The Trade Favors and Add a Replacement In Free Agency Thread

[Mission Accomplished]

Favors' age, defense, character, contract, & improving mid-range jump shot make him the 2nd most valuable player on this team. The only way he should be traded is in a blockbuster that brings in a superstar, which is unlikely (although should be considered if the right deal ever came along).

I know this is blasphemy on Jazzfanz, but the player this thread should be about is Hayward. He is one of the best 2-way players in the NBA, represents everything that this franchise stands for (with his hustle, work ethic, character, etc), & is the reason that our offense wasn't near the bottom of the league statistically last season, but he can opt-out in 2 years (when Exum projects to become a significant contributor- meaning when we project to legitimately compete) & will likely require a max contract extension under the new salary cap (which very few players will be worth even if the cap does rise to 100 mil), if he's even interested in re-signing (which I expect him to be unless we're still a lottery team, although you never know).

Unless there is any indication that he would consider signing for less than the max, which is possible, but would likely depend on us being legitimate championship contenders by then (which may prove difficult with Exum starting), I think it needs to be considered. As much as I love Hayward & what he brings to this team, I'm not sure he will be worth 20+ mil, & to lose him for nothing just as we begin to become truly competitive would set back the franchise more than Al/Sap walking did (or trading him now would). We could wait a year but his value would be significantly lower due to his opt-out clause.

Not saying we should necessarily trade Hayward, just that if we're going to have a thread about dealing one of our big three, it should be about him instead of Favors.

I'm saying trade him because he isn't one of the best two way players not even close. He is for some reason valued around the league. There are like five draft picks that could be similar players to Hayward in two years.

Look if Hayward has been our best player he isn't that great because since Jefferson and Millsap left we are lotto bound every year. If it wasn't for the emergence of Gobert we would have had another to five pick. Hayward was the player they were planning on moving for Harden. Man we missed out there and we continue to misses out by having him. Draft Stanley Johnson, Kelly Oubre, or Rondae Hollis-Jefferson pair them with Hood we don't miss a best.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Jazz are not in a position where they need to start playing Moneyball. They're young, flush with cash (cap space), elite defense, have an all NBA wing, and LOTS of talented prospects. And the #12 pick.

The Mavericks, the Cavs, and the Spurs, they have to play Moneyball. Those teams need to use a lot of fancy analytical footwork to replace statistical value and find undervalued assets and **** like that.Plus ownership is willing to put up the money required, as long as it fits DL's vision.

The Jazz just need to keep the best players they have, of whom Favors is like #2,3, or 4, depending if you value potential over production. Why would the Jazz want to just scrap him? For fun?

Do they look like the gotdamn sixers to you?

But if it's for Anthony Davis? I would trade ANYONE.

What quality free agent will come here without a starting gig available? We can use our space on other stuff I get it but it will be lower level depth guys.

Also you aren't scrapping favs for nothing... You are reallocating some if his cap space and hoping to land a star in the draft.

There are a lot if reasons I wouldn't do it but I can also see the appeal...

Also Anthony Davis is not going to become available. He's a top five player. We'd have to add so much value in addition to favs even if he did become available.

Here are the questions to consider... How many games would replacing favors with millsap cost us next year? Would we win more or less? Assume both players are healthy. Would that be a sixers move?

 

[Deleted member 848]

Ppl wanna scrap Favs cuz he can't shoot threes?!


Omg.

 

[LogGrad98]

How is favors not even close to one of the best 2 way players? How many better 6'10" 2 way players can you name?

 

[LogGrad98]

Ppl wanna scrap Favs cuz he can't shoot threes?!


Omg.

This. The whole "stretch 4" thing is so vastly over-rated it isn't funny.

 

[stitches]

Huge problem with this whole exercise is that the draft is before free agency. Utah is not traditionally big free agent destination. I don't really see any huge FAs lining up to sign with us, especially not the type of FAs at the skill-level of Favors or even close to his level. So in fact what you'd be doing is - trading Favors for a pick, before you can get his replacement in FA and before knowing if you can even get a Trevor Booker type replacement. It also sends a message to our other players and Gordon specifically - "oh, you think you have something special with that cute defense thing? You think you are close to contending and chasing playoffs? Well think again, Favors is gone, and you get this 19 year old kid, good luck with that."

