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What upgrades are needed to make us a contender?

Engorged On Unborn Gore said:
Anyone have the text for this article?
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What will Danny do?
No team has surprised quite like Utah so far, but the question remains whether Jazz CEO Danny Ainge will let the good times roll or break up his band by trading players such as Mike Conley, Jordan Clarkson, (All-Star hopeful) Lauri Markkanen and others who are sure to inspire significant interest from (other) playoff-bound teams.

As much fun as these Jazz have been having, there’s an undeniable ceiling with this group that, in the eyes of the Jazz decision makers, falls well short of title contention. That internal view should surprise no one.

So, what will Danny do?

If past is prologue, as they say, then it’s time for an Ainge history lesson that may very well inform what’s to come.

Long before Ainge headed to Salt Lake City to run the Jazz in December 2021, he was the longtime Boston Celtics executive whose championship vision came true because, well, his draft dreams had not. It was draft lottery night in 2007, not long after Boston’s injury-riddled season had so mercifully ended with a 24-58 record that the Celtics hoped would lead to them landing Texas’ Kevin Durant.

The Celtics had a 19.9 percent chance of landing the top pick back then, but even No. 2 would have likely sufficed considering Ohio State’s Greg Oden was most teams’ top selection. But when then-deputy commissioner Silver read the results of the fifth pick, pulling that not-so-lucky Leprechaun card out of the envelope while the camera panned to a dejected Tommy Heinsohn in the Celtics representative seat, Silver’s reaction said it all.

“Wow,” he can be heard saying on the telecast.

What seemed like a brutal twist in lottery fate, however, was actually the beginning of Boston’s return to the NBA’s mountaintop.

On draft night a month later, Ainge would use that No. 5 pick (along with Delonte West and Wally Szczerbiak) to land Ray Allen in a deal with Seattle and give Paul Pierce the co-star he so badly needed. And then came the move that formed Boston’s vaunted big three, the late July trade with Minnesota for Kevin Garnett that would lead to their 2008 championship and a five-year window of title contention.

Yet as it relates to Ainge’s experiences, even the breakup of Boston’s big three is informative when it comes to these Jazz. By sending Pierce and Garnett to Brooklyn in 2013 in the deal that netted him three first-round picks and a pick swap, Ainge was betting on Brooklyn taking a downturn in the not-so-distant future and the Celtics reaping the rewards. His plan worked to near perfection, with the Celtics taking Jaylen Brown third overall with the Nets’ pick in 2016 and Jayson Tatum third overall with another Nets pick a year later.

As a relevant aside, let’s not forget the same Celtics franchise that has won 17 titles in all (tied with the Lakers for the league lead) has never had a No. 1 pick. Ainge did trade the No. 1 in 2017 to Philadelphia in exchange for No. 3, which turned into Tatum, and another first that landed them Romeo Langford in 2019. Going even farther back, the Celtics did quite well by trading the No. 1 pick to Golden State in 1980 too. They landed Robert Parish from the Warriors and then used the No. 3 pick to add Kevin McHale. So if you’re Ainge, and you’ve spent most of your basketball life thriving with said franchise, that alone might be enough to convince you that roster-building is far more complicated than, say, “Brick for Vic.”

None of which is to say Ainge won’t make a flurry of trades before the February trade deadline. As one source with knowledge of the Jazz’s strategy put it, they will be taking an “opportunistic” approach to the months ahead. But the combination of Ainge’s competitive fabric and his personal history, it seems, has left him unconvinced that an all-out race to the bottom is the way to go.

Front-office executive No. 1

“I think Danny won’t break it all the way down. I could see him keeping a guy like Markkanen, and (there’s a sense) that he doesn’t have the stomach for a true rebuild. That might be one team that doesn’t make moves to go that direction because Danny doesn’t believe in it.”

Front-office executive No. 6

“Utah has to trade multiple guys (to tank), but they still might do that. And the second they do those things, then the bottom falls out. The (Bojan) Bogdanović trade (with Detroit, in which the Jazz received veteran big man Kelly Olynyk, guard Saben Lee and cash) made them better. Olynk is a better player than Bogdanović, and he was at a position of need for them. So I think people saw the deals and didn’t really analyze them. (But) they got back (Jarred) Vanderbilt for Gobert (in the blockbuster trade between Utah and Minnesota), and he’s a winning player. And they got back Lauri Markkanen for Mitchell (in the blockbuster trade with Cleveland), and he’s a winning player. So their trades weren’t trades just for picks, and it wasn’t even for just picks and young guys. And they’re playing those (veteran) guys. They could have cut (guys) — especially Vanderbilt. They could have just cut him, but they’re not. So if you really look at what they’re doing, they’re not trying to tank yet. But they might. I would bet if somebody offered them a first (-round pick) for all of their players, they would say yes, yes, yes and yes. And now, all of a sudden, they’d be really bad.”

Front-office executive No. 4

“Utah has generally been open for business. I do think they’re the one that could accelerate taking it apart faster. But you’ve got to have the buyers in the market. And outside of the Lakers, who is that?”
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I guess Danny will wait and see. We can use our pick to buy or if we slow down, start to tank after ASB. But i don't see this happen. We wil just try to win as much as possible and see where we are.
 
slc said:
Not sure about a Conley for Kawhi trade
Conley right now might be Jazz MVP
Without him Jazz might be sub 500
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Well it wouldn't be jazz without conley. It would jazz without conley but with a nba finals mvp caliber player which may just be an upgrade.
 
whatthe said:
Kyle Kuzma instead of Rudy Gay. Score pass and finish. He would be great off the bench.
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Sure, I’ve always liked Kuzma. But he starts and plays big minutes for the Wizards and makes about seven more a year which makes a possible deal problematic regarding player salary match and costly regarding draft assets.
 
