Rudy Gobert 5 years, $205M


NUMBERICA

Well-Known Member
I am very happy with both contract extensions for our two best all-star players. We havent had a core like this since Stockton/Malone days. Dwill/Boozer was close but not as good, nor locked in for this long in their prime. Plus we have a solid team around them with some decent options to make a move if something opens up. The Jazz franchise is a really good place right now.
We also don’t have the crippling presence of AK and this team is capable of even basic, solvent defense.

That team was fun, but it was maddeningly soft, unfocused, and kinda douchey.
 


Ron Mexico

Well-Known Member
Contributor
We also don’t have the crippling presence of AK and this team is capable of even basic, solvent defense.

That team was fun, but it was maddeningly soft, unfocused, and kinda douchey.
Yeah, I felt like we were close but never made the right moves at that time. But I also think I got my hopes too high based on us getting lucky and making it to the Western Finals. With retrospect we could have moved AK early for a solid haul. We should have also moved one of Boozer or Okur for a better fit. Plus (though Sloan was great) imagine a coach who liked the 3 point shot when we had Okur, Korver, and Dwill starting. Even CJ would have been much better if he could have a green light to shoot. I imagine we could have got a decent trade for AK early and traded Boozer for something better. We could have been really good. But thats all with hindsight for me. It was still fun to watch. Those Rockets series were amazing! But I like this team better. But they really need to step up this year over last.
 

oneye

Well-Known Member
2018 Award Winner
Those are assumptions about the meaning behind them. Maybe its intentional, maybe its not. You can only guess why he did things you have no idea why, you are making huge assumptions and have decided they are facts. No, he doesnt owe you or the team anything that he isnt doing. He could be in Phoenix, Sac, or Charlotte and he would still be making the same paycheck for doing his job. Its simply an opinion about how those teams would be with him. Those are pretend scenarios we have no idea about. You dont know what he has or has not been involved with. You are making the assumption based on stalking his social media. You can stalk me and know nothing about me from my social media, that is true from pretty much everyone.

Yes, some players comment about their extension, some do not. That does not mean anything you assume about it. Could he handle things better or do things better? Of course, that is true of every human on earth.

You dont know what happened with the Gobert situation.

He has thanked Utah Jazz recently and the Millers and many more. His profile picture is someone he is honoring on Instagram it looks like, but looking at his last few posts they are all pictures/videos of him in the Jazz uniform. Again you are assuming why his profile picture isnt himself in a Jazz uniform. It might be a fact he changed them but everything else is just your assumptions and most likely false since its just your guess.

I really hope for your sake you dont act like this with your other relationships in real life. I hope guys/girls/people you like you dont stalk people on their social media and make assumptions and over think every text you get from them.

You are being obsessive and feeling like someone owes you something that they do not. On top of that you are calling him names and trying to belittle him for not doing what you want, it makes it worse. He is a real person and he is trying to figure out life for himself. You are allowed to have your opinion about him and his actions. But they are not facts or real. Those are just your opinions of someone you know next to nothing about and have no interaction with. The reality is you are trying to confirm your own bias with how you read each thing he does you see.

I am pretty sure if you hold anyone to your expectations like this you'll be disappointed.
Being in a stable, winning environment has absolutely been beneficial to his career. Stop pretending otherwise. Yes. He should be grateful. You think he gets the All Star nod over Booker by the media if Booker is on the winning team and he isn’t? Nah. You can call them assumptions as to why he’s doing them, but he’s one of the most PR savvy active players in the league. Max extensions get commented on. They just do.

As for the Gobert situation. Yes I do know he let it fester for months and was asked directly by Tim MacMahon why being so smart and PR savvy, he didn’t address it earlier? His answer “I didn’t want to take away from what the other guys on the team were doing” A canned, rehearsed lie of an answer because he didn’t want to own up to the fact he acted like a bitch for months. The team wasn’t playing, the league was shutdown. Literally nothing was going on and that’s his “reason”. K.


