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say NO to EXUM. the biggest bust since darko.

Alfalfa said:
BTW, this was considered the weakest draft in a very long time. But in retrospect, it wasn't all that bad aside from the top 2.
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That’s not how I remember it. I remember 2013 being considered incredibly weak and 2014 being expected to be an all-time great draft. Hindsight has proven both those viewpoints wrong.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles...ba-draft-class-will-be-one-of-best-in-history

http://www.espn.com/nba/draft2014/i...ba-draft-incredible-depth-make-2014-best-ever
 
Alfalfa said:
1. Cleveland Cavaliers— Andrew Wiggins, Kansas

2. Milwaukee Bucks— Jabari Parker, Duke

3. Philadelphia 76ers— Joel Embiid, Kansas

4. Orlando Magic - Aaron Gordon, Arizona

5. Utah Jazz — Dante Exum, Australia

6. Boston Celtics — Marcus Smart, Oklahoma State

7. Los Angeles Lakers — Julius Randle, Kentucky

8. Sacramento Kings — Nik Stauskas, Michigan

9. Charlotte Hornets— Noah Vonleh, Indiana

10. Philadelphia 76ers — Elfrid Payton, UL Lafayette (traded to Orlando for Dario Saric and a protected 2017 1st-round pick and a 2015 2nd-round pick)

11. Denver Nuggets— Doug McDermott, Creighton (traded to Chicago for 16th and 19th picks)

12. Orlando Magic — Dario Saric, Croatia (traded to Philadelphiafor Elfrid Payton, Orlando also gives up future picks)

13. Minnesota Timberwolves — Zach LaVine, UCLA

14. Phoenix Suns — T.J. Warren, N.C. State

15. Atlanta Hawks — Adreian Payne, Michigan State

16. Chicago Bulls — Jusuf Nurkic, Bosnia (traded to Denver with 19th pick for Doug McDermott)

17. Boston Celtics — James Young, Kentucky

18. Phoenix Suns — Tyler Ennis, Syracuse

19. Chicago Bulls — Gary Harris, Michigan State (traded to Denver with 16th pick for Doug McDermott)

20. Toronto Raptors — Bruno Caboclo, Brazil

21. Oklahoma City Thunder — Mitch McGary, Michigan

22. Memphis Grizzlies — Jordan Adams, UCLA

23. Utah Jazz — Rodney Hood, Duke

24. Charlotte Hornets — Shabazz Napier, UConn (traded to Miami for 26th pick and a 2nd-round pick)

25. Houston Rockets — Clint Capela, Switzerland

26. Miami Heat — P.J. Hairston, UNC (traded to Charlotte for Shabazz Napier, Mami also gives up 2nd-round pick)

27. Phoenix Suns — Bogdan Bogdanovic, Serbia

28. Los Angeles Clippers — CJ Wilcox, Washington

29. Oklahoma City Thunder — Josh Huestis, Stanford

30. San Antonio Spurs — Kyle Anderson, UCLA

That's the first round, as listed on https://www.businessinsider.com/nba-draft-picks-list-2014-6

Probably not 15 players I'd take over Exum from the first round. But at least 7.
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There was Jokic and Dinwiddie in Second round as well.
Lets see - Embiid, Wiggins, Gordon, Smart, Randle, McDermott, Saric, Payton,Lavine, Nurkic, TJ Waren, Capella, Bogdanovic. Any of them would be upgrade over Exum.
 
MVP said:
There was Jokic and Dinwiddie in Second round as well.
Lets see - Embiid, Wiggins, Gordon, Smart, Randle, McDermott, Saric, Payton,Lavine, Nurkic, TJ Waren, Capella, Bogdanovic. Any of them would be upgrade over Exum.
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Not Payton, he sucks. Wiggins blow too. I also like Exum's "potential" better than a couple of those players. But ya, mostly agree.
 
Alfalfa said:
1. Cleveland Cavaliers— Andrew Wiggins, Kansas

2. Milwaukee Bucks— Jabari Parker, Duke

3. Philadelphia 76ers— Joel Embiid, Kansas

4. Orlando Magic - Aaron Gordon, Arizona

5. Utah Jazz — Dante Exum, Australia

6. Boston Celtics — Marcus Smart, Oklahoma State

7. Los Angeles Lakers — Julius Randle, Kentucky

8. Sacramento Kings — Nik Stauskas, Michigan

9. Charlotte Hornets— Noah Vonleh, Indiana

10. Philadelphia 76ers — Elfrid Payton, UL Lafayette (traded to Orlando for Dario Saric and a protected 2017 1st-round pick and a 2015 2nd-round pick)

