Am I racist?

[Siro]

a) You're simply wrong in saying that only white liberals have a problem with it.
b) it's commonly used because the term is used commonly in the Canadian and American constitutions surrounding the status of Indigenous Peoples
c) what a scholarly source you've selected




I have yet to meet any Native American university student, scholar, or writer who prefers Canadian Indian to being known as Indigenous.

I'm also curious as to how this being a 'liberal cause' invalidates arguments against the term Canadian/American Indian.

You always call me out on my generalization and I appreciate it. It is a bad habit that I should try to avoid. However, the link I provided should remedy your generalization as it specifically mentions a Native American activist who finds American Indian to be the preferable term. There, now you've seen one.

The point is, there is nothing offensive about being an Indian (the South Asian type). This is different than terms such as red skin which are designed to objectify. The term Indian is simply anachronistic. So you shouldn't lump thought-police issues with what is objectively and substantively harmful.

 

[fishonjazz]

bro
1) I aint quoting **** for you. Go read it yourself.
2) I said the nature of stereotyping was concluded-- this encompasses positive stereotyping. I'm not gonna walk you through every post.

You said people in power create stereotypes in order to dominate the people they are stereotyping.

So my question would be why did people in power create the stereotype of black guys being good dancers? How does that dominate them?

 

[Deleted member 848]

You said people in power create stereotypes in order to dominate the people they are stereotyping.

So my question would be why did people in power create the stereotype of black guys being good dancers? How does that dominate them?

Again:

2) I said the nature of stereotyping was concluded-- this encompasses positive stereotyping. I'm not gonna walk you through every post.

.

 

[Deleted member 848]

You always call me out on my generalization and I appreciate it. It is a bad habit that I should try to avoid. However, the link I provided should remedy your generalization as it specifically mentions a Native American activist who finds American Indian to be the preferable term. There, now you've seen one.

The point is, there is nothing offensive about being an Indian (the South Asian type). This is different than terms such as red skin which are designed to objectify. The term Indian is simply anachronistic. So you shouldn't lump thought-police issues with what is objectively and substantively harmful.

make sure you check out the source I posted in the previous page. Interestingly, this issue could be perceived differently between Canada and America.

 

[fishonjazz]

Some stereotypes exist because of true generalizations of a characteristic of group of people that the majority of those people share.
Not all stereotypes are bad and created for evil reasons

 

[fishonjazz]

Again:



.

I just wonder why you don't just answer my question.... even if you think it had already been answered
I obviously missed it and I am asking you directly
Would be nice if you could show me some respect and just answer my question. Oh well. I tried

 

[Deleted member 848]

I just wonder why you don't just answer my question.... even if you think it had already been answered
I obviously missed it and I am asking you directly
Would be nice if you could show me some respect and just answer my question. Oh well. I tried

Because I swear it seems like you're blatantly ignoring my posts in like half of this thread.

https://jazzfanz.com/showthread.php?37873-Am-I-racist/page6

Read this page, and the exchanges I had with Siro.

 

[Siro]

make sure you check out the source I posted in the previous page. Interestingly, this issue could be perceived differently between Canada and America.

I feel the link validates my perspective. They say that it is a complex issue with no general consensus on correct terminology, and they ask us to be mindful but not to get stuck up on terminology as that would stifle discourse. It is exactly as I was saying. Indian isn't preferable, but it is generally okay. Insistence on equating it with a seriously derogatory terms like red skin is the liberal impulse to impose political correctness.

 

[Deleted member 848]

I feel the link validates my perspective. They say that it is a complex issue with no general consensus on correct terminology, and they ask us to be mindful but not to get stuck up on terminology as that would stifle discourse. It is exactly as I was saying. Indian isn't preferable, but it is generally okay. Insistence on equating it with a seriously derogatory terms like red skin is the liberal impulse to impose political correctness.

