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Pissing Match

Stoked said:
Which claim? That Obama is moving the goalposts as woodward put it or that he was threatened. I believe Woodward thought he was being threatened but I do not believe that was what the aide was doing.
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I clearly refer to him being threatened as to what I was addressiing in my original post.

If you read the link it's an amicable exchange between two people - the tone is clearly non-threatening. This is silly nonsense. Woodward is just trying to sell some books.
 
SaltyDawg said:
I haven't seen anyone say it was Obama's idea except for Woodward (besides the many outlets that reference Woodward as the basis for their own claim). I haven't seen any proof that Woodward is correct.

I have seen plenty of people with direct knowledge of this (Obama, Pelosi, Reed) claim that it was not what Obama wanted. I've also seen Boehner himself say that it was what he wanted (as he says in the video I posted).

To be, there is no debate about it. And unless I see some evidence to the contrary, I will consider Woodward to be full of it.

If this isn't what Boehner wanted, his house would put forth a bill to stop it.
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https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-.../obama-says-congress-owns-sequestration-cuts/

Says the Presidents claim is mostly false.
 
candrew said:
I clearly refer to him being threatened as to what I was addressiing in my original post.

If you read the link it's an amicable exchange between two people - the tone is clearly non-threatening. This is silly nonsense. Woodward is just trying to sell some books.
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Just making sure. The email also references the yelling that aide did one the phone so I will give Woodward the benefit of the doubt and say that he thought he was threatened but I agree that he was not.
 
Stoked said:
And the fact that the Presidents team negotiated the deal for the sequester back in 11.
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Nobody is denying the president agreed to it. We all know he signed off on it at the last minute after extensive negotiations.

The question is, who was forced into taking what they didn't want?

Boehner said he got what he wanted. Obama said he didn't.

To me, this is a no brainer.

If politifact wants to say it was mostly false (not entirely false, mind you) just because Woodward's book says otherwise, and the fact that Obama actually signed off on the deal, that's on them. It's hardly "proof" though.

Boehner saying it's what he wanted is pretty conclusive.
 
SaltyDawg said:
Nobody is denying the president agreed to it. We all know he signed off on it at the last minute after extensive negotiations.

The question is, who was forced into taking what they didn't want?

Boehner said he got what he wanted. Obama said he didn't.

To me, this is a no brainer.

If politifact wants to say it was mostly false (not entirely false, mind you) just because Woodward's book says otherwise, and the fact that Obama actually signed off on the deal, that's on them. It's hardly "proof" though.

Boehner saying it's what he wanted is pretty conclusive.
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Good to know that the mighty fact check sites only matter if they say soemthing you want them to say.
 
Stoked said:
Good to know that the mighty fact check sites only matter if they say soemthing you want them to say.
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No, that's not it. If they had said it was Obama's idea and had some proof, I'd probably accept it.

As it stands, they're basically saying, "This Woodward guy's book says it was Obama's idea. And we know Obama had to agree to it because he signed off on it. So without saying his claim that it was Congress's idea was totally bunk, well say he's not totally off the hook either."

Boehner flat out said it was what he wanted. Obama said many times that he did not want it, and it would never actually happen.

It has nothing to do with them saying something I want them to say. It's just me looking at everything and it not being hard to figure out.

So far, the only "evidence" that it was Obama's baby (scat's words) is Woodward 's book. And there are a bunch of outlets making the claim, but citing his book as their source.
 
franklin said:
We don't need to be honest with each other around here, Stoked. Just technical.
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If we're going to be honest, the honest part is that almost every Republican has signed a pledge not to increase taxes, and they were not called out on that pledge, because they did not increase taxes. It would be political suicide for them to do so.

If we're being honest, all these Republicans will go back to their constituencies in 2014 and say they did not raise taxes.

You know, just to keep things honest.
 
Scat said:
Doesn't change the fact that sequestration was Obama's baby.
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Again, being honest, it was a desperation ploy on the part of the White House to avoid default. So, it was Obama's idea, but adopted by the Republicans. The responsibility is shared, but the Republicans are the driving force behind the sequester.
 
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