As for not knowing him, well....if you follow him on his social media platforms he’s pretty public about a lot of things. I follow a lot of people on social. You don’t really have to look for these things to see/notice them lol. He’s not just some random dude and he makes himself pretty attainable with how active he is on social media. Some of these things as I said aren’t an “owe” someone something, it’s just common courtesy especially for someone as active as he is and as PR aware as he is.

As for his profile pic, that goes back to May, when he threw a fit over comments on this post, which I decided to scroll through about 200 of the 3,000+ comments tonight to refresh my memory, and honestly, there’s a lot of support in that comment section, but he was sole focused on the idiots and let it really really get to him. Like this ones not an assumption, he changed his profile pics the very moment he was reacting to comments he didn’t like on social. It is 100% why he did it and he never came back to it.



Have a nice night everyone.
 

Ron Mexico

Well-Known Member
Contributor
Being in a stable, winning environment has absolutely been beneficial to his career. Stop pretending otherwise. Yes. He should be grateful. You think he gets the All Star nod over Booker by the media if Booker is on the winning team and he isn’t? Nah. You can call them assumptions as to why he’s doing them, but he’s one of the most PR savvy active players in the league. Max extensions get commented on. They just do.

As for the Gobert situation. Yes I do know he let it fester for months and was asked directly by Tim MacMahon why being so smart and PR savvy, he didn’t address it earlier? His answer “I didn’t want to take away from what the other guys on the team were doing” A canned, rehearsed lie of an answer because he didn’t want to own up to the fact he acted like a bitch for months. The team wasn’t playing, the league was shutdown. Literally nothing was going on and that’s his “reason”. K.


As for not knowing him, well....if you follow him on his social media platforms he’s pretty public about a lot of things. I follow a lot of people on social. You don’t really have to look for these things to see/notice them lol. He’s not just some random dude and he makes himself pretty attainable with how active he is on social media. Some of these things as I said aren’t an “owe” someone something, it’s just common courtesy especially for someone as active as he is and as PR aware as he is.

As for his profile pic, that goes back to May, when he threw a fit over comments on this post, which I decided to scroll through about 200 of the 3,000+ comments tonight to refresh my memory, and honestly, there’s a lot of support in that comment section, but he was sole focused on the idiots and let it really really get to him. Like this ones not an assumption, he changed his profile pics the very moment he was reacting to comments he didn’t like on social. It is 100% why he did it and he never came back to it.



Have a nice night everyone.
My point exactly, you are over analyzing, stalking, and making broad assumptions. Have at it though. Its not a good look for you though, but obviously you are sticking to it. Good luck!
 

infection

Well-Known Member
Staff member
2018 Award Winner
2019 Award Winner
Yeah, I felt like we were close but never made the right moves at that time. But I also think I got my hopes too high based on us getting lucky and making it to the Western Finals. With retrospect we could have moved AK early for a solid haul. We should have also moved one of Boozer or Okur for a better fit. Plus (though Sloan was great) imagine a coach who liked the 3 point shot when we had Okur, Korver, and Dwill starting. Even CJ would have been much better if he could have a green light to shoot. I imagine we could have got a decent trade for AK early and traded Boozer for something better. We could have been really good. But thats all with hindsight for me. It was still fun to watch. Those Rockets series were amazing! But I like this team better. But they really need to step up this year over last.
I remember everyone soured on Boozer after his second season, but he finished strong and looked like a 20/10 guy, then a contingent of the forum laughed about him being a 20/10 guy, which he ended up being. I know a lot of people soured on Boozer before I did. The first one I moved on from was AK, and it was immediately after WCF. I think it was about a year later that I was done with Boozer, and I would have probably moved either of those guys for nothing because I felt like they were both holding us back in terms of chemistry or mentality, but in different ways. AK I believe was cancerous. Not hugely so, but enough so. Boozer wasn't necessarily a cancer, but he didn't seem to have a lot of fire and I preferred to just run Millsap out there. That wasn't a popular idea, but we needed some toughness. I always liked Deron and Okur. I wished Korver played more/started. I was okay with the Deron trade on principle, but still feel that Deron/Sloan was Greg/Kevin's doing while allowing Deron/Sloan to be a convenient scapegoat that diverted attention.

