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The official "let's impeach Trump" thread

Oh brother. Have you seen interest rates in banks? They often don't even keep up with inflation.
That's exactly what makes it so sad for Donnie. Even with a crappy investment plan like a savings account he could have done better.

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Exactly. I didn't hear Obama's constituents saying he was chosen by God, but I have heard Trump supporters dismiss his unethical behavior by saying God uses imperfect people to perform miracles. I didn't hear Obama calling himself 'the Chosen One', but I literally heard those words come out of Trump's mouth.

There is so much twisted logic being applied to excuse Trump's corruption, most of it in this absurdist 'well, Obama/Hilary started it' playground tone. Even if the American people as a whole were to concede in detail every accusation made against Obama/Hilary, in what world has bad behavior by past individuals been reasonable justification for current bad behavior? That doesn't fly in preschool. I guess we're supposed to give a collective shrug, accept Trump's infallibility, and just quietly go along with whatever he says and does. I can tell you this much: This thread, and the millions of other discussions happening around the world about this exact topic, aren't going to change a thing, because this is precisely where we are as a country at this point-- two camps that refuse to budge on absolutely anything, with an effectively invisible, shrinking swath of moderate folks in the middle of the whole thing. I have no idea what it means or where we're headed, but thinking about it for too long doesn't usually leave me in a positive head space.
Here is some stuff you must have missed. There's a lot more where this came from:
newsweek-cover.jpg

newsweek-cover3.jpg
 
While I haven't read every post, I think the one you're responding to is most likely poking fun at Thriller for all of his Trumpism is a cult posts. I do understand how concerning it can be to see people with different political goals than yours in power, and it's especially troubling when they find ways to accomplish their goals. So I guess it shouldn't surprise me that you were not concerned about Obama's unprecedented use of Executive Order and other methods specifically designed to circumvent congress in order to push his agenda through.

I've answered your point regarding Obama. The growth of the so-called Imperial Presidency did not begin with Trump. I don't read every post either, if I've fallen behind by a few pages.

My biggest disappointment is Trump's environmental and public land use policies. That would be unrelated to any differences in other components of his agenda, such as foreign policy. Regardless of who was in power, if he or she adopted similar environmental and land use policies, I would indeed be disappointed and opposed to such an administration.

I am also not surprised, that you, despite your oft repeated refrain about how you did not vote for Trump, and you do not like some of his "character" flaws, (you have mentioned both those things several times in the Trump threads), always nonetheless support him, no doubt because you do agree with his policies. At least you told me on at least one occasion that you support his policies.

I always found it a bit comical listening to you say at times how you wish we had better choices in 2016, while, in the same breath, being one of the strongest Trump supporters on this board. You're entitled, it's your right, but the effort to appear as if you understand why folks see character flaws in Trump is unnecessary, since you don't really mean it, IMO. IMO, it's just an effort on your part to make Trump opponents think you're sympathetic to some of their concerns. But, here's the thing: you're not, and you never have been. I suspect you add those qualifying observations of Trump sometimes just to give the appearance of having a balanced, nuanced opinion. You don't. (Yep, I'm making assumptions about you, exactly as you did about me, with your Obama observation).

You have also often spoken of what you see as an irrational level of Trump hatred. You have referenced Trump Derangement Syndrome. This might be like seeing the mote in your neighbor's eye while ignoring the beam in your own. I say this because I do believe your own chief motivation is extreme hatred of liberals. As long as Trump is able to own the liberals, you will be fine with the man, your ofttimes repeated reservations about the man's character notwithstanding.

In contrast, for some who are opposed to Trump, his character issues are not only important, they are even paramount, and they certainly are an important consideration to me as well. People who display intense hatred of liberals might consider dealing with that hate, before dissing people who have come to hate what Trump is doing to our country. I believe I have damn good reasons for opposing the man.

Just because you cannot understand the degree of opposition to Trump does not mean it is unjustified. Of this I feel certain: you will never understand that point. Never.

No, I don't like Trump at all. And I have very good reasons, having nothing to do with any derangement syndrome. On the contrary, my dislike and my opposition are based on policies that I oppose, and his efforts to render our constitutional system of checks and balances meaningless, and his efforts to continue the trend toward authoritarianism. And yes, his character as well; it soils the Oval Office. Not the first to do so, but gotta be the worst in my lifetime. He does not "love" America. He loves Trump.

And you actually think people who feel that way about Trump must actually be deranged to feel so?! Yes, you do. But you are mistaken in that judgement. I hope you understand that some day.
 
Here is some stuff you must have missed. There's a lot more where this came from:
newsweek-cover.jpg

newsweek-cover3.jpg

You posting these covers with absolutely zero context is a perfect example of my point-- thank you. This kind of thinking is exactly why the chasm between Trump supporters and everyone else can never be bridged.

