You're the GM this offseason. What do you do?

[Lakers_Slapper]

I don't understand how this conversation is that tough. MJ had a great rookie year. 28 ppg. Great stats. His team lost 3-1 to the Bucks in the first round. His second year, he played a handful of games then broke his leg. Out for the year.

Donovan was a lower pick and didn't take off until November. He was still the catalyst for a team who won a first round series over a team with the defending MVP and two other future hall of famers. In his 2nd year, Donovan led his team to 50 wins while scoring close to 24 per game. If you consider that MJ averaged 9+ free throws per game his first two seasons to Donovan's 4, you can see how MJ was able to score 4-5 more ppg.

So yes, Mitchell has had a better start to his career than MJ through two years.

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You don't understand how this is a tough conversation? I don't either, because your obviously limited in your NBA knowledge and (I would put money on it) younger than 25.
Jordans Rookie year with the Chicago Bulls. Best players on his team
(end of his career) Orlando Woolridge & Quintin Dailey

Facing everyday:
Magic Johnson
Larry Bird
Robert Parish
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
Dennis Johnson
Julius Erving
Isaiah Thomas
Charles Barkley
Moses Malone
Akeem Olajuwon
Karl Malone
Dominique Wilkins
Sydney Moncreif
Alvin Robertson
Herb Williams
to name a few!

But you don't see why Donovan Mitchell is put into the subject???

 

[Sandman822]

I don't understand how this conversation is that tough. MJ had a great rookie year. 28 ppg. Great stats. His team lost 3-1 to the Bucks in the first round. His second year, he played a handful of games then broke his leg. Out for the year.

Donovan was a lower pick and didn't take off until November. He was still the catalyst for a team who won a first round series over a team with the defending MVP and two other future hall of famers. In his 2nd year, Donovan led his team to 50 wins while scoring close to 24 per game. If you consider that MJ averaged 9+ free throws per game his first two seasons to Donovan's 4, you can see how MJ was able to score 4-5 more ppg.

So yes, Mitchell has had a better start to his career than MJ through two years.

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I like how you conveniently left out MJ averaging 44/6/6 after missing most of his 2nd season against one of the best NBA team in history in the Larry Bird era Celtics with a rookie Horace Grant and a 2nd year John Paxson as his running mates.

Mitchell is fantastic but he's nowhere near the caliber player that MJ was after two seasons, and downplaying MJ's individual stats and accomplishments because the Bulls weren't overly successful when MJ had a dog **** roster in his rookie year and still took that team to 38 wins while Mitchell comes into a more or less established team who just lost their #1 scoring option and done a phenomenal job filling the spot for the team and kept the cogs rolling for the Jazz and that is somehow more impressive? All it sounds like to me is that because Mitchell got to play with one of the elite defenses in the NBA with a great coach and solid support cast, while also wining a watered down dunk contest earlier than MJ, that all of a sudden that makes his start to his career better when MJ put up great stats on a dog **** team, took a game off the Sidney Moncrief Bucks with that same roster, then got hurt before coming out and completely dominating individually against the Larry Bird Celtics but not having the support cast to help him out. You're basically penalising and downplaying all of the stuff MJ did early all because he had a complete trash team surrounding him in his first two years and he got hurt.

Mitchell is a supremely talented player and still has a ton of room left to grow, but please stop comparing him to the best basketball player of all time. You're doing no one favours with that.

 

[Lakers_Slapper]

Superstar with zero playoff series wins his first two years. 28ppg was cool and all, but remember MJ is coddled because his winning. He didn't do that as well as Donovan through 2 years.

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I already lit you up. But you don't even understand that Donovan doesn't have to face the defense of the 1980's along with the hand check rule. The hand check rule allowed a defensive player to guide where he wanted you to go with no foul. Jordan had a team of nobody's and faced the teams that went down as some of the best teams in history. The Bulls before Jordan were 27-55 and went to an immediate, 38-44 his rookie season without adding any talent on the team and going through legendary competition.
Donovan hasn't had elite talent neither on his team or facing that talent on another team, but he's going through an era where if you breath on someone there is a foul called. (Did you know elbowing the rib cage was overlooked in the 80's?) Plus he's going through players that won't play defense. Curry, Harden, Walker, Ball, Lebron (yes I am saying LeBron is weak at defense no matter what critics say because I watch every game).

 

[Sandman822]

It's even worse when you consider that Mitchell just came off a historically bad playoffs run from an individual statistical standpoint and now you want to say he's off to a better start in his first two years than the best player of all time all because he got to abuse a washed up Melo for 30 minutes a night while the team defense took everyone that wasn't named Westbrook out of every home game in the series?

The more I think about it the more I'm convinced it's an elaborate troll, no one can be this stupid.

 

[Lakers_Slapper]

Michael Jordan had a losing record in every season AND a 1-9 playoff record before Scottie Pippen and Phil Jackson came. I'm not saying Donovan is MJ, but you have to have help in this game of basketball.

