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Will Donovan Mitchell surpass Stockton/Malone careers with the Jazz?

Will Donovan Mitchell surpass Stockton/Malone's career with the Jazz?

  • Yes

    Votes: 25 46.3%

  • No

    Votes: 29 53.7%
  • Total voters
    54
Tom Pitt said:
He's got to win a title. If he wins a title he passes them if he doesn't win one he cant pass them because the records they set are all time great. Malone 2 MVP's and 2nd all time in scoring and Stockton All time leader in 2 of the 5 main statistical categories.
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Just because he wins a title doesn’t mean he’s better


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I think the following would need to occur for Mitchell to be viewed as surpassing Stockton and Malone (not necessarily in order of importance):

1) Longevity with the franchise. At least 10 years, and ending his career here is best.
2) Popularity. He is already mostly on par with Stock and Malone, and ahead of them in this regard in lots of ways. He is far more likable than either Stock or Malone really ever were. Stock was too stoic, Malone too, idk, full of himself maybe? Malone was at least an entertaining interview, Stock was a good all around guy that just didn't say much. Mitchell has that positive outlook and cares about the community and that goes a long way.
3) High level of personal performance. Not expecting him to beat the stats that Stock and Malone put up, both of Stock's records are going to be damn near impossible to repeat let along beat, and it is a bit much to ask for Mitchell to be the 2nd leading scorer in league history. But he need to put up solid numbers across the board, and do it consistently. A consistent 22 ppg, maybe higher (Malone averaged 25 ppg for this career), 4 asst, 4 boards, 2 steals, etc. This is a combination of single game/single season/career stats.
4) Win - regular season. Has to carry us to multiple winning seasons, threatening the top teams in the league for regular season wins. Needs to top 60 wins a few times.
5) Win - playoffs. Has to lead the team to multiple playoff appearances, with many series wins. Needs to make the conference finals a few times. Needs to be the decisive playoff leader in this pursuit. Good news is he has one season of this under his belt already.
6) Win - championship? If he wins one, and that is all he does, say in year 5, and has #2 on this list wrapped up, and the very next year bolts for another super-team, where would he fall? Would the ring be enough to surpass Stock and Malone? Personally I don't think so. It puts him solidly in 3rd place on the all-time Jazz list with this achievement alone, but he needs a couple more on this list to really surpass the statues and get his own. It would be enough to get a jersey retired definitely, but not a statue.

So right now, in comparison to Stock and Malone, I give him this rating, point by point on the list above:

Completely arbitrary rating scale:
-3 = solidly behind stock and malone
-1 = gaining ground, pretty close, but still behind
0 = on par or not applicable (yet)
+1 = a bit ahead
+3 = well ahead of the statues

#1: -3
#2: 0
#3: -3
#4: -1 (giving him credit for nearly single-handedly turning around what should have been one of our worst seasons)
#5: -3
#6: 0

Total score = -10

Score needed to match Malone and Stockton = -2 to 3
Score needed to "surpass" Malone and Stockton (probably enough for the statue) = 6-12 (and no more than 1 negative category, 0 is ok)
Score needed to become the Jazz Legend of ancient mythology = 15+ (no negative categories, no more than 1 @ 0)


(scores of 4, 5, 13, and 14 are somewhat ambiguous depending on the number of negative categories)
 
Tom Pitt said:
He's got to win a title. If he wins a title he passes them if he doesn't win one he cant pass them because the records they set are all time great. Malone 2 MVP's and 2nd all time in scoring and Stockton All time leader in 2 of the 5 main statistical categories.
Click to expand...
If he wins a title, he certainly will have an aspect to him that the franchise has never seen obviously. Donovan/Rudy holding an NBA title doesn't mean Stockton and Malone aren't two all time greats that set records that will likely not be touched and did things very few players do. I think Donovan has a chance to be really, really, really special in so many more ways than one. Donovan is someone that the longer he's here, if he stays the guy he is, is going to be one of if not the most loved public figures ever in the state. Because after just one year, when you think he's kind of impressed you the most he can, he does something else.

If Donovan stays with the franchise for over 10 years, or even his career, takes the Jazz to a finals a couple times, possibly wins a title, and continues to wrap the Jazz fan base and community around his finger by just being himself, while also growing the Jazz brand and his brand to a worldwide level like no other player here, that's a part of it. I'm not even sure he has to win the title. Idk what his career from here looks like, I just know what he's done in one year, and it is impressive beyond any first year that has ever been played for this franchise, both in the community and on the court. I do like hearing things like he said at his camp, and he's said several times that "I plan on being here a long time". We will see, but if he is here a long time, I gotta say, I don't really doubt what lies ahead with Donovan. He was built for greatness in every way. The absolute only thing that could curtail whats ahead with him is some injury. Knock on wood that never happens.
 
