Tough Day To Be In Law Enforcement

[One Brow]

You can count on One Brow to condemn the justified shooting of a rapist who was harassing his victim against a protective order, resisting arrest, endangering the lives of 3 innocent children in a vehicle, the police, and everyone around, and lunging into a vehicle for who knows what.

Who cares about the real victims here. Rape happens in nature all the time amirite.

I don't want to live in a police state. If the guy isn't directly threatening the police or anyone else, they shouldn't be shot. If Blake were arrested without being shot (I know, we wouldn't be talking about him) you would hear zero complaints from me.

To be clear, the people who fired the guns endangered the lives of the three kids, not the guy getting into the car.

The police figure out how to avoid shooting people in other European countries and still manage to keep people safe. For that matter, the police in this country can figure how to avoid shooting white people and still keep people safe.

 

[Deleted member 365]

Didn’t she get the memo? If you don’t want to be arrested, carry an AR15 around and kill some BLM supporters. Duh

 

[Archie Moses]

Man under investigation in fatal shooting of right-wing demonstrator in Portland was outside mayor’s condo night before with daughter

Michael Forest Reinoehl was seen walking around a protest outside Mayor Ted Wheeler's condo with his daughter, who was carrying a baseball bat Friday night. Sources told The Oregonian/OregonLive that police are investigating Reinoehl in connection with the death of Patriot Prayer supporter Aaron...

www.oregonlive.com

100% Antifa

 

[Archie Moses]

It's just a couple of blocks, guys.

 

[idestroyedthetoilet]

I don't want to live in a police state.

That's quite the stretch of the imagination.

If the guy isn't directly threatening the police or anyone else, they shouldn't be shot. If Blake were arrested without being shot (I know, we wouldn't be talking about him) you would hear zero complaints from me.

Dangerous, violent, disorderly, resisting arrest, lunging for something, who knows what threats he made.

The police figure out how to avoid shooting people in other European countries and still manage to keep people safe.

Discounting all other relevant factors eh Eric? Far fewer guns? Stronger social support systems decreasing crime? Less stringent jail sentences don't reduce resisting arrest? None of these have anything to do with it, is that what you are saying? Their cops are nicer, plain and simple?

For that matter, the police in this country can figure how to avoid shooting white people and still keep people safe.

Tell that to the families and friends of white people shot under similar circumstances.

Police Kill Too Many People—White and Black

It’s unclear whether bigotry plays a role

www.google.com

[/QUOTE]

 

[One Brow]

That's quite the stretch of the imagination.

If the police can shoot anyone even when they are not a threat, how much further do we need to go, in your opinion?

Dangerous, violent, disorderly, resisting arrest, lunging for something, who knows what threats he made.

So, not that different from you?

Discounting all other relevant factors eh Eric? Far fewer guns? Stronger social support systems decreasing crime? Less stringent jail sentences don't reduce resisting arrest? None of these have anything to do with it, is that what you are saying? Their cops are nicer, plain and simple?

I agree those are all factors, as well. European countries also seem to have a different police culture.

Tell that to the families and friends of white people shot under similar circumstances.

With less frequency. We both know anecdotes are not data. We also both know that police pull over, search, and arrest black people disproportionately. Do you really believe that this differential policing suddenly stops when it coming to pulling out weapons or firing weapons?

 

[idestroyedthetoilet]

If the police can shoot anyone even when they are not a threat, how much further do we need to go, in your opinion?

Agree to disagree. There's no point in disgussing this since you disregard all actions leading up to imminent danger. It used to be a simple concept to not resist arrest and reach fir an unknown weapon or object.

I agree those are all factors, as well. European countries also seem to have a different police culture.

Not even anecdotal yet, but I'll hear you out.

With less frequency. We both know anecdotes are not data. We also both know that police pull over, search, and arrest black people disproportionately. Do you really believe that this differential policing suddenly stops when it coming to pulling out weapons or firing weapons?

You are being intellectually lazy here. Because a and b, then c must be true in this circumstance.

A. This was not a potentially racially biased stop and frisk. It was a response to a plea for help. If anything, police not responding because it would skew the interaction statistics disproportionately higher would be bigoted.