I think you (purposely?) ignore the difference between what is pretty uncreative rhetoric and the literal belief by evangelical Trumpers that he is God's chosen president (and Trump's willingness to leverage that). If you care to reinforce what I'm saying, please explain from a Trump supporter's perspective why these Newsweek covers are relevant, and how they contribute to how you justify Trump's behavior.
 
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I've answered your point regarding Obama. The growth of the so-called Imperial Presidency did not begin with Trump. I don't read every post either, if I've fallen behind by a few pages.

My biggest disappointment is Trump's environmental and public land use policies. That would be unrelated to any differences in other components of his agenda, such as foreign policy. Regardless of who was in power, if he or she adopted similar environmental and land use policies, I would indeed be disappointed and opposed to such an administration.

I am also not surprised, that you, despite your oft repeated refrain about how you did not vote for Trump, and you do not like some of his "character" flaws, (you have mentioned both those things several times in the Trump threads), always nonetheless support him, no doubt because you do agree with his policies. At least you told me on at least one occasion that you support his policies.

I always found it a bit comical listening to you say at times how you wish we had better choices in 2016, while, in the same breath, being one of the strongest Trump supporters on this board. You're entitled, it's your right, but the effort to appear as if you understand why folks see character flaws in Trump is unnecessary, since you don't really mean it, IMO. IMO, it's just an effort on your part to make Trump opponents think you're sympathetic to some of their concerns. But, here's the thing: you're not, and you never have been. I suspect you add those qualifying observations of Trump sometimes just to give the appearance of having a balanced, nuanced opinion. You don't. (Yep, I'm making assumptions about you, exactly as you did about me, with your Obama observation).

You have also often spoken of what you see as an irrational level of Trump hatred. You have referenced Trump Derangement Syndrome. This might be like seeing the mote in your neighbor's eye while ignoring the beam in your own. I say this because I do believe your own chief motivation is extreme hatred of liberals. As long as Trump is able to own the liberals, you will be fine with the man, your ofttimes repeated reservations about the man's character notwithstanding.

In contrast, for some who are opposed to Trump, his character issues are not only important, they are even paramount, and they certainly are an important consideration to me as well. People who display intense hatred of liberals might consider dealing with that hate, before dissing people who have come to hate what Trump is doing to our country. I believe I have damn good reasons for opposing the man.

Just because you cannot understand the degree of opposition to Trump does not mean it is unjustified. Of this I feel certain: you will never understand that point. Never.

No, I don't like Trump at all. And I have very good reasons, having nothing to do with any derangement syndrome. On the contrary, my dislike and my opposition are based on policies that I oppose, and his efforts to render our constitutional system of checks and balances meaningless, and his efforts to continue the trend toward authoritarianism. And yes, his character as well; it soils the Oval Office. Not the first to do so, but gotta be the worst in my lifetime. He does not "love" America. He loves Trump.

And you actually think people who feel that way about Trump must actually be deranged to feel so?! Yes, you do. But you are mistaken in that judgement. I hope you understand that some day.
Even though it might not make sense to you, I do feel the way I have claimed to feel. I've been honest in our exchanges, and I believe that you have as well. I do not hate liberals, but I am definitely not a fan of many of their policies or interpretations. I don't like where political discourse has gone in my lifetime, and I do see why it upsets you for Conservatives to point to the examples that Liberals have set when justifying behavior (such as Executive Order and sexual promiscuity).

Regarding Trump Derangement Syndrome, I absolutely do believe there is a rush (almost a contest among the left) to interpret our current president in the harshest and most negative way possible. I think it might have been effective in pulling some recruits to the liberal side of the spectrum, but I also know it has opened many people's eyes to how incredibly unreliable and untrustworthy our media is. I know many people who are disgusted and unimpressed by the lies we are routinely told.

I have a lot less time to discuss this stuff than I once did. I wish you the best in life, even though we see things so differently.
 
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You posting these covers with absolutely zero context is a perfect example of my point-- thank you. This kind of thinking is exactly why the chasm between Trump supporters and everyone else can never be bridged.

I think you (purposely?) ignore the difference between what is pretty uncreative rhetoric and the literal belief by evangelical Trumpers that he is God's chosen president (and Trump's willingness to leverage that). If you care to reinforce what I'm saying, please explain from a Trump supporter's perspective why these Newsweek covers are relevant, and how they contribute to how you justify Trump's behavior.
To me this is not a discussion about justifying Trump's behavior at all. At least, I'm not trying to justify his behavior. You and Thriller and Fish (to an extent) have suggested that the admiration of Trump by some people has reached unacceptable levels. I believe that Obama enjoyed a very similar level of admiration among his loyalists (which included many media members). I think those magazine covers are proof. Can you imagine a national mainstream publication running a similar cover with Trump as the subject? I can't.
 