Last edited:
Thee jazz fan said:
IMO, if you take out Mitchell and Gobert and add Stockton and Malone in their prime, we win titles


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Stockton and Malone wee stuck on some pretty watered down rosters. Imagine Favors next to Malone or Stockton playing off of Ingles


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LogGrad98 said:
6) Win - championship? If he wins one, and that is all he does, say in year 5, and has #2 on this list wrapped up, and the very next year bolts for another super-team, where would he fall? Would the ring be enough to surpass Stock and Malone? Personally I don't think so. It puts him solidly in 3rd place on the all-time Jazz list with this achievement alone, but he needs a couple more on this list to really surpass the statues and get his own. It would be enough to get a jersey retired definitely, but not a statue.
Click to expand...

Agreed, I may put Rudy above him if it played out like that.
 
Thee jazz fan said:
IMO, if you take out Mitchell and Gobert and add Stockton and Malone in their prime, we win titles


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How about rook Stock and Malone yr 5 for DM and Gobert? That seems more fair than replacing players before their prime with prime versions of all time great players.
 
Seems like a good place to put this picture.

DY1xv35XkAAza6o.jpg
 
3813 combined games for the Jazz by the three legends in that picture. Out of 3874 possible, by the way. That's right, the three players in the picture missed 61 combined games in 47 seasons they gave the Jazz. 98.4% participation rate. Also:

2 MVP awards
1 DPOY award
23 All-Star games
#1 all-time in assists
#1 and #10 all-time in steals
#2 all-time in points
#5 all-time in blocks
#7 all-time in rebounds
...and many, many other records and accomplishments.

I'm getting teary eyed just talking about it. Donovan should spend as much time as possible around those 3 and that older, fourth guy. Learn by osmosis.
 
And we never had to worry about them leaving. Malone did have that one offseason where he lost his mind, lol but never worried, knew he was blowing off steam
 
LogGrad98 said:
I think the following would need to occur for Mitchell to be viewed as surpassing Stockton and Malone (not necessarily in order of importance):

1) Longevity with the franchise. At least 10 years, and ending his career here is best.
2) Popularity. He is already mostly on par with Stock and Malone, and ahead of them in this regard in lots of ways. He is far more likable than either Stock or Malone really ever were. Stock was too stoic, Malone too, idk, full of himself maybe? Malone was at least an entertaining interview, Stock was a good all around guy that just didn't say much. Mitchell has that positive outlook and cares about the community and that goes a long way.
3) High level of personal performance. Not expecting him to beat the stats that Stock and Malone put up, both of Stock's records are going to be damn near impossible to repeat let along beat, and it is a bit much to ask for Mitchell to be the 2nd leading scorer in league history. But he need to put up solid numbers across the board, and do it consistently. A consistent 22 ppg, maybe higher (Malone averaged 25 ppg for this career), 4 asst, 4 boards, 2 steals, etc. This is a combination of single game/single season/career stats.
4) Win - regular season. Has to carry us to multiple winning seasons, threatening the top teams in the league for regular season wins. Needs to top 60 wins a few times.
5) Win - playoffs. Has to lead the team to multiple playoff appearances, with many series wins. Needs to make the conference finals a few times. Needs to be the decisive playoff leader in this pursuit. Good news is he has one season of this under his belt already.
6) Win - championship? If he wins one, and that is all he does, say in year 5, and has #2 on this list wrapped up, and the very next year bolts for another super-team, where would he fall? Would the ring be enough to surpass Stock and Malone? Personally I don't think so. It puts him solidly in 3rd place on the all-time Jazz list with this achievement alone, but he needs a couple more on this list to really surpass the statues and get his own. It would be enough to get a jersey retired definitely, but not a statue.

So right now, in comparison to Stock and Malone, I give him this rating, point by point on the list above:

Completely arbitrary rating scale:
-3 = solidly behind stock and malone
-1 = gaining ground, pretty close, but still behind
0 = on par or not applicable (yet)
+1 = a bit ahead
+3 = well ahead of the statues

#1: -3
#2: 0
#3: -3
#4: -1 (giving him credit for nearly single-handedly turning around what should have been one of our worst seasons)
#5: -3
#6: 0

Total score = -10

Score needed to match Malone and Stockton = -2 to 3
Score needed to "surpass" Malone and Stockton (probably enough for the statue) = 6-12 (and no more than 1 negative category, 0 is ok)
Score needed to become the Jazz Legend of ancient mythology = 15+ (no negative categories, no more than 1 @ 0)


(scores of 4, 5, 13, and 14 are somewhat ambiguous depending on the number of negative categories)
Click to expand...


You're talking a Dwyane Wade, maybe Wade-lite with better 3 point shot, slightly fewer assists and FTA's. That's unbelievably a realistic projection. Unbelievable because he came out of nowhere to put up numbers nearly identical to a guy who was a consensus future all star before draft day. His ast% is even comparable.
 
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