"We're going to war, bro."

Wes Mantooth

Well-Known Member
This is for the "They hate us for for our freedoms" crowd.

okay, this dude seems like a nice enough guy. He very well may be. But let me play devil’s advocate.

What’s he crying over? That their leader is dead? I’m legitimately wondering. Because, and correct me if I’m wrong, that dude was the main strategist for a lot of their ****ed up ****. So...I’m not saying assassinating him was a good thing. There is such a thing as finesse and subtlety. And, well, laws.

But what’s this dude crying over? Wouldn’t it be like me crying over a POS like Trump? Or North Koreans crying over Doughboy?

So my point is, as cool as this cat seems, is he really so rational about it all?
 

Zombie

Well-Known Member
okay, this dude seems like a nice enough guy. He very well may be. But let me play devil’s advocate.

What’s he crying over? That their leader is dead? I’m legitimately wondering. Because, and correct me if I’m wrong, that dude was the main strategist for a lot of their ****ed up ****. So...I’m not saying assassinating him was a good thing. There is such a thing as finesse and subtlety. And, well, laws.

But what’s this dude crying over? Wouldn’t it be like me crying over a POS like Trump? Or North Koreans crying over Doughboy?

So my point is, as cool as this cat seems, is he really so rational about it all?
Well, I'm not going to pretend that I understand the psychology of the Iranian people. I know that he was widely (though not universally) regarded as a national hero. I would imagine there's an element of fear in his emotions though. Fear about what was going to happen next- a war in Iran would be much more devasting to the average Iranian than it would for those of us living here.
 

Eminence

Well-Known Member
okay, this dude seems like a nice enough guy. He very well may be. But let me play devil’s advocate.

What’s he crying over? That their leader is dead? I’m legitimately wondering. Because, and correct me if I’m wrong, that dude was the main strategist for a lot of their ****ed up ****. So...I’m not saying assassinating him was a good thing. There is such a thing as finesse and subtlety. And, well, laws.

But what’s this dude crying over? Wouldn’t it be like me crying over a POS like Trump? Or North Koreans crying over Doughboy?

So my point is, as cool as this cat seems, is he really so rational about it all?
Decent chance that dude doesn't know all that from his media/government feeding him one (and a non-zero chance it's our media/intelligence communities doing the opposite to us, though I don't suspect so in this case). Maybe he's rational about it based on the information available to him.
 

idestroyedthetoilet

Well-Known Member
okay, this dude seems like a nice enough guy. He very well may be. But let me play devil’s advocate.

What’s he crying over? That their leader is dead? I’m legitimately wondering. Because, and correct me if I’m wrong, that dude was the main strategist for a lot of their ****ed up ****. So...I’m not saying assassinating him was a good thing. There is such a thing as finesse and subtlety. And, well, laws.

But what’s this dude crying over? Wouldn’t it be like me crying over a POS like Trump? Or North Koreans crying over Doughboy?

So my point is, as cool as this cat seems, is he really so rational about it all?
Keep in mind that Iranians can't say what they believe. Most Iranian Americans seem to be celebrating:

 

Red

Well-Known Member
okay, this dude seems like a nice enough guy. He very well may be. But let me play devil’s advocate.

What’s he crying over? That their leader is dead? I’m legitimately wondering. Because, and correct me if I’m wrong, that dude was the main strategist for a lot of their ****ed up ****. So...I’m not saying assassinating him was a good thing. There is such a thing as finesse and subtlety. And, well, laws.

But what’s this dude crying over? Wouldn’t it be like me crying over a POS like Trump? Or North Koreans crying over Doughboy?

So my point is, as cool as this cat seems, is he really so rational about it all?
I recommend the BBC documentary @Zombie left a link to, to help answer that question. As the hero of the 8 year Iran-Iraq war, in which 1 million Iranians died, he'd be highly regarded by many of his countrymen in all likelihood, for that reason alone. And I'm not eulogizing the guy, but, after watching that doc., he was an impressive adversary that would command respect.
 