11. Denver Nuggets— Doug McDermott, Creighton (traded to Chicago for 16th and 19th picks)

12. Orlando Magic — Dario Saric, Croatia (traded to Philadelphiafor Elfrid Payton, Orlando also gives up future picks)

13. Minnesota Timberwolves — Zach LaVine, UCLA

14. Phoenix Suns — T.J. Warren, N.C. State

15. Atlanta Hawks — Adreian Payne, Michigan State

16. Chicago Bulls — Jusuf Nurkic, Bosnia (traded to Denver with 19th pick for Doug McDermott)

17. Boston Celtics — James Young, Kentucky

18. Phoenix Suns — Tyler Ennis, Syracuse

19. Chicago Bulls — Gary Harris, Michigan State (traded to Denver with 16th pick for Doug McDermott)

20. Toronto Raptors — Bruno Caboclo, Brazil

21. Oklahoma City Thunder — Mitch McGary, Michigan

22. Memphis Grizzlies — Jordan Adams, UCLA

23. Utah Jazz — Rodney Hood, Duke

24. Charlotte Hornets — Shabazz Napier, UConn (traded to Miami for 26th pick and a 2nd-round pick)

25. Houston Rockets — Clint Capela, Switzerland

26. Miami Heat — P.J. Hairston, UNC (traded to Charlotte for Shabazz Napier, Mami also gives up 2nd-round pick)

27. Phoenix Suns — Bogdan Bogdanovic, Serbia

28. Los Angeles Clippers — CJ Wilcox, Washington

29. Oklahoma City Thunder — Josh Huestis, Stanford

30. San Antonio Spurs — Kyle Anderson, UCLA

That's the first round, as listed on https://www.businessinsider.com/nba-draft-picks-list-2014-6

Probably not 15 players I'd take over Exum from the first round. But at least 7.
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There is probably 15 I would rather have

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using JazzFanz mobile app
 
Alfalfa said:
Not Payton, he sucks. Wiggins blow too. I also like Exum's "potential" better than a couple of those players. But ya, mostly agree.
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Leading up to the draft, I (like most everyone else) was convinced that the Magic would take Exum. My top two hopes were Aaron Gordon or Dario Saric (who I was extremely high on at the time.) I was lukewarm on the Exum pick, but could understand taking a swing for the fences. Just disappointed that they didn’t do that with Giannis the year before. I like the kid, but I don’t see him as a star. Jazz need a star.
 
candrew said:
True. At a closer examination it became readily obvious he suffers from a serious case of "Rodney Hood - itis"

There are so many games where he gives The Magic absolutely nothing. He'll have a 25/10 game and wrap it around 3 games where he barely shows up. Good defensive teams pretty much shut him down .
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Yeah he's not very consistent, but to be fair it's hard for him because Clifford is often playing Isaac/Gordon/Vuc together and the spacing is completely awful with those three on the floor that he tends to struggle.

The thing with Gordon that really raises red flags to me is that he's the 2018 version of a tweener. About 10 years ago the tweener was that guy who was too small/not strong enough to play the 4 but wasn't fast enough or couldn't shoot well enough to play the 3, nowdays the former kind of tweener mentioned easily has a home in the small ball NBA. Gordon is a 4 who kinda fits the latter tweener description, he can't shoot well enough to truly play the 4 but he's also a bit too undersized and also simply not good enough to defend 5s for even a stretch of a game without being roasted. Makes building a team around him incredibly difficult, Blake Griffin is like a more polished version of Gordon and the Pistons are so meh it hurts because they have a similar issue. Griffin is much better as a playmaker for others/handling the ball that he can make it work to a degree even with Drummond in there, but he can't defend 5s consistently over a stretch of games and he isn't a reliable threat to shoot from the 4 spot to really make that lineup work outside of the games where he gets hot.
 
Sandman822 said:
Yeah he's not very consistent, but to be fair it's hard for him because Clifford is often playing Isaac/Gordon/Vuc together and the spacing is completely awful with those three on the floor that he tends to struggle.

The thing with Gordon that really raises red flags to me is that he's the 2018 version of a tweener. About 10 years ago the tweener was that guy who was too small/not strong enough to play the 4 but wasn't fast enough or couldn't shoot well enough to play the 3, nowdays the former kind of tweener mentioned easily has a home in the small ball NBA. Gordon is a 4 who kinda fits the latter tweener description, he can't shoot well enough to truly play the 4 but he's also a bit too undersized and also simply not good enough to defend 5s for even a stretch of a game without being roasted. Makes building a team around him incredibly difficult, Blake Griffin is like a more polished version of Gordon and the Pistons are so meh it hurts because they have a similar issue. Griffin is much better as a playmaker for others/handling the ball that he can make it work to a degree even with Drummond in there, but he can't defend 5s consistently over a stretch of games and he isn't a reliable threat to shoot from the 4 spot to really make that lineup work outside of the games where he gets hot.
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Blake Griffin almost shoots 36.4% from the three which is almost the same as Joe Ingles's percentage. That's more than enough to be a great PF in today's league.
 