Bodhi said:
I subscribe and read it. It’s just some fluff from a few GM’s giving generic opinions. You’re not missing much with that one.

But subscribe to catch @Tony Jones articles.

;)
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The part where a league exec says we could have waived Vando was weird… why waive a guy that has clear trade value. That exec may want to update his resume.
 
hgb said:
An MVP in street clothes, though.
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Of course if you read my post i put in the stipulation that he is healthy. If he continues to be in street clothes then i wouldnt want the jazz too trade for him.


Sent from my iPad using JazzFanz mobile app
 
Kawhi makes double what Conley makes and there is zero shot the Clippers even have a meeting about that trade.

Any Conley to the Clippers deal is for Morris or Kennard plus salary filler. I’m not interested in either one of those options. I would love to get Morris but not for Conley.
 
Elizah Huge said:
Kawhi makes double what Conley makes and there is zero shot the Clippers even have a meeting about that trade.

Any Conley to the Clippers deal is for Morris or Kennard plus salary filler. I’m not interested in either one of those options. I would love to get Morris but not for Conley.
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If we could swap Gay and something something for Morris that would be a real win. We could use some of that nasty, and he has the skillset to really complement our team right now.
 
LogGrad98 said:
If we could swap Gay and something something for Morris that would be a real win. We could use some of that nasty, and he has the skillset to really complement our team right now.
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I would love that but not sure why the Clippers do that unless the second piece is worth it to them.

One Gay trade I have thought of is just a straight swap for Crowder with Phoenix. Why does Phoenix do it? Well, they save 3.9M this year and they get a player who will actually play for them.

Why do we do it? We could use a player like Crowder and I feel like he would fit into our new system well. I don’t like the drama from the off-season but he’s another one of Ainge’s guys like Olynyk and he’s played here before so it could work out.

I’m not the biggest Crowder fan but for the price of Gay I would absolutely kick the tires on that.
 
Elizah Huge said:
I would love that but not sure why the Clippers do that unless the second piece is worth it to them.

One Gay trade I have thought of is just a straight swap for Crowder with Phoenix. Why does Phoenix do it? Well, they save 3.9M this year and they get a player who will actually play for them.

Why do we do it? We could use a player like Crowder and I feel like he would fit into our new system well. I don’t like the drama from the off-season but he’s another one of Ainge’s guys like Olynyk and he’s played here before so it could work out.

I’m not the biggest Crowder fan but for the price of Gay I would absolutely kick the tires on that.
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Yeah Gay for Morris is a long shot and depends on the "something something" part, but we don't want to give up too much. Maybe something could entice them, who knows,

I would take Gay for Crowder trade straight up. Actually I can't see why this isn't a real topic of conversation right now as it makes sense for both sides really.

@Tony Jones any info on a possible trade to move Gay, any rumblings going on?
 
I’m not sure this squad can really “contend” but if Lauri is for real and the other guys don’t age out too quickly having a SGA or Booker type draft win would propel this team forward… I don’t think there is a love to push in the chips that get us “the guy” type of move but if there is an opportunity to sneak in and steal a player there is more upside that is untapped like we did with Lauri then jump on it… don’t think it makes us a contender still though… we are more than 1 great move away.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I’m not sure this squad can really “contend” but if Lauri is for real and the other guys don’t age out too quickly having a SGA or Booker type draft win would propel this team forward… I don’t think there is a love to push in the chips that get us “the guy” type of move but if there is an opportunity to sneak in and steal a player there is more upside that is untapped like we did with Lauri then jump on it… don’t think it makes us a contender still though… we are more than 1 great move away.
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We don’t want this negativity and non-sense around here right now. I’m all seriousness I think someone like PJ Washington is who we should target. Another guy who fits that mold is Rui Hachimura.
 
fishonjazz said:
Of course if you read my post i put in the stipulation that he is healthy. If he continues to be in street clothes then i wouldnt want the jazz too trade for him.


Sent from my iPad using JazzFanz mobile app
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Yeah, true, but if, say, we could make that trade start of the season, thinking Kawhi might be back playing 75% of the games starting Dec, we'd probably be way behind by then.
Would we trade healthy Kawhi for Mike straight up? Yes.
 
Elizah Huge said:
We don’t want this negativity and non-sense around here right now. I’m all seriousness I think someone like PJ Washington is who we should target. Another guy who fits that mold is Rui Hachimura.
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Don’t they both have basketball iq’s of rocks? I’ve heard that criticism of both of them before.
 
hgb said:
Yeah, true, but if, say, we could make that trade start of the season, thinking Kawhi might be back playing 75% of the games starting Dec, we'd probably be way behind by then.
Would we trade healthy Kawhi for Mike straight up? Yes.
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I say if Clippers would agree to that trade (or any trade for him), then we would know for sure Kawhi is not gonna be the same guy again. There is no way they would give up a player who was considered as maybe the best player in basketball if they thought he can get back to that form.

At this point no one knows what will happen. Doctors said he should be fully healed, but he isnt. Will he ever be?
 
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