Matthews: Jazz never made me an offer. I would have accepted less.

[gregbroncs]

hmmmmm. Is KOC talking out of his ***? He did mention earlier in the interview that their first offer was to Raja Bell. So when did they actually make an offer to Wes Matthews?

Their 1st official offer was to Bell. They never made an official offer because they were told by the agent that they wanted more than the Jazz were willing to offer. Why do the paperwork if you know before hand that it will be refused?

There is always negotiating before an official offer is made. During that negotiating period lots of "offers" are obviously made.

 

[calijazz]

Their 1st official offer was to Bell. They never made an official offer because they were told by the agent that they wanted more than the Jazz were willing to offer. Why do the paperwork if you know before hand that it will be refused?

This. People are just looking for somewhere to blame for Wes leaving and KOC is the easy target. Wes and his agent weren't stupid, they were going to wait and find the best offer, unless the Jazz offered the full MLE right off the bat. They knew what the Jazz were willing to offer him, so they went to find something better, and they did. If jazzfanz should be blaming anyone it's the idiots over with the Blazers that gave him that contract. I don't blame Wes for setting up his family for life. But sorry Wes, but those comments in the article seem like sour grapes to me. He wanted the money and the PT, therefore he wanted the Jazz to match. But the reality is, he knew what he was choosing between, money and PT. He had to of known he realistically couldn't have both.

 

[Bronco70]

Wasn't a qualifying offer (however small) required to retain the rights to match?

 

[gregbroncs]

Wasn't a qualifying offer (however small) required to retain the rights to match?

I'm not sure if it was a qualifying offer or just an non guaranteed 2nd year on the original contract.

 

[Harcher]

Their 1st official offer was to Bell. They never made an official offer because they were told by the agent that they wanted more than the Jazz were willing to offer. Why do the paperwork if you know before hand that it will be refused?

There is always negotiating before an official offer is made. During that negotiating period lots of "offers" are obviously made.

Also THIS.

if you ask Matthews (or his agent) there was not a peice of paper offered - thus no offer.
If you ask O'Conner he said - were thinking X - thus an offer.

So i'd be surprised if the dispute is any more than this - he said, he said.

 

[Darkwing Duck]

Nice to know I'm not the only one to post The Last Dragon stuff.

Though I prefer to use video.

 

[Stifle Tower]

What's interesting in all the articles is that Wes' father believed junior's value was probably in the $3M-$5M range. Jazz may very well have matched at 5/$25M. They probably wouldn't have liked it, but that kind of money could at least be justifed.

 

[Borat]

Also THIS.

if you ask Matthews (or his agent) there was not a peice of paper offered - thus no offer.
If you ask O'Conner he said - were thinking X - thus an offer.

So i'd be surprised if the dispute is any more than this - he said, he said.

KOC seemed pretty adamant about denying that what Wes said was true. On the other hand, why would Wes flat out said Jazz never made an offer? I think it comes down to this: what Wes said about not testing the market if Jazz made an offer right away cannot be true. Maybe that's what Wes says and thinks right now, but logically, it is almost impossible that he would do it. Reality is, Blazers were right there from day 1. Take a look at this: https://blog.oregonlive.com/blazers/2010/06/nba_free_agency_trail_blazers.html . Note the date of this: June 30th. That's on the eve of 1st day of free agency. In effect, he was "testing the market" since the first day, because that's when Blazers reached out to him. Maybe if KOC called him at midnight, made an offer, and said it is take it or leave it, like Suns did to Raja, perhaps he would accept, but ... it's a long shot to say the least. Blazers were there from day one, so there is no way he would take the lesser offer before testing the market, since he was in effect testing the market since day one - when Blazers called. And as KOC said, Wes took the money. I don't think there was anything that could have been done differently by KOC to change that, given the size of the offer Blazers gave him. The good news is: we actually got a better player - albeit short term - as his replacement. Raja is a much better and much more proven defender and 3 point shooter, filling 2 of our biggest needs in 1 shot. So for next 2-3 years, we will likely be better off. And after that hopefully Hayward will be our starter at the position.