Outside of Jokic, which we wouldn't have drafted because we have Gobert, there is nobody in the 2014 draft that would have pushed us into Finals contender category. I assume the FO drafted Exum because he had the highest potential out of the remaining players available. If so, Exum is still (and will always be) the right draft choice.
 
magic said:
Blake Griffin almost shoots 36.4% from the three which is almost the same as Joe Ingles's percentage. That's more than enough to be a great PF in today's league.
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I do think if Drummond wasn't there that the Pistons would be a better team since he takes a lot of space from Griffin, my point is that it's hard to build around a guy like that as they can't really play the 5. I should have mentioned that it's a lot harder to find stretch 5s who can also defend well enough compared to PFs that can play the C position like Davis where it's super easy to find a stretch 4 or a wing who can play the 4 for example, it's early morning and my coffee hasn't kicked in yet.
 
Sandman822 said:
I should have mentioned that it's a lot harder to find stretch 5s who can also defend well enough compared to PFs that can play the C position like Davis where it's super easy to find a stretch 4 or a wing who can play the 4
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You mean like Favors (looked vs. the Knicks) compared to Otto Porter?
 
idiot said:
You mean like Favors (looked vs. the Knicks) compared to Otto Porter?
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If we're talking just specifically about that Knicks game where Favs was knocking down threes then yeah, it's a lot harder to find guys like Favs than guys like Porter Jr. Fact that we need to put that qualifier on though just strengthens the general point even more.

The only consistently good stretch 5s who can also defend at a decent level that I can think of are AD, Horford, Jokic, Cousins pre-achilles, Turner, M.Gasol, maybe Embiid but his 3pt shooting is shaky, and maybe Ibaka but his %s has fallen off a cliff from deep this year. I'd also put in KAT, Vucevic and B.Lopez despite their defense being questionable but they're either so gifted offensively (KAT, Vuc to a lesser degree) or can do a particular aspect of defense well (B.Lopez has pretty elite tracking numbers for less than 6ft but gets cooked on the perimeter if he gets switched out) that I think you can put them in that list too, and there are some PFs that could potentially play C down the road (Markannen, Porzingis, etc) that would fit the mold too. All of those guys have gotten big money at some point, are still on their rookie deals, or are in line to receive a pay raise next FA they're in.
 
MVP said:
There was Jokic and Dinwiddie in Second round as well.
Lets see - Embiid, Wiggins, Gordon, Smart, Randle, McDermott, Saric, Payton,Lavine, Nurkic, TJ Waren, Capella, Bogdanovic. Any of them would be upgrade over Exum.
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You love Payton hahahaha what a joke
 
Sandman822 said:
Yeah he's not very consistent, but to be fair it's hard for him because Clifford is often playing Isaac/Gordon/Vuc together and the spacing is completely awful with those three on the floor that he tends to struggle.

The thing with Gordon that really raises red flags to me is that he's the 2018 version of a tweener. About 10 years ago the tweener was that guy who was too small/not strong enough to play the 4 but wasn't fast enough or couldn't shoot well enough to play the 3, nowdays the former kind of tweener mentioned easily has a home in the small ball NBA. Gordon is a 4 who kinda fits the latter tweener description, he can't shoot well enough to truly play the 4 but he's also a bit too undersized and also simply not good enough to defend 5s for even a stretch of a game without being roasted. Makes building a team around him incredibly difficult, Blake Griffin is like a more polished version of Gordon and the Pistons are so meh it hurts because they have a similar issue. Griffin is much better as a playmaker for others/handling the ball that he can make it work to a degree even with Drummond in there, but he can't defend 5s consistently over a stretch of games and he isn't a reliable threat to shoot from the 4 spot to really make that lineup work outside of the games where he gets hot.
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Gordon is shooting (nearly 38%) better than league average from 3 on 4.3 attempts per game.
 
Wes Mantooth said:
Gordon is shooting (nearly 38%) better than league average from 3 on 4.3 attempts per game.
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You're right, I'll admit most of the games I watched of the Magic were early in the season and checking the stats he shot like 30% from deep in October. He's definitely improved since then so I'll eat crow on that one.

edit: lol his December %s are weird as ****, he shot 41.1% from deep but he only shot 39.3% from the field and 68.4% from the line.
 
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MVP said:
Why not he is much better player than Exum. Check his influence on Pelicans record when he was out. First game back after injury, no coiincidence they won.
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lololol the great Elfrid Peyton .. who the Suns didn't want
 
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