I remember the rumored AK for Ginobili deal. No idea if there were any legs to that, but it would have been awesome. This was when AK still had high value and before Ginobili became an MVP candidate. He would have looked awesome next to Deron. On the flip side, I remember during that summer after Boozer's second year people were suggesting all kinds of ridiculous Boozer trades. One person suggested trading him for Jamaal Magloire.
 

One Brow

Well-Known Member

Yah.

Uncomfortable is one thing, I think having the conversations in a real way is important. At every approach he chose the most toxic approach he could and then apparently expected zero disagreement ever and got super offended at any disagreement whether it was socially or politically with him. Donovan was a part of fostering toxicity with the conversation.

So far, every suggestion you have offered for improvement is one that would remove the discomfort from people who supported the system being protested. It's not possible to have an effective protest you would consider to not toxic.

Like the kneeling during the anthem stuff, did that really forward the conversation?

Yes, very much so.

Or just turn a lot of people off and close their minds to you and change the conversation from racial issues to a kneeling debate?

No matter what the protest is, people who wish to avoid discussing the reason for the protest will object to the protest actions. You may have missed this somehow, but kneeling is an act of *respect*. You kneel before a monarch, you traditionally kneel when proposing, Catholics kneel in church. The *only* reason Kapernick's kneeling was interpreted as an insult is because it was for racial justice.

So yes, it turned people off, but only because it was a public protest, and people didn't want to see any sort of protest.

I don’t think there’s anything wrong with it, but it’s not an approach that garners the support you need from those who see that specific issue differently. People who don’t like kneeling aren’t racist, they do miss the point, but neither NBA stars nor you or I have the the right to tell a mom who lost her child at war who feels deeply about that issue how to feel.

I do have the right to tell that Mom that kneeling is an act of respect, and ask her what it is about respecting her child's sacrifice that upsets her.
 

Ujfanatic

Active Member
It took me a while to get my mind wrapped around how much money is spent in the NBA, I was comparing the day when Karl and John were making about 10 million and less during their primes and now you get for the mid level exemption. It is just a different world now-a-days, but if I had a son I would want him to grow up and either be a baseball or a basketball player. These guys also make money outside of the game too. The money given out today is just ridiculous.
Me too. It was really bothering me for a while, but then I started thinking about how the NBA (and other professional sports) are creating multi-generational wealth for hundreds of people largely from minority backgrounds. If that money is managed well can it can provide advantages for their children and grandchildren by the thousands, to say nothing of the many charity organizations these athletes support.

So, while I do think it is too much money to play a sport, I am glad that the sport is helping the back community develop more millionaires, which for some can become billionaires.
 

