str8line]

Remember how we questioned Donovan's shooting his rookie year and after? He went from 34% 3 pt his rookie year to 36, 36, 38, 35, 38, and this season is back to 34. His FG% has hovered at around 44 his whole career with last year at 48 but this year back down to 44. FT% was 80 for two seasons then around 85-86 and this year has jumped to 90%.

Keyonte is 34.7% FG, 31.1% 3PT, 78% FT

Donovan was a great finisher from the start while Keyonte misses a lot of shots off the glass but seems to be pretty good with the floater.

 

[fishonjazz]

@Tremendous Upside and @jom2003 if you had to make a call, would you say Keyonte George is going to be a good 3PT shooter in the NBA or not?

You are here painting a negative picture, and I want to see what you truely believe. Its easy to hide behind stats and say "this is what it currently is" (a child can do this), but make a proper analysis and give me your best arguments.

You have to describe what good means.
Personally I don't think he will ever shoot 40% from 3 for a season.

I think he is about a 36% 3 point shooter for his career. Decent/average. Good enough imo.

Only thing that would show him to be a good shooter to this point in his career is his form. There is no statistical evidence whatsoever.

Sent from my CPH2451 using Tapatalk

 

[Watcher]

Mike Conley played one year of college (very small sample)

And how many did Keyonte play?

 

[Tremendous Upside]

I think he is about a 36% 3 point shooter for his career. Decent/average. Good enough imo.

There's a long, long, LONG way from 5+ 3PA's per game at 31% to 5+ 3PA's at 36%. Even for a single season, let alone a career.

For context: guys like Sexton, THT, Olynyk and Collins have never managed it, not even for a season, and they're all better shooters than Keyonte. Clarkson has done it in 3 seasons, but he's not even close to averaging that kind of accuracy on that volume over his career.

Lauri, though, has only a single season in his career where he hasn't done it (got pretty close though) and his career averages exceed those numbers in both categories. Truly high volume perimeter shooting at high accuracy is so hard to pull off in the NBA.

So I think it's pretty safe to say that if Keyonte becomes a 36% perimeter shooter, he won't be doing it on 5+ attempts per game.

 

[hgb]

I think it's pretty safe to say that if Keyonte becomes a 36% perimeter shooter, he won't be doing it on 5+ attempts per game.

That's ridiculous. As Cy pointed out, he already shoots 38% off the dribble. It might not happen, but it's _really_far_ from being "pretty safe". I have zero doubt Keyonte will be shooting 5+ attempts per game, so the question is can he reach 36, and I'd say his odds are at least not terrible.

 

[Tremendous Upside]

And how many did Keyonte play?

That's why I pointed out that Conley shot 3's on very low volume his rookie season, while Keyonte is launching 5+ per game.

Conley's rookie year sample was way too small to tell us anything definite about his skill as a shooter. Key, though, is getting lots more opportunities to show he can hit the long ball consistently.

So far the results haven't been good. Let's hope he improves.

 

[Watcher]

For whatever it's worth -- since Keyonte's college numbers are such a small sample size -- here's info on his senior season in high school.

High school career​

George began playing high school basketball for Lewisville High School in Lewisville, Texas.[1] As a freshman, he averaged 21 points, four rebounds and 1.9 steals per game, and was named District 6-6A Offensive Player of the Year.[2] George averaged 23.9 points, 5.1 rebounds, 2.3 assists and 2.1 steals per game as a sophomore, earning District 6-6A MVP honors. For his junior season, he transferred to iSchool of Lewisville.[3] George averaged 24.8 points per game as a junior.[4] He moved to IMG Academy in Bradenton, Florida for his senior season,[5] where he averaged 17.8 points per game and shot 41% from three-point range. He was the highest-ranked recruit in program history when he committed to Baylor University for the 2023 college basketball season.[6]

Obviously high school is different (3 pt line is closer to the basket) but the kids are also younger/weaker. Seems like he at least has some history of being a good shooter.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I think Key is going to be a solid shooter (for a guard) at worst. His misses aren't off by a lot. His form is really good. I think for him to be great he needs to be an excellent shooter and we will see about that. He blows some bunnies around the rim kind of overthinking things I think. A couple more jumpers should start falling and I think he can get in the low 40s overall and mid 30s 3 point percentage. If he can keep his FT rate and 3 pt attempt rate fairly high then I think its a recipe to being efficient enough.