 

[moevillini]

from sltrib blog: https://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/blogs/j...thews.html.csp

News: Wesley Matthews signed a five-year, $32.7 million contract with Portland after one outstanding season with the Jazz, who gave the undrafted free agent his opportunity to make an impact in the NBA.

Reaction: Two decades ago, Miami pursued a free agent by the name of John Stockton. The Heat were ready to offer the Jazz point guard $10 million a year -- an astronomical sum in those days. While reporting the story, I obviously had several conversations with Stockton, but one stands out after all these years and is applicable to today's happenings in the NBA. At one point, I suggested to Stockton that he had to take the offer, just to be fair to himself and his family. But in his unique, down-to-earth, level-headed way, he replied, "Steve, how much is enough?" I wonder what agents like Lance Young, who represents Matthews, would think about a client who told him, 'You know, I'm going to take a little less money because this is the organization and a coaching staff that gave me a chance. Let's give a little something back to the people who had faith in me, when nobody else did.'"

I agree with those saying "Good Luck" to Wes. And it will definitely be interesting to see how his career pans out over the next few years, and whether or not that salary will be justified.

I disagree with the notion that he should feel he "owes" the Jazz something JUST because the Jazz took a chance, signed him, and gave him playing time etc. etc. etc. The Jazz did that to fill their needs, not to do some "good deed" to a struggling NBA wanna-be. Plus, it's not a fair comparison - Stockton had been with the Jazz how many years at that point? Certainly quite a few, he'd established an entire career with the team, not just one year.

 

[richgates]

I am with you Moe. I think the nature of free agency affects loyalty on both sides, which is unfortunate really because as a fan there was nothing better than having Stockton and Malone for so many years. I don't think the Jazz or Wes did anything wrong here. Both sides made a business decision that was best.

 

[Hopper]

I think it comes down to this: what Wes said about not testing the market if Jazz made an offer right away cannot be true. Maybe that's what Wes says and thinks right now, but logically, it is almost impossible that he would do it.

Your position has changed quite a bit, Borat. That's fine, and I'm not trying to mock, ridicule, or criticize you for re-evaluating. Quite the contrary, actually. Your post indicates that you have actually given the situation more thought, and have considered most of the information available to you, rather than selectively emphasizing only that "evidence" and argument which might serve to "prove" a conclusion which you may have reached just because you "wanted to."

It's kind of ironic that your post is made to Harcher, who initially opposed your original stance, but then quickly abandoned his position and then embraced your (former) view of the matter, based on a statement of Matthews that was both misrepresented (in the thread title) and inherently suspect, given the circumstances.

KOC had options (such as Bell) and he knew it. KOC had personally stated, long before the free agency started, that it was a "top priority" for the Jazz to sign Matthews. If he made any "mistakes" it may have been that. Matthews himself cited such statements as the reason he was surprised the Jazz didn't match any offer he could extract from the Blazers, however "unreasonable."

But KOC wouldn't say it was a "top priority" and then refuse to even consider talking to Wes when free agency began. No doubt he verbally threw out certain numbers the Jazz would entertain for Wes's agent to consider and was rebuffed by being told that nothing less than the max would do. KOC knew he could always match "the max" whether Wes wanted him to, or not. He therefore had no incentive whatsoever to offer the max, and many "disincentives" for doing it. In the meantime, KOC had no choice but to start looking at such alternatives to Wes as Bell. Even so, the last thing KOC wanted to do was to drive Wes away from the Jazz to Portland. On the other hand, there was no way he could stop Wes from signing with Portland if that's what Wes wanted to do.

 

[NCJazz]

Somebody correct me if I am wrong, but I think about the only player that really sacrificed a high percentage of salary to stay with their team this year was Haslem with Miami so dont think you can blame Matthews for taking the big offer. However, O'Connor is saying he is basically lying about the Jazz not talking with him. So if true have lost a lot of respect for Matthews. Roy has had some injury problems so who knows maybe he will play more than 15 minutes a game.