oneye

Well-Known Member
2018 Award Winner
My point exactly, you are over analyzing, stalking, and making broad assumptions. Have at it though. Its not a good look for you though, but obviously you are sticking to it. Good luck!
Yes following him on social media is stalking. I really could care less what look I'm giving off lol, and yes I'm sticking to the point because several things I have said have validity.
So far, every suggestion you have offered for improvement is one that would remove the discomfort from people who supported the system being protested. It's not possible to have an effective protest you would consider to not toxic.
Nah. See when you post things like "free-ish" as a professional athlete making millions of dollars to highlight Juneteenth it doesn't resonate with people, especially during a pandemic when people are losing their jobs and you're sitting at home cashing your giant checks. The "free-ish" post may be true, but it doesn't further your message in a successful way which should be the point. Chris Paul and he both posted the "free-ish" graphic on Instagram, both got the same negative responses. Most athletes chose to post "Juneteenth" graphics highlighting the holiday and its history. Those posts were met with much friendly reactions. Why? Because one resonates and one doesn't given his situation. There are successful approaches to spread a message that actually resonate and change minds, then there are approaches yelling into your echo chamber. Making things overtly political and then saying "this isn't about politics" is another good way to lose credibility with people. Or him saying "local elections are important" and then having nothing to do with anything but the Presidential election. Politics are a good way to get half of your audience to tune you out.
Yes, very much so.
No it didn't. It turned it into a stupid kneeling debate not a racism discussion and made a big chunk of the people you need to reach just not give two ***** about anything you said beyond that.
No matter what the protest is, people who wish to avoid discussing the reason for the protest will object to the protest actions. You may have missed this somehow, but kneeling is an act of *respect*. You kneel before a monarch, you traditionally kneel when proposing, Catholics kneel in church. The *only* reason Kapernick's kneeling was interpreted as an insult is because it was for racial justice.
Here's the thing One Brow. I have no issue with kneeling, so don't lecture me on the "respect" thing. None of the other things you are referencing are done during a work environment either. It's not the only reason it was seen as an insult, it was mainly due to politicians making it political, but in the NBA's case it had already been significantly politicized at that point and the reaction from about half the country was not going to be good. Who are you convincing to be on your side with it? No one. You're yelling into your echo chamber again. Progress takes changing minds, not staying stuck with the same people who agreed with you before.
So yes, it turned people off, but only because it was a public protest, and people didn't want to see any sort of protest.
This just isn't true. There were several people I knew personally who were much more open to the discussion at hand, but didn't care to hear anymore after the kneeling.
I do have the right to tell that Mom that kneeling is an act of respect, and ask her what it is about respecting her child's sacrifice that upsets her.
No you actually don't. You have absolutely ZERO right to tell her how she should feel about kneeling during the anthem. Zero right. You have a right to feel the way you want to feel about it, but you have zero right to tell her one thing and the fact you think you do is disgusting. I don't have a right to tell athletes how to feel about kneeling either, and I don't disagree with them doing it, I just disagree that it's a resonating way to further your message on goals on racial issues. It hurts the message and tunes people out you need to change their minds. So kneel, but in regards to that, others have every right to feel how they want about it to, and if they tune out the overall message because they feel it's disrespectful thats not for you or them to decide for those people. Kneeling will do nothing but yell into the echo chamber of people who already agree, mainly due to it being majorly politicized. You need to change minds not stay stuck in place.
 
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One Brow

Well-Known Member
Nah. ... Chris Paul and he both posted the "free-ish" graphic on Instagram, both got the same negative responses. Most athletes chose to post "Juneteenth" graphics highlighting the holiday and its history. Those posts were met with much friendly reactions. Why? Because one resonates and one doesn't given his situation. There are successful approaches to spread a message that actually resonate and change minds, then there are approaches yelling into your echo chamber.

I should thank you for making my point, but I don't think you see how you did.. "Juneteenth" is about declaring freedom, and emphasizes a past event in a way that makes people comfortable, but doesn't advocate for change. "Free-ish" advocates for change, and makes people uncomfortable.

No it didn't. It turned it into a stupid kneeling debate not a racism discussion and made a big chunk of the people you need to reach just not give two ***** about anything you said beyond that.

Again, this is my point. Anything Kapernick did on the field, as a protest for racial justice, would have been made into a debate. If he had kneeled on the field after every touchdown, there would have been a debate about that. If he pointed three fingers in the air when leaving the huddle on first down, there would have been a debate about that gesture. There are many people who want to make the debate about the method of protest, not the reason for it. It's unavoidable.

Here's the thing One Brow. I have no issue with kneeling, so don't lecture me on the "respect" thing. None of the other things you are referencing are done during a work environment either.

Kneeling to a monarch is *very* often done as part for the job for that monarch's subjects. It's not unknown for priests to kneel while they are performing some of their functions. This is a made-up objection.

It's not the only reason it was seen as an insult, it was mainly due to politicians making it political, but in the NBA's case it had already been significantly politicized at that point and the reaction from about half the country was not going to be good.

Any visible protest action has been, would have be, and will be politicized in the same fashion.

This just isn't true. There were several people I knew personally who were much more open to the discussion at hand, but didn't care to hear anymore after the kneeling.

Yes, this is my point. People are fine with these discussions, as long as they are not impacted by them and they don't have to be reminded of social justice issues outside of the times they want to be.

No you actually don't. You have absolutely ZERO right to tell her how she should feel about kneeling during the anthem. Zero right.

I didn't say I had a right to tell her how to feel. I'm not surprised you would so accuse me, though. You brought up an emotionally wrought situation deliberately to try to win the argument, and then were surprised when I didn't succumb to it.