His passing and defense are so far beyond where I thought they would be that if the shooting comes around he is really on to something imo. He will naturally add some strength and some of his other deficiencies will take care of themselves. I'm not sure he's like an all-star type ceiling guy but I think he could be top 10 pg type player that plays well with others. I think we will still need someone at the 2 or 3 that can be a major driver of offense if this is the formula we roll with.

 

[SoUjazzfan]

The thing that gives me the most hope is when you hear about how he loves the game and is always studying it. I believe it was his mother who said he watched tape of every jazz game from last season after he was drafted so he'd figure out how to play in their system. This leads me to believe he'll work like crazy to improve. He seems to have a passion for the game similar to Rudy. Personally, I expect him to become an above average player.

 

[KqWIN]

When the team defense is this bad, it's really hard to determine who is bad and who is really bad. I was a little more optimistic on his defense to begin with, so maybe it's just a different set of expectations, but when I watch him play on defense my thoughts are.....yeah he's really bad. But even with my higher optimism this was expected. I thought it was great that he was actually able to find his way all the way to the basket against POR....not sure he does that against non-terrible teams though. His high FTr is a great indicator, but only 7% of shots at the rim is a TOUGH living.

 

[Elizah Huge]

When the team defense is this bad, it's really hard to determine who is bad and who is really bad. I was a little more optimistic on his defense to begin with, so maybe it's just a different set of expectations, but when I watch him play on defense my thoughts are.....yeah he's really bad. But even with my higher optimism this was expected. I thought it was great that he was actually able to find his way all the way to the basket against POR....not sure he does that against non-terrible teams though. His high FTr is a great indicator, but only 7% of shots at the rim is a TOUGH living.

I will admit my eyes aren’t glued to him every single play but I thought he’s been pretty decent on defense.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

When the team defense is this bad, it's really hard to determine who is bad and who is really bad. I was a little more optimistic on his defense to begin with, so maybe it's just a different set of expectations, but when I watch him play on defense my thoughts are.....yeah he's really bad. But even with my higher optimism this was expected. I thought it was great that he was actually able to find his way all the way to the basket against POR....not sure he does that against non-terrible teams though. His high FTr is a great indicator, but only 7% of shots at the rim is a TOUGH living.

I thought he could be like Grayson Allen as a rookie levels of bad so I think he's actually done quite well. There are definitely several times a game he has eff ups but I've been impressed with how he moves his feet and seems to be in mostly the right spots. He's made a few plays on defense here and there. So I think he's closer to average than really bad.

With some added strength I think some of the plays he gets bullied will go away but overall I am impressed with his defense as a rookie. Seems to care and have some understanding on that side of the court and I think that's a good sign.

 

[framer]

That's why I pointed out that Conley shot 3's on very low volume his rookie season, while Keyonte is launching 5+ per game.

Conley's rookie year sample was way too small to tell us anything definite about his skill as a shooter. Key, though, is getting lots more opportunities to show he can hit the long ball consistently.

So far the results haven't been good. Let's hope he improves.

No, rookies rarely improve. . .

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Keyonte is like a slightly better Jordan Clarkson on defense.

 

[seattlejazzfan]

Keyonte is like a slightly better Jordan Clarkson on defense.

which for a rookie, we'll take it. rookie generally suck **** defensively.

 

[framer]

which for a rookie, we'll take it. rookie generally suck **** defensively.

And offensively. And they don't know what to do during timeouts and get lost coming out of the lockerroom. If you are getting anything at all positive out of a rookie, they might end up being special.

 

[fishonjazz]

I will admit my eyes aren’t glued to him every single play but I thought he’s been pretty decent on defense.

Me too. Seems pretty good defensively to me.

Sent from my CPH2451 using Tapatalk