I think hitting the reset button once again before we've even tried to explore how this new elite defense is going to pan out, to a huge extent dooms us to a perpetual rebuild... How good should the new 19 year old become before we decide to commit to getting better and getting into contention? Or will he become at about Favors level/or bust and then decide Hayward is not enough and send him on his way either in free agency(because he's tired of losing) or for another draft pick? Then who's the next one on the line? Rudy? At some point we have to draw the line and say - this is our core and we commit to improving the team around it. The second part of last season gave us hope that the time is now and that we have the beginning of something special, so I don't really want to hit the reset button now. I don't see any point in it.

 

[karl malone]

To Thee Jazz Fan:

He might be worth the money in 2 years, depending on how competitive we are at that point in time, but unless we are a top 4-5 seed by then, I'm not sure it's worth the risk of potentially losing him for nothing. Next season will likely have a huge impact in the direction of this franchise.

To Mission Accomplished:

If the team isn't looking like it's headed for the playoffs by the trade deadline next season, I would seriously consider trading Hayward (but only in the right deal), so as to not limit his value when he is essentially a free-agent-to-be the next year (like we handled the d-will situation so as to avoid putting ourselves in the situation that DEN did with melo). As for replacing Hayward with any of those rookies that you listed, we would miss so many beats that they'd have to put us on life support. If we miss the playoffs with a healthy & complete team (productive PG, back up C, non d-league depth) around him, then you can blame Hayward all you want, but until then, it's unfair to place the entire blame on him for missing the playoffs over the last few seasons considering the roster/circumstances.

 

[Maneesh]

Ultimately because he doesn't have a three point shot. Favors is perfect except for that one missing skill, but I think it could be a big one in DL's eyes. He wants to build a team in the SA mold.

No disrespect, but this is dumb reasoning and you certainly don't trade favors for this!!!!! So you like PFS who shoot threes at the expense of everything favors brings? Jeez.

 

[Maneesh]

Ppl wanna scrap Favs cuz he can't shoot threes?!


Omg.

Lol. I know what is this thought!!!??? I have seen something stupid like this. Well sometimes.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Huge problem with this whole exercise is that the draft is before free agency. Utah is not traditionally big free agent destination. I don't really see any huge FAs lining up to sign with us, especially not the type of FAs at the skill-level of Favors or even close to his level. So in fact what you'd be doing is - trading Favors for a pick, before you can get his replacement in FA and before knowing if you can even get a Trevor Booker type replacement. It also sends a message to our other players and Gordon specifically - "oh, you think you have something special with that cute defense thing? You think you are close to contending and chasing playoffs? Well think again, Favors is gone, and you get this 19 year old kid, good luck with that."

I think hitting the reset button once again before we've even tried to explore how this new elite defense is going to pan out, to a huge extent dooms us to a perpetual rebuild... How good should the new 19 year old become before we decide to commit to getting better and getting into contention? Or will he become at about Favors level/or bust and then decide Hayward is not enough and send him on his way either in free agency(because he's tired of losing) or for another draft pick? Then who's the next one on the line? Rudy? At some point we have to draw the line and say - this is our core and we commit to improving the team around it. The second part of last season gave us hope that the time is now and that we have the beginning of something special, so I don't really want to hit the reset button now. I don't see any point in it.

Pretty much this... I just thought it might be something interesting and divisive... Was sick of talking about whether or not Stanley Johnson or Myles Turner will fall to us and that we should max out Kwahi.

 

[Coach Ellis]

Since Utah isn't a free agency destination, the Jazz usually have to overpay to get a guy to come here (Boozer) or pickup a value free agent and have him outplay his contract (Carroll and Booker).

The Jazz can't count on anything from free agency. Losing Favors for anything less than a near All Star PF would hurt the team's development. I think he's a part of the Core players the Jazz want to build around. Let the Sixers perpetually tank. I think the Jazz should draft the best player they can get, maybe chase a free agent or two (nobody who disrupts team chemistry) and then see where they're at when they've got their Core guys all under contract and $20+ million of cap space and a TON of assets to go after that "missing piece" player to compliment the group we have or push them to a higher level.

 

[Jazz Spazz]

I'm 99.99% sure the Jazz wouldn't find a "replacement" for Favors in free agency that would be as good as he is for our team.

With Favors our team benefits of the good defense outweigh the drop in offense.