Yes, Jordan had no help against the Legendary Celtics, the Bad Boy Pistons, and the Show time Lakers. and when a rookie Scottie Pippen came, they were being coached by Doug Collins. I watched those games, did you?? I'm guessing that Dora the explorer is a more recent memory for you than early 90's, or late 80's basketball.

 

[Lakers_Slapper]

If we would have gotten Conley for Rubio ($14.8), Thabo ($5.25), Udoh ($3.36), Bradley ($1.7) and a 1st rounder, that would have been one of the most amazing trades in Jazz history. We literally would have traded spare parts, Rubio and a very late first for a very good PG.

But now I know why Memphis didn't do it...

Your a spare part, how do we trade you? After listening to your Mitchell is Jordan garbage, I am just wondering if Gobert is Wilt Chamberlain? You've vomited so much waste out of that hole in the middle of your face, I'm just wondering what's next? Is Rubio Pistol Pete? Do you know who these guys are? They say there is an island of plastic in the middle of the ocean, there is an island of something more dangerous than that in the middle of Utah. If you do find someone that will let you test the depth of the beehive, please don't go get the honey.

 

[LoPo]

@Lakers_Slapper

I've been aware for some time that you like to romanticize the past like some old timer who thinks things were so much better way back when. I also know your MJ worship is always full on.

I'm 41. I've seen it all that you're referring to. MJ was incredible but not some Greek unstoppable God you make him out to be.

What Mitchell has done in his first two years is comparable to what MJ did in his. I don't give two ***** if you agree or not. In terms of results, it's actually better. MJ couldn't win without help and an elite coach.

You and I have debated the past before. We are probably close in age. I choose to acknowledge that players and the game get bigger, stronger, faster, better. You're going to think that guys like Robert Parrish would stay on the court in today's game. Anybody with logic knows the game has evolved but hey, keep telling us about the good ole days.



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[Stoked]

@Lakers_Slapper

I've been aware for some time that you like to romanticize the past like some old timer who thinks things were so much better way back when. I also know your MJ worship is always full on.

I'm 41. I've seen it all that you're referring to. MJ was incredible but not some Greek unstoppable God you make him out to be.

What Mitchell has done in his first two years is comparable to what MJ did in his. I don't give two ***** if you agree or not. In terms of results, it's actually better. MJ couldn't win without help and an elite coach.

You and I have debated the past before. We are probably close in age. I choose to acknowledge that players and the game get bigger, stronger, faster, better. You're going to think that guys like Robert Parrish would stay on the court in today's game. Anybody with logic knows the game has evolved but hey, keep telling us about the good ole days.



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Bigger, stronger, faster? I don’t buy into that. Malone, Ewing, Barkley, Shaq, Magic, Rodman, Mourning, Robinson...list goes on and on.

Has the game changed? Yes, and as a result so have the skills to match that.

 

[LoPo]

Bigger, stronger, faster? I don’t buy into that. Malone, Ewing, Barkley, Shaq, Magic, Rodman, Mourning, Robinson...list goes on and on.

Has the game changed? Yes, and as a result so have the skills to match that.

There are athletes, like the guys you mentioned, who would succeed in any era. But overall, which is my point, the athletic standard has been elevated 10 fold since the 80's.

Guys like Craig Ehlo wouldn't be on the court today. Guys like Parrish wouldn't dominate. The game is different. If you aren't athletic and cant defend, you cant stay on the floor today. The best defenders of MJ's era would be considered average today. 6'2" Joe Dumars was MJ's best defensive opponent? Really?

If you took TMac and put him in those days, he would score 30ppg. Why? MJ led to an evolution of how it is played. He was a pioneer but that doesnt mean he was the only guy to do it that level. MJ worship needs perspective.

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[mellow]

I'm the GM I take a nice vacation, maybe travel abroad. Spend some time with the kids.

Then you return to work and Gail fires you.

Id take the vacation. Imafine being poir Dennis. You could work your butt off for seven years trying to change a culture inside your organization and the public perception of it from the outside only to have all your plans trashed and progress erased by a players wife who prefers the stores in another city and some ill mannered bum who shouts obsenities and slurs at Westbrook.

If jazz can't land a free agent this summer he could still get canned.

 

[Thee Jazz Fan]

Then you return to work and Gail fires you.

Gm’s Don’t get fired here they get promoted or become coaches.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Man a few pieces here and there really make a difference. Rockets getting Tucker a couple years ago on what is now a MLE type deal and Eric Gordon... took a somehwhat risky deal on an injury prone guy has made that team a legit contender. If we could get something similar... free agents that are quality but maybe not being used correctly and fit them in... then we are there.

Get some expensive good pieces and clear roster spots for high quality waiver guys and dudes that are reclamation projects... Hood, Kanter, Faried, have all had contributions...

Also we got better shots than the Warriors are getting and caused Harden more problems than GS is... Quin deserves a ton of credit... had our guys hit some shots or if we had a couple better shooters... watching GS Houston has given some perspective on how good that team is.