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You're the GM this offseason. What do you do?

framer said:
I'm about 80% convinced that Tobias Harris is coming to the Jazz after seeing what is going down in Philly. While part of me says "Great! Bring it!" another part thinks he isn't really our greatest need. I'm pretty sure I would rather have Jimmy Butler (if that were an option.)
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I still love Jimmy. But we still also don’t have an answer at the 4 and that is pretty critical, especially if we can plug it with an efficient, serious scorer that has a mid-range game (that probably hasn’t been discussed enough since iso/mid-range scoring suddenly becomes critical when defenses tighten in the playoffs).
 
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I think Jimmy Butler ends up being the odd man out in Philly while they keep Tobias on a max deal. Like others have said, Tobias compliments everything any team wants to do while being a good teammate.

Philly will end up keeping Tobias and Redick. And they'll probably be even better next year without Jimmy.
 
LoPo said:
I think Jimmy Butler ends up being the odd man out in Philly while they keep Tobias on a max deal. Like others have said, Tobias compliments everything any team wants to do while being a good teammate.

Philly will end up keeping Tobias and Redick. And they'll probably be even better next year without Jimmy.
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I really wish I didn’t agree with this.
 
LoPo said:
I think Jimmy Butler ends up being the odd man out in Philly while they keep Tobias on a max deal. Like others have said, Tobias compliments everything any team wants to do while being a good teammate.

Philly will end up keeping Tobias and Redick. And they'll probably be even better next year without Jimmy.
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Jimmy has cuddled up to Embiid and I don't trust Brand. The tobias trade was a solid overpay and unless they are willing to go to five years I think he bounces. I think he sees how he will be marginalized and that Simmons, Embiid, Jimmy (if he stays) all need the ball to be effective. Jimmy has been better in the playoffs and I think they will try to keep him... he also knows he can get his money then force a trade later cuz that's how he rolls. they might keep them both then move Simmons... he and Embiid don't fit and Ben could land them more in a trade.

I think it is 40% Tobias stays... 60% he bounces... I'd say we have like a 15-20% chance at landing him if we throw out the max. Brooklyn will be after him, NY if they miss on their big targets, Lakers, Dallas, maybe Sacramento if Barnes opts out and tries to leave... I think Brooklyn might have the best chances to land him.

I think we can make a really appealing case for role that magnifies his skills, culture of success and development, fit, and loyalty... dude has been traded like 4 times now... probably would like to unpack his suitcase with some confidence.
 
LoPo said:
I think Jimmy Butler ends up being the odd man out in Philly while they keep Tobias on a max deal. Like others have said, Tobias compliments everything any team wants to do while being a good teammate.

Philly will end up keeping Tobias and Redick. And they'll probably be even better next year without Jimmy.
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But does Philly offer the full max? I'm not sure I'd pay that max either, but the Jazz wouldn't have the ability to. I sure as hell throw OUR max at him. If that's not what they offer July 1, I think he goes looking.

The other question is if he's actually happy there. Seems like a miserable bunch of dicks when they're not winning (and incessantly trash-talking).
 
Roy_McAvoy said:
I hate to bring this up again, but what in the hell was Dinwiddie doing signing a $3 year/$34 million extension this year?! I get that he was healthy and wanted to lock in the deal, but I have to think someone like the Jazz would've given him a $45-$50 million deal over 3 years. The Jazz could've done that and still had space to retain Favors for those who love him (or sign someone else like maybe Mirotic). That seems like that would've been a great route to go to add two impactful players.
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He had never made money and had at least one serious injury early in his career. It was a calculated risk and the last year is player option... so he can still hit the market for a good deal. If he had turned down the extension there is still a chance he could have had an injury and never made life altering money.

He could like land something in the neighborhood of 4/70-80M.. so he definetly left money on the table, but it was the most they could offer on an extension.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Jimmy has cuddled up to Embiid and I don't trust Brand. The tobias trade was a solid overpay and unless they are willing to go to five years I think he bounces. I think he sees how he will be marginalized and that Simmons, Embiid, Jimmy (if he stays) all need the ball to be effective. Jimmy has been better in the playoffs and I think they will try to keep him... he also knows he can get his money then force a trade later cuz that's how he rolls. they might keep them both then move Simmons... he and Embiid don't fit and Ben could land them more in a trade.

I think it is 40% Tobias stays... 60% he bounces... I'd say we have like a 15-20% chance at landing him if we throw out the max. Brooklyn will be after him, NY if they miss on their big targets, Lakers, Dallas, maybe Sacramento if Barnes opts out and tries to leave... I think Brooklyn might have the best chances to land him.

I think we can make a really appealing case for role that magnifies his skills, culture of success and development, fit, and loyalty... dude has been traded like 4 times now... probably would like to unpack his suitcase with some confidence.
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You make good points. I would say the chances for Tobias are...

Stay 75% - Philly re-signs him because he's an asset. If they want to trade him later, they can. Regardless, the player is happy because he got a massive pay day. Philly would be dumb to let him go and Tobias would be dumb to pass up on a 5 year max deal.

Jazz 5% - we are an option because he would be the 2nd scoring option instead of the 3rd or 4th AND we would give the max deal. I think this chance might go up should they get destroyed at home in Game 6. Any drama could help.

