Check out the P1 Headline of the Day.
https://www.1280thezone.com/
KOC talking about the Matthews situation. He sounds pissed.
https://www.1280thezone.com/
KOC talking about the Matthews situation. He sounds pissed.
Matthews: Jazz never made me an offer. I would have accepted less.
- Thread starter The O'Connor Cocktail
- Start date
LogGrad98
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No no no, that is Sho-num.
Hopper
Banned
Yeah, and he don't pulls no punches, eh, Baby!? In response to the reminder that Wes claimed the Jazz never made an offer, he emphatically says: "Not true. That's absolutely not true." Maybe I missed it, but I haven't seen a comment that direct and cateorical made on this topic reported anywhere.
How many dozens have flatly asserted, in this thread alone, that KOC NEVER MADE AN OFFER?
//r00t 4 Jazz
Well-Known Member
Hopper
Banned
KOC also says in that interview that the biggest reason that they let Wes go was because they could get a guy like Raja Bell. KOC is usin the "market" to his advantage too. He makes it sound like, that if no one as good or better had been available for a lesser amount than Wes, the Jazz woulda matched. As it is, the Jazz signed Bell even before the 1 week period to match was up, so you know it musta been in the works beforehand. Any offer they made to Wes would presumably also have been made knowing that there were other candidates available to take Matthews' place.
One thing to think about here.
Wesley made out like a bandit with the Portland deal.....but didn't his agent also make some serious skrill off this deal?
Lance Young can suck on my *****.
Wesley made out like a bandit with the Portland deal.....but didn't his agent also make some serious skrill off this deal?
Lance Young can suck on my *****.
The Jazz have a history of bidding against themselves. AK, Harping, Ostertag, and Memo but they let the market determine value for CJ, Millsap and Wes. It finally came back to bite them. You can look at the market and compare your player with other players to determine what the value of player is. Letting other teams determine your players price is plain dumb.
I see the concept of the free market eludes you.
Hopper
Banned
That wouldn't be the onliest thang, neither, eh, Jed?
hehehe
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
And what do you think the market is for a RFA who had a decent half-season? Perhaps an offer in the range of what Mo Williams received; perhaps a bit more because Wesley worked his way up to starter? KOC disputes the claim from Wesley that he never tried to negotiate. Maybe KOC offered something in the range of $2M and Wesley's agent said, nope, I think my client's worth is closer to the full MLE, at which point KOC told him to go shop the market.
Kind of like my employer. When it's time for a raise, I could very well march in to my boss and tell him I'm worth $1,000,000. Know what he'd say (after he stopped laughing)? "Well, if you think you can get that somewhere else, you're free to try. Once you come to your senses, come back and have a serious conversation." Could I get that kind of cash somewhere? Well, if a competitor thought I had very valuable skills or thought he would damage my company by hiring me away. Or maybe he thinks my employer would match and just wants to drive up costs.
If ONLY the real world worked like the NBA, huh? Maybe I COULD find a company willing to pay me 5x-10x what I'm really worth, what similar people have received in the past in similar situtations.
gregbroncs
Well-Known Member
Their 1st official offer was to Bell. They never made an official offer because they were told by the agent that they wanted more than the Jazz were willing to offer. Why do the paperwork if you know before hand that it will be refused?
There is always negotiating before an official offer is made. During that negotiating period lots of "offers" are obviously made.
calijazz
Winner of the 2011 Jazzfanz mock draft contest
This. People are just looking for somewhere to blame for Wes leaving and KOC is the easy target. Wes and his agent weren't stupid, they were going to wait and find the best offer, unless the Jazz offered the full MLE right off the bat. They knew what the Jazz were willing to offer him, so they went to find something better, and they did. If jazzfanz should be blaming anyone it's the idiots over with the Blazers that gave him that contract. I don't blame Wes for setting up his family for life. But sorry Wes, but those comments in the article seem like sour grapes to me. He wanted the money and the PT, therefore he wanted the Jazz to match. But the reality is, he knew what he was choosing between, money and PT. He had to of known he realistically couldn't have both.
gregbroncs
Well-Known Member
I'm not sure if it was a qualifying offer or just an non guaranteed 2nd year on the original contract.
Also THIS.
if you ask Matthews (or his agent) there was not a peice of paper offered - thus no offer.
If you ask O'Conner he said - were thinking X - thus an offer.
So i'd be surprised if the dispute is any more than this - he said, he said.
Darkwing Duck
Well-Known Member
Nice to know I'm not the only one to post The Last Dragon stuff.
Though I prefer to use video.
Though I prefer to use video.
Stifle Tower
Punch Bowl Re-Filler
What's interesting in all the articles is that Wes' father believed junior's value was probably in the $3M-$5M range. Jazz may very well have matched at 5/$25M. They probably wouldn't have liked it, but that kind of money could at least be justifed.
KOC seemed pretty adamant about denying that what Wes said was true. On the other hand, why would Wes flat out said Jazz never made an offer? I think it comes down to this: what Wes said about not testing the market if Jazz made an offer right away cannot be true. Maybe that's what Wes says and thinks right now, but logically, it is almost impossible that he would do it. Reality is, Blazers were right there from day 1. Take a look at this: https://blog.oregonlive.com/blazers/2010/06/nba_free_agency_trail_blazers.html . Note the date of this: June 30th. That's on the eve of 1st day of free agency. In effect, he was "testing the market" since the first day, because that's when Blazers reached out to him. Maybe if KOC called him at midnight, made an offer, and said it is take it or leave it, like Suns did to Raja, perhaps he would accept, but ... it's a long shot to say the least. Blazers were there from day one, so there is no way he would take the lesser offer before testing the market, since he was in effect testing the market since day one - when Blazers called. And as KOC said, Wes took the money. I don't think there was anything that could have been done differently by KOC to change that, given the size of the offer Blazers gave him. The good news is: we actually got a better player - albeit short term - as his replacement. Raja is a much better and much more proven defender and 3 point shooter, filling 2 of our biggest needs in 1 shot. So for next 2-3 years, we will likely be better off. And after that hopefully Hayward will be our starter at the position.