No one gets to tell anyone how to feel about an act that combines respect and a plea for social justice. However, that doesn't mean I have to accept that the reason they dislike is for the disrespect that was not shown, as opposed to the social justice they don't support.

..., I just disagree that it's a resonating way to further your message on goals on racial issues.

Goody goody gumdrops for you. Come up with a better way, use it yourself, and tell me how that goes.
 

oneye

Well-Known Member
2018 Award Winner
I should thank you for making my point, but I don't think you see how you did.. "Juneteenth" is about declaring freedom, and emphasizes a past event in a way that makes people comfortable, but doesn't advocate for change. "Free-ish" advocates for change, and makes people uncomfortable.
“free-ish” as a millionaire athlete is a good way to get yourself tuned out is what it is. It’s not uncomfortable they just roll their eyes and stop listening to every single thing you say. So good luck with that.
Again, this is my point. Anything Kapernick did on the field, as a protest for racial justice, would have been made into a debate. If he had kneeled on the field after every touchdown, there would have been a debate about that. If he pointed three fingers in the air when leaving the huddle on first down, there would have been a debate about that gesture. There are many people who want to make the debate about the method of protest, not the reason for it. It's unavoidable.
Yeah, I promise the kneeling during the anthem is the issue for a lot of people and other things would have sparked more productive conversation. You disagree, but I know plenty of people who it’s specifically the anthem kneeling that just makes them turn you off.
Kneeling to a monarch is *very* often done as part for the job for that monarch's subjects. It's not unknown for priests to kneel while they are performing some of their functions. This is a made-up objection.
And? I don’t have an issue with it lol. But other people do when it’s being done during the anthem. It’s been politicized as a “patriotism” issue. I don’t agree it’s disrespectful but many people see it as such during the anthem. Comparisons are dumb in this instance. I’m telling you the reality of it not what I think. Kneeling during the anthem has been highly politicized. We all know it, and it isn’t going to help the conversation. At all at this point.
Any visible protest action has been, would have be, and will be politicized in the same fashion.
I disagree. The anthem is specifically a patriotism issue, many see it as a disrespect to fallen and serving veterans. I would rather it just weren’t played at sporting events and believe it shouldn’t be.
Yes, this is my point. People are fine with these discussions, as long as they are not impacted by them and they don't have to be reminded of social justice issues outside of the times they want to be.
Nah, it really has little to do with the timing and more to do with the act. It’s specifically the kneeling during the anthem that makes a lot of people tune it out.
I didn't say I had a right to tell her how to feel. I'm not surprised you would so accuse me, though. You brought up an emotionally wrought situation deliberately to try to win the argument, and then were surprised when I didn't succumb to it.
What you want is for her to succumb to your definition of “disrespectful” and how you feel about it but you don’t get to decide that for other people you entitled *******.
No one gets to tell anyone how to feel about an act that combines respect and a plea for social justice. However, that doesn't mean I have to accept that the reason they dislike is for the disrespect that was not shown, as opposed to the social justice they don't support.
And you don’t get to tell someone else how to view something as “disrespectful” you entitled ***. You don’t get to define “disrespectful” in every persons eyes.
Goody goody gumdrops for you. Come up with a better way, use it yourself, and tell me how that goes.
Well, I try not to just shout into my own echo chamber cause it doesn’t change any minds. So take your gumdrops and shove them up your ***. Obama is 100% correct when he says slogans like “defund the police” sound catchy, but they lose people you need to actually make progress. You saw it in the election as well as Democrats won with a garbage old boring candidate everyone sees as moderate, and got destroyed down ballot from what was expected.
 
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One Brow

Well-Known Member
“free-ish” as a millionaire athlete is a good way to get yourself tuned out is what it is. It’s not uncomfortable they just roll their eyes and stop listening to every single thing you say. So good luck with that.

You spent most of your response reinforcing my points. Thank you.

What you want is for her to succumb to your definition of “disrespectful” and how you feel about it but you don’t get to decide that for other people you entitled *******.

And you don’t get to tell someone else how to view something as “disrespectful” you entitled ***. You don’t get to define “disrespectful” in every persons eyes.