Wes Mantooth

Well-Known Member
I recommend the BBC documentary @Zombie left a link to, to help answer that question. As the hero of the 8 year Iran-Iraq war, in which 1 million Iranians died, he'd be highly regarded by many of his countrymen in all likelihood, for that reason alone. And I'm not eulogizing the guy, but, after watching that doc., he was an impressive adversary that would command respect.
like Rommel.
 

Red

Well-Known Member
like Rommel.
I'm not sure what general from history to compare him to, but one thing I came away with from that documentary is it's hard to believe Iran's response was as "muted" as it was, given everything that guy has meant to furthering the power of Iran throughout the region. I know it's always next man up, and so it will be, but this guy was revered (by the opposite of the Sunni Muslims, the censor won't let me spell out the other branch of Islam, lol), and it's no wonder there were millions at his funeral.

He was revered by the She-ites. There, lol.
 
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Red

Well-Known Member
Lmao. Maybe something good will come out of this after all


Yeah, Senator Lee was great. Don't debate the administration's actions toward Iran. Right. He should be pissed. We should all be pissed at crap like that.

 

The Thriller

Well-Known Member
I'm not sure what general from history to compare him to, but one thing I came away with from that documentary is it's hard to believe Iran's response was as "muted" as it was, given everything that guy has meant to furthering the power of Iran throughout the region. I know it's always next man up, and so it will be, but this guy was revered (by the opposite of the Sunni Muslims, the censor won't let me spell out the other branch of Islam, lol), and it's no wonder there were millions at his funeral.

He was revered by the She-ites. There, lol.
It’s difficult to compare because he wasn’t ever the supreme leader, philosophical thinker, or independence fighter. But if you believe the United States Robbed your country of sovereignty in 1953 and felt like the 1979 revolution was a restoration of Iranian sovereignty, then I think some comparisons would be:

Ho Chi Minh
Ahmad Shah Massoud

I think people are trying to place him in the “good” or “bad” box. The truth is Much more mixed. Just as our history has been in that region. We were wrong to overrule their democracy in 1953. We were wrong to support the Shah. He ran a murderous and authoritarian regime until he was ousted in 1979. We gave him refuge instead of letting Iranians bring him to justice. If your family had been illegally arrested and secretly executed by the Shah, you’d probably welcome the 79 revolution and view Soleimani as a hero.

We supported Saddam Hussein in his war with Iran. Why don’t Americans ever critique our leadership over that? Using the same logic we’re using on Soleimani, was reagan good or evil? Was the United States in the wrong using Iraq as a proxy against the Soviet backed Iran?

Soleimani is viewed as a nationalist hero. Clearly, his own history is more complicated then that. True, he planned attacks on American allies and forces. He also planned against American Enemies, like ISIS. At the end of the day I think we need to agree that Soleimani’s history, like our own, is a mixed bag.
 

The Thriller

Well-Known Member
Yeah, Senator Lee was great. Don't debate the administration's actions toward Iran. Right. He should be pissed. We should all be pissed at crap like that.

Senate republicans miffed that this administration would dare treat them like doormats have only themselves to blame. Maybe if they hadn’t just rubber stamped everything Donald wanted for the past 3 years this administration would show then more respect?

Want respect? Earn it Senate repubs.
 

Red

Well-Known Member
This is just another version of the Right's favorite battle cry, on the domestic front, during the entire Vietnam era: "America, love it or leave it"!! Never mind "We the People" are the foundation of this republic. The Right's interpretation of that is apparently "WE are the people. The rest of you STFU".
 

The Thriller

Well-Known Member
It’s almost like all those complaints about the debt, the president abusing power, and the constitution over 8 years were insincere:


Republicans more and more seem like they’d prefer a dictatorship over a constitutional democracy.
 

Jazzta

Guest
That BBC documentary is a must watch, it was very insightful and solidifies my position about the inconsistencies of US foreign policy in the Middle East. Thug life moment at the 26:15 mark, the man walks along unfazed after a huge explosion goes off right next to him.
 
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