Trade deadline discussion
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Ive said it before but just repeating. I dont understand the love for Smart. He iisnt a good offensive player, he doesnt seem to be a good teammate, and seems to have a poor temperament. As far as defense goes he has a high motor and seems to play bigger. He is undersized besides the PG position. He doesnt really hold players hes guarding to a lower shooting number. This season he is pretty middle of the pack for his team and basically players are shooting their averages when he guards them (granted thats an improvement for a lot of our players). He is a poor 3 point shooter but he shoots a lot. He does create okay with drives and kicks but I think he would be much lower than others on our team. His net rating is never impressive and is usually middle of the pack for his team. This year for example his defensive rating is pretty low compared to his teammates. I think he has some intangibles that are positive. He just seems like such a poor fit for our team and doesnt add much to areas we need. I guess he could plug into Clarksons spot and improve defense there.
But I know I am in the minority here since most people love him. So this means we will probably get him and ill convince myself to get on board, then be disappointed later, like Clarkson.
But I know I am in the minority here since most people love him. So this means we will probably get him and ill convince myself to get on board, then be disappointed later, like Clarkson.
Smart is definitely an eye test guy, but he’s also and advanced numbers guy. They all love him and really rate his defense. He doesn’t stand out in the traditional stats but you can see how he can rate out so well when watching him. Just makes so many plays on the court and is everywhere.
I don’t think he’s undersized, he’s built like a tank and does a good job fighting against bigger players. If we matched up in a series against the Lakers, I’d rather him guard LeBron than Royce. He’d be my first choice, as he would for Steph Curry. His strength and versatility on defense is great.
I’m a fan of his personality, especially for this team. He seems to be getting Jimmy Butler exiled in Boston. Maybe he’s not a great fit around young players trying to establish themselves as scorers, but for a team that’s trying to win a championship and is sorely lacking in the toughness and effort areas he would be a welcome addition.
1. conley is better than dm and JC for sure but those 2 are just terrible defenders
2. Conley's is good for regular season. not so much in the playoffs. he was surrounded by defensive guys in memphis but how far did that team go?
3. Gobert is elite at team defense but ineffective vs elite bigs like embiid, jokic, towns even sabonis. he is still important in modern NBA.
4. i agree he regressed in defense and must improve but he is not the biggest problem.
the biggest problem is FO. we didnt address perimeter defense instead we picked up Ersan?
Which numbers are the ones that like him? I dont see much like the ones I posted, which are not traditional stats at all.
There's a rumor that the Hawks are open to trading John Collins. It would take a lot, I know, but the Jazz have to at least discuss it. He'd be a great fit with Gobert and Mitchell for the next 3 years.
The catch alls all typically like him. LEBRON, Raptor, EPM, BPM ect. Compared to Bogey, for example, he always comes out ahead.
I was going to say Smart is the defensive version of Bogey, but that might be selling him short. We shouldn’t read these numbers like gospel, but when it’s near unanimous in one player’s favor you have to think. Then you look at something general like preseason NBA rank lists and Smart is also higher.
He isnt rated very high in any of those this year or recently. Pretty average. His defense numbers arent anything special on those. Maybe comes out better than Bogey but that is a pretty low standard for defense. He seems to rank lower than Royce in all of those. On RAPTOR Smart is 71st and Royce is 65th. In the real +/- for last year Smart is ranked 119th. There isnt numbers for this year but for comparison Gobert was #1, Royce was #18, even Bojan is 63rd. Even Conley is rated higher on almost every advanced stat on both ends of the court.
I think Smart is a better defender than Mitchell, Clarkson, and Bogey. But again that is a low standard and I dont see him as much of an improvement, especially considering his poor shooting.
I will buy the eye test and him being all of the place idea though. He does have a big motor and hustles every where. I think that energy could be helpful on the team. But I think plenty of other players can give that for a much cheaper price.
I dont think he would fit next to them if you have to trade one to get him. What else would we offer that wouldnt get laughed off the phone for?
LogGrad98
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The odds are 0.000488 of flipping 12 tails in a row.
I personally love Smart. I love to watch him play and have since watching him play in college. I think you've done a good job of bringing real numbers to the table here. It's true that defensive metrics are very messy, but when all of them point to the same conclusion then it's probably good to pay attention.
I can imagine that playing with Rudy can hurt someone's defensive effort, especially those who are not predisposition to be good defenders. I wonder if Rudy would improve the defensive intensity for someone who prides themselves as a defender. I imagine Marcus Smart might feel even more free to play super aggressive knowing he has Rudy to back him up.
campaignist
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Okay, are you saying you’d swap Bogey for Smart and roll out a lineup of Conley-Mitchell-Smart-O’Neale-Gobert? Rudy is the only guy taller than 6’4” in that lineup. That is *tiny* even for the modern NBA. As much as I think Smart would help, getting even smaller as a team isn’t the best course of action.