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Off-Season Rumblings

Handlogten's Heros said:
I do think DA learned from last year that maybe wait to get the absolute best price this time around. Make your profit on the front end of the transaction and any backend profit is a bonus.
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That or just think about fit a bit more. Don't take the roll big who regressed while playing with a top 5 PNR PG and expect magic.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
You mean no one will take him not even for free lol. This is shocking.
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I think there might be a Detroit deal there. Langdon said in the presser they would look to take on contracts for assets.

There just aren't that many bad contracts in the NBA so I'm not sure what they can actually get. They may see Collins as a floor spacing big who can help their young core.

Collins and a second rounder and maybe they bite or maybe Utah waits til the deadline and Collins is actually hopping and it becomes they give us a 2nd rounder.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
I think there might be a Detroit deal there. Langdon said in the presser they would look to take on contracts for assets.

There just aren't that many bad contracts in the NBA so I'm not sure what they can actually get. They may see Collins as a floor spacing big who can help their young core.

Collins and a second rounder and maybe they bite or maybe Utah waits til the deadline and Collins is actually hopping and it becomes they give us a 2nd rounder.
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That’s not for free though. I think SA or Detroit would consider it but we are likely adding something for that privilege. Wait it out and it might be somewhat cheap but that also limits what you can do with the space. I can see one of the 29 or 32 picks going out with Collins to make a trade work. I’d probably rather just trade Walker if there is a good offer and roll with Collins to see if he can bump his value up.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
That or just think about fit a bit more. Don't take the roll big who regressed while playing with a top 5 PNR PG and expect magic.
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Or just like the actual player more than the perceived “value”. With Lavine I think it has to be both they get a sweetener and like him long term.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Or just like the actual player more than the perceived “value”. With Lavine I think it has to be both they get a sweetener and like him long term.
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But at least with LaVine we can paint a compelling narrative as to why he has value. He has always been on a poorly managed organization, either through coaching or roster choices. When the team was at its peak quality level LaVine was a huge part of their success and not holding them back.

With Collins it was like "Oh this PNR big is being held back by playing with a great passer...... Because of course he can just suddenly do more if you give him the ball more even though he really hasn't shown those skillsets ever?"
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
But at least with LaVine we can paint a compelling narrative as to why he has value. He has always been on a poorly managed organization, either through coaching or roster choices. When the team was at its peak quality level LaVine was a huge part of their success and not holding them back.

With Collins it was like "Oh this PNR big is being held back by playing with a great passer...... Because of course he can just suddenly do more if you give him the ball more even though he really hasn't shown those skillsets ever?"
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Look I invented the John Collins trade being dumb. I get it.
 
I think the bigger issue with Collins is that we had no plans to run more PnR. Yes he was playing with Trae, but he didn’t get a ton of PnR in the later stages of his ATL days because he was playing full time next to another C who was getting the PnR opportunities instead. Despite playing C almost full time in UTA he got the same amount of PnR opportunities.

And despite that….he was able to produce at a really high level in the second half of the season. He was basically peak John Collins once again and he was playing with the ultimate trash crew. I’m not saying he will be the next Mike Conley, but there might be something to the idea of having to adjust after playing with one team for a long time. If John Collins plays like he did in the year of 2024 for a full season, we would think of him a lot differently. He has already done a lot to rehab his value.

I’m sure a lot of the frustration thrown at the Collins trade is because some so desperately want to tank….but in reality (where full blown tanking is not actually an option for the franchise) I don’t think it’s actually been this tragic move. Unless you think making a run at someone like Tobias is a great move, the opportunity cost doesn’t seem to be that high.

I do not care to talk about the merits of full blown tanking. So miss me with that. It will not happen, and Ive talked enough about something that will not happen.
 
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