To me this is not a discussion about justifying Trump's behavior at all. At least, I'm not trying to justify his behavior. You and Thriller and Fish (to an extent) have suggested that the admiration of Trump by some people has reached unacceptable levels. I believe that Obama enjoyed a very similar level of admiration among his loyalists (which included many media members). I think those magazine covers are proof. Can you imagine a national mainstream publication running a similar cover with Trump as the subject? I can't.

I honestly can, assuming it's not a left-leaning periodical, imagine that happening when (not if) he is reelected this year, and it wouldn't concern me much. Like I said, these covers were just rhetoric-- not a literal statement by anyone that Obama is God-- but I don't dispute they were potentially in poor taste. That said, although they may not be in the national media, there are countless far-right and evangelical media outlets that go much further than mere rhetoric, and proclaim Trump is in fact holy, is God's elect, and is essentially incapable of error.

By the way, why you've lumped me in with Thriller I'm not sure of. My views and general stance are far more moderate than his. If you look back, you'll see you replied to a comment I made in response to Gameface, where we were talking about people who irrationally believed Obama would somehow not 'give up' the presidency after 8 years. This same group thought his supporters believed he was literally the Messiah, yet they are the same people who excuse Trump's poor ethics because they believe God made him president. I find that contradiction interesting and discouraging, when considering how we might find some middle ground and move forward as a country. Sorry we got our wires crossed.
 
Oh brother. Have you seen interest rates in banks? They often don't even keep up with inflation.
Thriller confused bank account with brokerage account. The actual argument is that if Trump had simply put the millions he received from his father into S&P 500 funds he could have ended up with twice his current wealth. The argument stems from Warren Buffett’s famous advice for low information investors, i.e., that they regularly invest what they can save into a good S&P ETF then, over the decades, watch their wealth accumulate through the miracle of compounded earnings and the unrelenting power of a corporate biased economy.
 
I've been in the Yucutan for a week so I didn't see this response. LOL at your backtracking. There were many media members and fanboys who thought that Obama was the next coming. The fact that they may have later rescinded those opinions is irrelevant to this discussion. Maybe the Trump fanboys will ultimately rescind their praise too. Will that mean they never gave it? Chris Mathews from MSNBC was so thrilled at the Obama inauguration that he peed his pants (or something tingly in those regions) and told his audience about it. How would the never Trump crowd have reacted to that?
I am not an Obama fan, but don't you understand why people were pleased that he was elected. Because it was a tacit acknowledgment that maybe the U.S. wasn't so racist after all. Is that hard to understand?

In any case he was a big disappointment because he turned out to be a shill for the establishment. Couldn't even stand up for his race when the epidemic of police shootings of unarmed blacks began. And kept us in war throughout his administration becoming a fan of drone attacks that killed many innocent people.
 
I am not an Obama fan, but don't you understand why people were pleased that he was elected. Because it was a tacit acknowledgment that maybe the U.S. wasn't so racist after all. Is that hard to understand?

In any case he was a big disappointment because he turned out to be a shill for the establishment. Couldn't even stand up for his race when the epidemic of police shootings of unarmed blacks began. And kept us in war throughout his administration becoming a fan of drone attacks that killed many innocent people.
He left single payer off the table when he first went in to discuss healthcare reform. That was the start of my disillusionment.
 
Thriller confused bank account with brokerage account. The actual argument is that if Trump had simply put the millions he received from his father into S&P 500 funds he could have ended up with twice his current wealth. The argument stems from Warren Buffett’s famous advice for low information investors, i.e., that they regularly invest what they can save into a good S&P ETF then, over the decades, watch their wealth accumulate through the miracle of compounded earnings and the unrelenting power of a corporate biased economy.
That's a pretty big error on Thriller's part. He's really so financially illiterate that he thinks you could grow wealth of that magnitude and live a lavish lifestyle including helicopters and private planes with multiple divorces by investing in a savings account?
 
That's a pretty big error on Thriller's part. He's really so financially illiterate that he thinks you could grow wealth of that magnitude and live a lavish lifestyle including helicopters and private planes with multiple divorces by investing in a savings account?
Now you’re just being a prick. He never said savings account. He said bank account. Many banks offer investment services. I clarified the type of account and detailed the argument. The point of the argument is push back against Trump’s claim to be a brilliant businessman by stating he could have generated much more wealth by simply following Warren Buffett’s advice and passively investing in an S&P 500 fund. That’s it. That’s the point Thriller was trying to make. You could have asked for clarification yourself, but you’d rather lie about what he said than get to the actual point.
 
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