The official "let's impeach Trump" thread

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by colton, Jul 16, 2019.

  1. Joe Bagadonuts

    Joe Bagadonuts Well-Known Member

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    I don't know why I even come round these parts either. The liberals on here are so full of themselves and holier than thou that I want to vomit. It is likely that you have followed this case more closely than I have, and I apologize if you are completely wigged out that I said "dismiss" rather than "filed a motion," but the reality is that there are legal experts who vehemently disagree with much of what you are saying in regard to this case.
     
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  2. fishonjazz

    fishonjazz Well-Known Member Contributor 2019 Award Winner 2018 Award Winner

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    Trump just being trump and doing his quid pro quo schtick again


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  3. Political Jazz Fan

    Political Jazz Fan Well-Known Member

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  4. sirkickyass

    sirkickyass Moderator Emeritus Staff Member

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    I acknowledge they are vehement. I don't acknowledge that they are anything more than hacks.

    Part of the reason I linked to Lawfare is that it's a traditionally conservative national security law policy center. They actually came out with an article (which they've stated they regret) that everyone should give Bill Barr a chance. They have a ton of expertise, and in any other political circumstances they are clearly right of center. And it's beyond obvious to them that the entire circus around Flynn is plain administration corruption and in total bad faith.

    But I follow both sides. I know that Fox News is giving air time to random tax law attorneys in Texas who will go on for twenty minutes about "unmasking" and be treated with reverential respect because they are saying the thing the hosts want to believe.

    Look man. I followed all of this stuff very closely for years. It's obvious there's whole dimensions to this that you're totally unfamiliar with (the Gulen thing for example, or what the circumstances were of Flynn's charges). Why do you believe that you're capable of discerning who's an expert in this area and who isn't? Can you tell a good legal argument from a bad one?

    Tell you what - the administration is very into selectively declassifying things these days in an attempt to make Flynn look good. Why don't they declassify the transcript of what Flynn said to Kislyak? It's not as if it's a national security secret: the Russians already know what he said and it's already public knowledge that the conversation happened. Do you think if that conversation looked good or exonerating that it would already be declassified?
     
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  5. colton

    colton All Around Nice Guy Staff Member

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    Again, why do you think he's taking it? I don't. Trump lies. Trump lies A LOT.
     
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  6. colton

    colton All Around Nice Guy Staff Member

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    Yep.
     
  7. Joe Bagadonuts

    Joe Bagadonuts Well-Known Member

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    This is one of many examples of a lawyer who I do not believe is a hack who does not agree with you on this particular case.
    https://thehill.com/opinion/crimina...-case-should-be-dismissed-to-preserve-justice
    Your political bias is obvious, so it does not surprise me that you only respect lawyers and others who agree with you.
     
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  8. sirkickyass

    sirkickyass Moderator Emeritus Staff Member

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    The one law professor they could find to testify on Trump's behalf on impeachment. Shocker that he also takes the administration position on this one. Nope, def not a hack.

    Not discussed in this article:

    1. Flynn was an unregistered agent of Russia.

    2. Flynn was an unregistered agent of Turkey

    3. Flynn did the crime (Call with Kislyak)

    4. Flynn lied when asked about it.

    5. Flynn lied to the Vice President and Sean Spicer about the call.

    What part of the evidence discussed in this article disproves any of the fundamental features of the case? What part of the legal argument in this article transforms Flynn's statements into truths? Did he lie when he plead guilty twice?

    The article is hacky because it doesn't even engage major portions of the case. It's just a laundry list recitation of Flynn's defense attorneys' filings.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2020
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  9. Joe Bagadonuts

    Joe Bagadonuts Well-Known Member

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    Among the things that you don't seem to be interested in discussing are the following:

    1. The lead FBI agent (Peter Strzok) on this case has shown himself to be highly biased politically. His personal messages make it clear that he is not merely cheering for, but steering for specific outcomes in specific cases.

    2. Calling Kislyak is not a crime (you said it was in point #3).

    3. Recently released documents make the motivations and involvement of other players in the investigation seem extremely suspicious.

    4. Flynn claims that the FBI threatened investigations into his son's affairs if he did not cooperate with Mueller. (I doubt any parent would want the FBI turning on their family members, regardless of what they had done.)

    5. Mueller recommended that Flynn serve no jail time.
     
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  10. Harambe

    Harambe Well-Known Member Contributor

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    Very nice. It's almost like I fell in the in the hole as fast as his lips dragged him across the finish line.
     
  11. sirkickyass

    sirkickyass Moderator Emeritus Staff Member

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    How does this change any of the points I outlined?

    Did Peter Strzok make Flynn be a foreign agent of Turkey and Russia? Did Peter Strzok make Flynn lie to Pence and Spicer? Did Peter Strzok make Flynn try to sell Gulen for $15 million to Erdogan?

    Move to strike for relevance.

    I don't need to get into Logan act stuff. The call is the predicate fact that is necessary for him to lie. There's no dispute he did it.

    How did anybody else make Flynn be an unregistered agent of foreign countries? How did anybody else make Flynn try to sell US foreign policy?

    Does this change that Flynn was an unregistered foreign agent of Turkey and Russia? Does it change that he lied repeatedly about his call with Kislyak?

    In exchange for a guilty plea and cooperation with the probe. What happened after that?

    It's all side streets with you buddy.

    I get that he's an important supporter of a guy you like. But dude betrayed the country. Full stop. You can't be in charge of the national security of the United states and secretly work for Turkey and Russia.
     
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  12. The Thriller

    The Thriller Well-Known Member

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    Alrighty then. Just a coincidence, I’m sure.

     
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  13. colton

    colton All Around Nice Guy Staff Member

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    *Mic drop*
     
  14. colton

    colton All Around Nice Guy Staff Member

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    Not exactly impeachable, but still. Stupidest President Ever.

     
  15. fishonjazz

    fishonjazz Well-Known Member Contributor 2019 Award Winner 2018 Award Winner

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    Lol. He doesn't understand what per capita means

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  16. colton

    colton All Around Nice Guy Staff Member

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    And tomorrow he'll announce that it was just a joke, somehow proving that he owns the libs because they thought he was serious. .
     
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  17. Red

    Red Well-Known Member

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  18. The Thriller

    The Thriller Well-Known Member

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    Yep. And his followers will fall for it. They’ll defend him. Theyll post memes and gifs. They’ll claim that he’s playing 300 dimensional chess and that any criticism of his lack of understanding is somehow playing into his hands. And Americans will continue to die due to our lack of a plan.

    Any surprise that the two epicenters of this pandemic are now the United States and Brazil? Bolsonaro claimed to want to be the “Trump” of South America. Sadly, for millions of Brazilians, looks like he’s getting his wish.
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2020 at 8:49 AM
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  19. Political Jazz Fan

    Political Jazz Fan Well-Known Member

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    Last edited: May 21, 2020 at 8:11 AM

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