Legalize Cannabis
- Thread starter SaltyDawg
- Start date
SaltyDawg
Well-Known Member
I don't like alcohol either but, drugs have its own world which is horrible and on an another level and it can drag to the horrible results with way more possibility and frequently. Just me thinks, based on my experience.
I would argue that alcohol is much worse than cannabis. It's much worse for your health, much more addictive, and leads to worse behavior. It can even kill you, which cannabis can't.
Aren't there that strict penalties already? Which don't work... I'm not saying to make it all illegal or all legal either, hell I've no opinion about the solution.
I'm trying to say, it won't be better for the community to make it legal than it being illegal, so does it worth to increasing risks of more addict people for just people who want their heads cracked freely?
GVC
Well-Known Member
Virtually everything in this post runs counter to the best existing literature. The propaganda works, and you've been duped. Your honest opinion is wrong, plain and simple.
You assume that something being legal makes it easier for minors to obtain. There are two major problems:
1. Minors have a much more difficult time buying goods legal only for adult consumption because the sale of such goods is almost entirely restricted to regulated establishments. If you take away the black market, it's entirely possible that cannabis use among minors declines.
2. In both the Netherlands and Portugal, decriminalized states, rates of use cannabis use among minors has either declined or risen at rates much lower than other illicit substances and/or other (similar) countries.
Alcohol maybe worse than cannabis, I may agree on that, but cannabis opens a door to the way way worse things, I'm just hating on that fact even though people believe it's a small amount of people who use strong drugs because of the cannabis.
Btw, my english went out of control, sorry for that.
GVC
Well-Known Member
Again, the gateway theory has been debunked so many times it's not worth discussing anymore. Further, there are other side effects of the current policy- the marginalization of convicted felons (and other negative consequences of imprisonment, especially in light of the high rates of recidivism), the promotion of the black market and organized criminal activity in general (consider the negative consequences of alcohol prohibition in America in the 20s), the disintegration of the family (when non-violent offenders are imprisoned..this also relates to the problem of learned criminal activity in prison), possible adverse health effects (uncontrolled substances that will be used regardless are far more likely to be laced with other more serious and addictive drugs), and (again) potentially higher use among minors- that ought to be considered. This is ignoring entirely the cost of the current (international) policy, and the other, more effective and cheaper, methods of dealing with matters of public health, like addiction.
1. Once the drugs are on the adults hands? Isn't it the same situation?
2. I can speak for Netherlands only(don't know portugal)... In there, there are extreme efforts to reduce the drugs usage. And it improves and grows every single year more and more. Maybe it is the thing it cures?
SaltyDawg
Well-Known Member
So then legalize those worse things too. Let people make their own choices. Problem solved. If my neighbor wants to smoke crack in his basement, that's not my business. He can do what he wants in his own basement as far as I'm concerned.
Make it illegal for him to give the drugs to his kids and he probably won't (just like he doesn't give his kids beer today).
GVC
Well-Known Member
If you are already marginalized and/or a convicted felon, who comes in contact with dealers of ALL drugs, both soft and hard, you might find other options more available and more attractive.
Besides: https://stash.norml.org/bigbook/gateway-drugs.html
As I get older, I can of think "Damn, smoking weed is a waste of money and time. Still, it should be legalized.".
GVC
Well-Known Member
1. Yes, but wouldn't you guess that the average adult user is less likely to sell to minors than a drug dealer is?
2. You can speak for the Netherlands? Really? Can you provide a link to anything?
First of all, do not use a complex english like this against me(please), I don't even have a 7 years old boy's comprehensive abilities on english.
Then, the subject goes here to the prison and its benefits/losses etc which is an entirely different subject which even Dostoyevski couldn't work out of it.
And I completely agree on the deficits of the current policies, but just not convinced of 'lets make everything free' solution, would it really make a heaven out of the world?
You like 7 year old's though, don't you?
GVC
Well-Known Member
Of course not, but hopefully we're trying to get better. The current policy is expensive AND ineffective. There are far better options available, and some countries have been successful (thus far) implementing them. Is there an example of a country, state/province, city, etc. that has (recently) moved toward harm reduction strategies that has experienced worse outcomes? I know of none.
1. So there will still be the guys who will sell it to the kids. Only they will be in more comfort, since it's legal to get it.
2. Is it really necessary to discuss whether the drugs usage reduced because of the education and all the campaigns with extreme efforts or it reduced simply because of they made them legal and free?
Because of I think different than you?
GVC
Well-Known Member
1. Sale of cannabis to minors will still be illegal, and law enforcement will presumably be less busy tracking down recreational users (since their use would be legal). Currently, almost 90% of cannabis-related arrests in the US are for simple possession. I'm not selling to a kid if the penalties are stiff and they're only looking for me.
2. Of course it is. It's a hell of a lot cheaper to focus your efforts on the education and use reduction of minors than on arresting recreational users. I'd say arresting nearly a million people per year for marijuana-related offenses is pretty extreme. The cost and efficacy of the policy is relevant, no?
23% seems like a frighteningly large gateway to me. Different perspectives, I guess.
For starters, what percent of alcohol users become serious addicts? I doubt it's anywhere near the 23% gateway you just quoted.
GVC
Well-Known Member
That's a devastatingly bad read of his post. If ALL those users of other drugs were only users because of their prior cannabis use, then I'd agree. Is there any evidence that the relaxation of cannabis laws has led to an increase in the abuse of "hard" drugs?