B. Police do not use deadly force disproportionately against blacks than whites. I'm sure you are as surprised to find this as I was. Seeing events like the Wallmart bbgun kid being murdered make it look wholly untrue, but from the study in the link above, it is not. Here it is again for those who missed it. Pay attention to the economist and his motives going in, I think they are relevant:

Surprising New Evidence Shows Bias in Police Use of Force but Not in Shootings (Published 2016)

Contradicting conventional wisdom: When it comes to the most lethal form of force, a study finds no racial bias.

www.nytimes.com

 

[One Brow]

Agree to disagree. There's no point in disgussing this since you disregard all actions leading up to imminent danger. It used to be a simple concept to not resist arrest and reach fir an unknown weapon or object.

It was also a simple concept that the police claim to be responsible with how they use deadly force. Still you claimed that Blake was "endangering the lives of 3 innocent children in a vehicle, the police, and everyone around" not because Blake was careless with a weapon, but because the police might injure/kill other people while trying to apprehend Blake. If we don't hold the police to the standard of having to avoid hurting innocent people, I am asking again how much further it would have to go to be a police state?

For what it's worth, Wikipedia has:

A police state is a government that exercises power through the power of the police force. Originally, a police state was a state regulated by a civil administration, but since the beginning of the 20th century it has "taken on an emotional and derogatory meaning" by describing an undesirable state of living characterized by the overbearing presence of the civil authorities. The inhabitants of a police state may experience restrictions on their mobility, or on their freedom to express or communicate political or other views, which are subject to police monitoring or enforcement. Political control may be exerted by means of a secret police force that operates outside the boundaries normally imposed by a constitutional state.

Well, so far we don't have restrictions on mobility. All of our communications are subject to police and federal monitoring, and some political control is in the hands of the NSA/CIA/FBI who are in charge of this data.

Not even anecdotal yet, but I'll hear you out.

That's a long comment with a lot of research to put things together.

You are being intellectually lazy here. Because a and b, then c must be true in this circumstance.

Every circumstance is unique, and I don't what would have happened that day if the same officers were called out and a white man had acted like Blake.

So, going back to the question I actually asked you. Do you really believe that this differential policing suddenly stops when it coming to pulling out weapons or firing weapons?

B. Police do not use deadly force disproportionately against blacks than whites. I'm sure you are as surprised to find this as I was. Seeing events like the Wallmart bbgun kid being murdered make it look wholly untrue, but from the study in the link above, it is not. Here it is again for those who missed it. Pay attention to the economist and his motives going in, I think they are relevant:

Surprising New Evidence Shows Bias in Police Use of Force but Not in Shootings (Published 2016)

Contradicting conventional wisdom: When it comes to the most lethal form of force, a study finds no racial bias.

www.nytimes.com

I've read the Fryer paper before. It's relying solely on descriptions by the police to judge how evenhanded the police use of weapons is in lethal events, and even then it acknowledges that there are serious problems with their data set. Do you think that might be part of the reason their data has vastly different results for lethal force versus all other kinds of force? That doesn't even get into the motivations an officer might have for justifying lethal force as opposed to non-lethal force.

Our results have several important caveats. First, all but one data set was provided by a select group of police departments. It is possible that these departments only supplied the data because they are either enlightened or were not concerned about what the analysis would reveal. In essence, this is equivalent to analyzing labor market discrimination on a set of firms willing to supply a researcher with their Human Resources data! There may be important selection in who was willing to share their data. The Police-Public contact survey partially sidesteps this issue by including a nationally representative sample of civilians, but it does not contain data on officer-involved shootings.

 

[Red]

Man under investigation in fatal shooting of right-wing demonstrator in Portland was outside mayor’s condo night before with daughter

Michael Forest Reinoehl was seen walking around a protest outside Mayor Ted Wheeler's condo with his daughter, who was carrying a baseball bat Friday night. Sources told The Oregonian/OregonLive that police are investigating Reinoehl in connection with the death of Patriot Prayer supporter Aaron...

www.oregonlive.com

100% Antifa

That might be the very first one, if he’s self identifying as Antifa.