Asking someone why they think an act is disrespectful is not forcing them to to succumb, unless their opinions are so shallow they can not withstand the slightest bit of self-introspection.

Well, I try not to just shout into my own echo chamber cause it doesn’t change any minds.

So, you advise taking no actions. That's exactly what I expected of you, and exactly my point.

So take your gumdrops and shove them up your ***. Obama is 100% correct when he says slogans like “defund the police” sound catchy, but they lose people you need to actually make progress. You saw it in the election as well as Democrats won with a garbage old boring candidate everyone sees as moderate, and got destroyed down ballot from what was expected.

Sure, some slogans are worse than others. Now, when you come up with an actual act of protest Kapernick could have taken on-field for his protest that would not have been controversial, I will believe you are serious about this. Until then, you are lying about how you feel, and much more to yourself than to I.
 

Eenie-Meenie

Well-Known Member
I didn't read every word of the Oneye / One Brow debate, but so far as kneeling, this practice to the best of my knowledge was originated by MLK. And why shouldn't black people who have been oppressed by this nation since its founding kneel in defiance of it. In a nation where free speech is our greatest right, they have every right to kneel. And if the jerks who don't know the history of oppression that this nation has enforced on black people think it's disrespectful, then they are just plain ignorant.
 

str8line

Well-Known Member
Contributor
2019 Award Winner
Yah.



So far, every suggestion you have offered for improvement is one that would remove the discomfort from people who supported the system being protested. It's not possible to have an effective protest you would consider to not toxic.



Yes, very much so.



No matter what the protest is, people who wish to avoid discussing the reason for the protest will object to the protest actions. You may have missed this somehow, but kneeling is an act of *respect*. You kneel before a monarch, you traditionally kneel when proposing, Catholics kneel in church. The *only* reason Kapernick's kneeling was interpreted as an insult is because it was for racial justice.

So yes, it turned people off, but only because it was a public protest, and people didn't want to see any sort of protest.



I do have the right to tell that Mom that kneeling is an act of respect, and ask her what it is about respecting her child's sacrifice that upsets her.


oneye and One Brow, made for each other.
 
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Engorged On Unborn Gore

Well-Known Member
all he thinks Utah is, is a backwards place thats ignorant and racist at this point, he's completely bought it at this point.
With broad strokes like this about DM, it's no surprise that you are wrong about everyone/everything else.

You never see him involved here anymore.
Do you think he's simply going to switch out stroking local Utah fanbases for similar somewhere else?

His disappointment is in the antebellum mindset that continues to thrive within his own country, he isn't hanging all of this on just Utah. You're just taking it that way because apparently you like it that way.

I have a toxic approach to this
Perhaps the only true thing you have said in this thread. The rest is an incredible gathering of self-deluded garbage.
 

infection

Well-Known Member
Staff member
2018 Award Winner
2019 Award Winner
In online discussion, there's Goodwin's law. I think there needs to be a name for when a thread reaches 10+ pages, it's invariable 2-3 people arguing back and forth about something that doesn't pertain at all to the OP. Game threads become a good example of this, but this is a pretty strong trend.
 

FAILED STATE

Well-Known Member
I think my frustration lies in the fact. He could have been a real difference here, and instead took a close minded toxic approach that did nothing but make people stop listening to important issues he could have made serious in roads on in the state. Instead of being level headed about the fact people would disagree he took a toxic approach. All Donovan’s approach is, is yelling into an echo chamber and changing no minds. Then he throws a fit or gets butthurt when things get rough or people don’t fully agree with him. He really thought getting involved in politics would have no backlash? Or pushing social justice in the way he approached it wouldn’t have some people who disagreed? And then made his approach overtly political? And now he’s just checked out as far as his feelings about being here. It’s obvious. He’s actually probably less fake than I’ve thought of him. He can’t hide his feelings of not liking it here anymore. So he probably truly did mean what he said earlier in his career of liking it here, but he has absolutely let social media comments and stuff shape the way he thinks and his opinion of being here at this point, and he doesn’t like it anymore.
You’re the lowliest version of a troll.
 

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