What Happened to Katie?

[Stoked]

I am pleased to see that the board has come so far on this issue over what is really just a few years.

It's easy to forget now but the sentiment against Katie was very strong for a long period of time, mostly on the basis of "shut up about it already" for someone that was clearly going through some stuff. There was a brief moment when I was so upset over the issue that I turned in my moderator resignation. [MENTION=1]Jason[/MENTION] and [MENTION=14]colton[/MENTION] stepped up to the plate and took affirmative steps to make it better and I stayed on for something like six more years.

Everyone has a long way to go, but there's legitimate reason to suspect that if the tide has turned this dramatically on a Utah sports based message board then this will move closer and closer to becoming a non-issue over the next ten years.

I think in general it will be. But as with any issue there will be those that refuse to move on the issue.

 

[JimLes]

Your grandmother's cousin was a stud.

He was a product of his circumstances and his time. A tough man in tough times. I certainly don't wish for them to come back.

 

[Boris]

I think in general it will be. But as with any issue there will be those that refuse to move on the issue.

Why is not any body addressing the fact that this is a psychological condition in need of help? It is all oh feel bad feel bad for the depressed poor soul with trauma issues. Yeah I get that yet why are we not addressing the deeper issue as a community to lend help?

 

[JazzGal]

Why is not any body addressing the fact that this is a psychological condition in need of help? It is all oh feel bad feel bad for the depressed poor soul with trauma issues. Yeah I get that yet why are we not addressing the deeper issue as a community to lend help?

I'm not convinced that it is a psychological issue. I do not remember the day that I picked my sexual orientation or my gender identity. I was told that I was supposed to like boys and that I was a girl, and I felt those things were true. No conflict for me.

But what if the things you are being told do not feel right to you? If gender identity only occurred in adults, I might consider that their life experiences may have colored their self-perception. But there have been so many really young children that insist that they are not the gender they are told they are (and never vary from it) that I do not believe that it is psychological. Perhaps it is for some, but I would be hesitant to make that determination about anyone.

 

[JimLes]

Why is not any body addressing the fact that this is a psychological condition in need of help? It is all oh feel bad feel bad for the depressed poor soul with trauma issues. Yeah I get that yet why are we not addressing the deeper issue as a community to lend help?

Electroshock therapy? That ought to set them straight.

 

[Boris]

I'm not convinced that it is a psychological issue. I do not remember the day that I picked my sexual orientation or my gender identity. I was told that I was supposed to like boys and that I was a girl, and I felt those things were true. No conflict for me.

But what if the things you are being told do not feel right to you? If gender identity only occurred in adults, I might consider that their life experiences may have colored their self-perception. But there have been so many really young children that insist that they are not the gender they are told they are (and never vary from it) that I do not believe that it is psychological. Perhaps it is for some, but I would be hesitant to make that determination about anyone.

I am not 100% either. I am 100% certain the American Psychological Association is 49/51 split on this issue. Your situation sounds difficult. You are discussing the straight gay spectrum not the the transgender condition. Straight or gay is a spectrum.

Electroshock therapy? That ought to set them straight.

Oh good a nother anti-LDS poster in jazzland. Yes we tried that in the 1960s. Dude for a guy claiming tolerance and historical context this is a low blow. Want to make a polygamy joke next?

 

[JimLes]

Oh good a nother anti-LDS poster in jazzland. Yes we tried that in the 1960s. Dude for a guy claiming tolerance and historical context this is a low blow. Want to make a polygamy joke next?

Yes, that's totally what I was going for. Not making a reference to the well known fact that the general medical field treated all kinds of stuff with electroshock therapy. No, I'm instead taking a dig at some obscure part of Mormon history. Because as a heathen who does not know a single Mormon, I am super familiar with minutiae of Mormon history.

 

[Boris]

Yes, that's totally what I was going for. Not making a reference to the well known fact that the general medical field treated all kinds of stuff with electroshock therapy. No, I'm instead taking a dig at some obscure part of Mormon history. Because as a heathen who does not know a single Mormon, I am super familiar with minutiae of Mormon history.

U claim to not to know yet your quick response acknowledging the history indicted u. Now get back on point about the fact it might well be a serious psychological disorder that your medical field fails to recognize for legal repercussion reasons.

 

[Gameface]

I am not 100% either. I am 100% certain the American Psychological Association is 49/51 split on this issue. Your situation sounds difficult. You are discussing the straight gay spectrum not the the transgender condition. Straight or gay is a spectrum.



Oh good a nother anti-LDS poster in jazzland. Yes we tried that in the 1960s. Dude for a guy claiming tolerance and historical context this is a low blow. Want to make a polygamy joke next?

Electroshock therapy is used today and it can be amazingly effective in treating extreme depression.

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

He was a product of his circumstances and his time. A tough man in tough times. I certainly don't wish for them to come back.

So if times get better it's a requirement that we turn into a bunch of pansies? God help us all if times get any better because people seem to be losing their minds as it is. (Not saying there is a God, BTW, so don't get your undies in a bunch over that, ya pansies.)

 

[Scat]

So if times get better it's a requirement that we turn into a bunch of pansies? God help us all if times get any better because people seem to be losing their minds as it is. (Not saying there is a God, BTW, so don't get your undies in a bunch over that, ya pansies.)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h1BQPV-iCkU

 

[JimLes]

So if times get better it's a requirement that we turn into a bunch of pansies?

Well, yes. Get with the times, as they say. My life is infinitely better than that of my grandparents or great-grandparents, and as a result, I don't need to be as "tough" as them. Actually, it'd be stupid for me to be as tough as them. I don't work through severe cuts or let them get infected. I see a doctor. I don't walk for 2 days to testify in a minor trial like my great-grandma did because I have a car. I haven't fought in a war because my parents made the awesome choice to move to Canada. Surely these are all good things.

My ancestors weren't tough for toughness sake. They were tough because they had to be. My grandfather was born a subsistence farmer's son. He didn't own a pair of shoes until he was 14 or 15. He got married at 19 and was drafted into a German satellite army by the time he was 20. Before he would've been old enough to drink in current USA, he had deserted that army to go join a rag-tag bunch of rebels in the forest. He went to law school at 36. His life became infinitely better and easier. And yes, he became less tough. I remember him as an old man watching cartoons with me and teaching me how to do crossword puzzles. He was no Clint Eastwood in Gran Torino, but I don't think he felt bad about becoming "a pansy."