Trump frequently accuses the far-left of inciting violence, yet right-wing extremists have killed 329 victims in the last 25 years, while antifa members haven't killed any, according to a new study

Counter-terrorism expert Seth Jones, who helped create the dataset, told The Guardian: "Left-wing violence has not been a major terrorism threat."

www.businessinsider.com

President Donald Trump has accused far-left groups of inciting riots and violence, but in the last 25 years, no murders in the US have been linked to anti-fascists, while 329 murders have been linked to the far-right, according to new research.

Researchers at a think tank called the Center for Strategic and International Studies (CSIS) assembled a database of almost 900 politically motivated plots and attacks in the US since 1994, ending in May 2020, which was reviewed by The Guardian.

The review found that only one person's death in that period was linked to "antifa," a leaderless movement dedicated to combatting right-wing and white supremacist groups, and the person who died was the attacker.

When the review widened its category from antifa to "left-wing violence," it found 21 victims had been killed since 2010, compared to 117 people killed in right-wing violence, in the same time period. Jihadist groups were responsible for 95 people's deaths since 2010.

Anti-fascists linked to zero murders in the US in 25 years

As Trump rails against ‘far-left’ fascism, new database shows leftwing attacks have left far fewer people dead than violence by rightwing extremists

www.theguardian.com

 

[Archie Moses]

That might be the very first one, if he’s self identifying as Antifa.

Trump frequently accuses the far-left of inciting violence, yet right-wing extremists have killed 329 victims in the last 25 years, while antifa members haven't killed any, according to a new study

Counter-terrorism expert Seth Jones, who helped create the dataset, told The Guardian: "Left-wing violence has not been a major terrorism threat."

www.businessinsider.com

President Donald Trump has accused far-left groups of inciting riots and violence, but in the last 25 years, no murders in the US have been linked to anti-fascists, while 329 murders have been linked to the far-right, according to new research.

Researchers at a think tank called the Center for Strategic and International Studies (CSIS) assembled a database of almost 900 politically motivated plots and attacks in the US since 1994, ending in May 2020, which was reviewed by The Guardian.

The review found that only one person's death in that period was linked to "antifa," a leaderless movement dedicated to combatting right-wing and white supremacist groups, and the person who died was the attacker.

When the review widened its category from antifa to "left-wing violence," it found 21 victims had been killed since 2010, compared to 117 people killed in right-wing violence, in the same time period. Jihadist groups were responsible for 95 people's deaths since 2010.

Anti-fascists linked to zero murders in the US in 25 years

As Trump rails against ‘far-left’ fascism, new database shows leftwing attacks have left far fewer people dead than violence by rightwing extremists

www.theguardian.com

The whole Portland thing is a mess on so many levels. You have the Antifa rioting and the Trump supporters getting off on trying to Mr. Restore Order and shooting people with paintball guns, mace and beating the **** out of the lil sobs.

He's certainly not the first antifa member to shoot someone. I can think of plenty off the top of my head including one in Utah. That said, looks like he was sprayed with mace first and if that’s the case, just like the Kenosha shooter, according to the law, will probably get off.

I hate guns.

@Zombie better be quick to condemn me far right cause I shared a twitter post by some random Asian guy who you think is "far right.' You can apparently only forgive one "offense" lmao, Mr. RADICAL left Fascist.

 

[One Brow]

He's certainly not the first antifa member to shoot someone.

I think there have been about a half-dozen or so antifa arrested for assault, and about double that from the right-wing protesters.

@Zombie better be quick to condemn me far right cause I shared a twitter post by some random Asian guy who you think is "far right.' You can apparently only forgive one "offense" lmao, Mr. RADICAL left Fascist.

A random Asian guy or Andy Ngo?

 

[Archie Moses]

I think there have been about a half-dozen or so antifa arrested for assault, and about double that from the right-wing protesters.



A random Asian guy or Andy Ngo?

1) who cares? Both pos in my books if context proves so.

2) Not Ngo. Ask @Zombie who he is. Dude can't forgive me for posting his tweet and is convinced I'm alt right. Dude probably reads about alt right soy boys all day long and gets mad.