I think the Clippers have a very good shot of re-signing him. He seemed very happy there and they seem intent on signing a couple max guys. If they miss out on Kawhi and KD, maybe they laugh at Philly as they re-sign the guy they just traded for 2 1sts.
 
LoPo said:
You make good points. I would say the chances for Tobias are...

Stay 75% - Philly re-signs him because he's an asset. If they want to trade him later, they can. Regardless, the player is happy because he got a massive pay day. Philly would be dumb to let him go and Tobias would be dumb to pass up on a 5 year max deal.

Jazz 5% - we are an option because he would be the 2nd scoring option instead of the 3rd or 4th AND we would give the max deal. I think this chance might go up should they get destroyed at home in Game 6. Any drama could help.

I think the Clippers have a very good shot of re-signing him. He seemed very happy there and they seem intent on signing a couple max guys. If they miss out on Kawhi and KD, maybe they laugh at Philly as they re-sign the guy they just traded for 2 1sts.
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Do you think he'd want to go back to one of the teams that valued a bunch of stuff over keeping him? They're not on the list.
 
LoPo said:
You make good points. I would say the chances for Tobias are...

Stay 75% - Philly re-signs him because he's an asset. If they want to trade him later, they can. Regardless, the player is happy because he got a massive pay day. Philly would be dumb to let him go and Tobias would be dumb to pass up on a 5 year max deal.

Jazz 5% - we are an option because he would be the 2nd scoring option instead of the 3rd or 4th AND we would give the max deal. I think this chance might go up should they get destroyed at home in Game 6. Any drama could help.

I think the Clippers have a very good shot of re-signing him. He seemed very happy there and they seem intent on signing a couple max guys. If they miss out on Kawhi and KD, maybe they laugh at Philly as they re-sign the guy they just traded for 2 1sts.
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The issue on Tobias is can they trade him for value on a 5 year $190M contract? Maybe they can... but his value may be hurt as his role is reduced. It isn't any easy evaluation and fit for either party and I think if we come strong on July 1 and say "full max right now no questions asked (maybe even a player option in 4th year so you can get back on the market young)" and they pause saying "we might give full max over 5 years but let's negotiate raises" or "wait let's see what Jimmy does" then they might be in trouble. The options make the contract less attractive in trade... so the team offering them is less likely to trade you or view you as an "asset". If Tobias can get back on the market in 3 years as a 29 year old that has made like $170M, he could choose to ink another lucrative long term deal or could forego some money to go to a situation he wants to move to. He might leave $50M on the table now, but might more than make up for it by hitting FA two years earlier and making more on the backend. It would be a risk, but you'd be betting $50M when you already made $170 - 205M in your career.
 
Remember when a young Gordon Hayward left to take a 3+1 deal over the guaranteed 5 year max? In some ways these guys view the shorter deal as better because "they will make it back either way". PG did this with OKC too... We probably don't view Tobias as that good of a player... but he might and his agent might too.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Remember when a young Gordon Hayward left to take a 3+1 deal over the guaranteed 5 year max? In some ways these guys view the shorter deal as better because "they will make it back either way". PG did this with OKC too... We probably don't view Tobias as that good of a player... but he might and his agent might too.
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Ehh, if the team situations were flipped he would have taken the 5 year max from Boston.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Jimmy has cuddled up to Embiid and I don't trust Brand. The tobias trade was a solid overpay and unless they are willing to go to five years I think he bounces. I think he sees how he will be marginalized and that Simmons, Embiid, Jimmy (if he stays) all need the ball to be effective. Jimmy has been better in the playoffs and I think they will try to keep him... he also knows he can get his money then force a trade later cuz that's how he rolls. they might keep them both then move Simmons... he and Embiid don't fit and Ben could land them more in a trade.

I think it is 40% Tobias stays... 60% he bounces... I'd say we have like a 15-20% chance at landing him if we throw out the max. Brooklyn will be after him, NY if they miss on their big targets, Lakers, Dallas, maybe Sacramento if Barnes opts out and tries to leave... I think Brooklyn might have the best chances to land him.

I think we can make a really appealing case for role that magnifies his skills, culture of success and development, fit, and loyalty... dude has been traded like 4 times now... probably would like to unpack his suitcase with some confidence.
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Best case for Utah is Kyrie goes to Brooklyn.

That would take an option away from Harris and make Russell available (not that I'm a huge fan, but he's more appealing than a lot of alternatives)
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
Remember when a young Gordon Hayward left to take a 3+1 deal over the guaranteed 5 year max? In some ways these guys view the shorter deal as better because "they will make it back either way". PG did this with OKC too... We probably don't view Tobias as that good of a player... but he might and his agent might too.
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Tobias may want a shorter deal. He may want to be a more featured option. I'm not sure what he really wants.

All things considered, I would just be surprised if he passed on a 5 year max offer. If he does to come to us, then good for us.
 
If we’re able to land Harris, I bet we bring George Hill back to start. It’s pretty clear that DL isn’t giving up on Exum, so bringing Hill back as security makes sense to me.
 
David Stern said:
If we’re able to land Harris, I bet we bring George Hill back to start. It’s pretty clear that DL isn’t giving up on Exum, so bringing Hill back as security makes sense to me.
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There seems to be bad blood there, though. I'm not really sure why, but...
 
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