This is just my opinion, but I believe the numbers from the 2nd half of last year will back it up.

It would be silly/stupid to get rid of Favors.

 

[Coach Ellis]

The (new and improved) Core4 is pretty much set.

Gobert (over Kanter), Favors, Hayward and Exum (over Burke). They key moving forward is to surround them with AS MUCH talent as possible. They currently have Booker, Hood, Jingles, Burks and Burke who have all played big minutes. They also have some end of the bench guys, the #12, 42 and 54 picks in the draft, 14 more picks in the next 3 years, the rights to Tomic, Neto and Pleiss and between $10-12 (or more) in cap space.

Draft and develop - then make a move when the time is right. DL is doing this the right way. I don't expect that to change now.

 

[gregbroncs]

I'd consider trading Favors if I was the GM. But it had better be for a proven elite player with a lengthy contract not some dumb *** draft pick or any rental. Sorry Favors is better than Millsap by a ways. And has been for a while. I'd not trade Favors for Millsap and Porzingis because neither of them meet my criteria of an elite player. I'm ****ing sick of rebuilding and I'm not in favor of the team moving backwards.

 

[gregbroncs]

Since Utah isn't a free agency destination, the Jazz usually have to overpay to get a guy to come here (Boozer) or pickup a value free agent and have him outplay his contract (Carroll and Booker).

The Jazz can't count on anything from free agency. Losing Favors for anything less than a near All Star PF would hurt the team's development. I think he's a part of the Core players the Jazz want to build around. Let the Sixers perpetually tank. I think the Jazz should draft the best player they can get, maybe chase a free agent or two (nobody who disrupts team chemistry) and then see where they're at when they've got their Core guys all under contract and $20+ million of cap space and a TON of assets to go after that "missing piece" player to compliment the group we have or push them to a higher level.

Great post. Only part I disagree with is the near all star level remark. To trade Favors I'd need a bona fide all star or better player.

 

[framer]

Yep, we have seen Gobert play with Favors for a good half a season. Even if they were playing all time great defense together, that **** gets old after about a month. Seriously, only morons like watching soul crushing defense. We need some Antawn Jamison like dude launching it from deep up in here. It would really be cool if we got a rookie had to develop him for three years just to get to a vintage "Twannnn" level.

 

[Magic Spray]

Yep, we have seen Gobert play with Favors for a good half a season. Even if they were playing all time great defense together, that **** gets old after about a month. Seriously, only morons like watching soul crushing defense. We need some Antawn Jamison like dude launching it from deep up in here. It would really be cool if we got a rookie had to develop him for three years just to get to a vintage "Twannnn" level.

Or Shareef Abdur-Rahim or Antonio McDyess, or Al Jefferson.

 

[Magic Spray]

What quality free agent will come here without a starting gig available? We can use our space on other stuff I get it but it will be lower level depth...

Here are the questions to consider... How many games would replacing favors with millsap cost us next year? Would we win more or less? Assume both players are healthy. Would that be a sixers move?

Well, the sixers just cut bait on the rookie of the year, and they are still going to be in the ****house.

OKC tried to do this with the Harden trade. And that was a historic **** up.

In the short run replacing Favors with Millsap is probably not going to net out any more or fewer victories. But how about in 3 years when Favor will be in his mother****ing prime and Millsap's body has totally disintegrated? How clever will your scheme look then?

And yeah, no kidding Anthony Davis isn't going anywhere. Favor shoudn't either.

 

[fishonjazz]

There are a lot of caveats to saying yes, but this idea that Favors is untradable because he has a nice contract (for now) and "likes it here" is about the biggest loser **** I have ever read on this site.

I agree.

Favors is my third favorite player on the team (Rudy took the #2 spot this past season) and yes he is really good, has a good contract, and likes it here, but if the right trade comes along that improves the team you do it.

Same goes for Burks..... Even Rudy.

 

[fishonjazz]

We could clear up cap space to get a player either way. That has nothing to do with the trade. The trade is #4 pick for Favors. That is a bad trade.

Favors is a borderline all star player who is getting better every year. #4 pick is a crap shoot. Maybe if we were starting over with the rebuild then fine, get rid of older players and try your luck in the draft but we are not. We are a team hoping to make the playoffs with good young players.

I agree. Good post