I just don't care for the exercise in ranking terms in the spectrum of 'inappropriateness". If it's inappropriate, don't use it. "*****", which comes from the term Indian, is arguably the most derogatory term for Indigenous Peoples that I know of-- according to those that I know.

 

[Siro]

I just don't care for the exercise in ranking terms in the spectrum of 'inappropriateness". If it's inappropriate, don't use it. "*****", which comes from the term Indian, is arguably the most derogatory term for Indigenous Peoples that I know of-- according to those that I know.

No, I disagree. I think morality should be as objective as possible. And morality deals with what is wrong, not what is inappropriate. Red skin objectifies and insults. It is wrong and should not be used. Since there is nowhere near consensus within that community that the term American Indian is offensive, at least in the US, the fact it is inappropriate is simply your opinion. And clearly that does not dictate how others should speak.

 

[fishonjazz]

Because I swear it seems like you're blatantly ignoring my posts in like half of this thread.

https://jazzfanz.com/showthread.php?37873-Am-I-racist/page6

Read this page, and the exchanges I had with Siro.

I'm not ignoring your posts
I just asked you a very specific question that had not been asked yet in this thread.
It's odd that you could have saved lots of time by just answering it in the first place instead of ask the run around.

I will accept that you won't answer my question. It's ok

 

[fishonjazz]

Because I swear it seems like you're blatantly ignoring my posts in like half of this thread.

https://jazzfanz.com/showthread.php?37873-Am-I-racist/page6

Read this page, and the exchanges I had with Siro.

By the way, when I click the link provided it simply takes me to the last post in this thread (my own post)

 

[Deleted member 848]

No, I disagree. I think morality should be as objective as possible. And morality deals with what is wrong, not what is inappropriate. Red skin objectifies and insults. It is wrong and should not be used.

I'm not sure how I feel about your distinction between wrong and inappropriate.

Since there is nowhere near consensus within that community that the term American Indian is offensive, at least in the US, the fact it is inappropriate is simply your opinion. And clearly that does not dictate how others should speak.

It is quite consensus in the Canadian community (at least in my university community) to refer to Indigenous Peoples as that, and not Indians-- in lecture, in papers, anything (other than referring to their legal status directly). We might just have to chalk it up as a cultural difference.

 

[Deleted member 848]

By the way, when I click the link provided it simply takes me to the last post in this thread (my own post)

hmm. it should take you to page 6.

I'm not ignoring your posts
I just asked you a very specific question that had not been asked yet in this thread.

It hasn't been asked specifically, but there were posts made that answer it.

It's odd that you could have saved lots of time by just answering it in the first place instead of ask the run around.

I will accept that you won't answer my question. It's ok

I have answered your question u can do it, fish.

 

[fishonjazz]

It hasn't been asked specifically, but there were posts made that answer it.



I have answered your question u can do it, fish.

You say my question has not been asked, yet you have answered it.
I disagree. You have not answered my question and apparently won't

 

[fishonjazz]

So my question would be why did people in power create the stereotype of black guys being good dancers? How does that dominate them?

There is my question again for ya (so you don't have to go search for it like you want me to do with your "answer")

It's a very specific scenario.
Not sure if you will be able to handle it. We will see. The ball is in your court

 

[Deleted member 848]

You say my question has not been asked, yet you have answered it.
I disagree.

I think the reality is that it's somewhere in the middle, as with most things. I think you're reaching when you purely purport stereotypes as 'memes', and nothing else-- and never purposely created/exploited.

made when Siro said I was reaching when I insinuated that stereotypes were purely a weapon of oppression.

 

[fishonjazz]

made when Siro said I was reaching when I insinuated that stereotypes were purely a weapon of oppression.

Ok, so you don't think that stereotypes are purely a weapon of oppression.

That was all I was trying to get from you. It would have been really easy for you to just post that in the first place.

Better late than never though! Thanks

 

[Siro]

I'm not sure how I feel about your distinction between wrong and inappropriate.



It is quite consensus in the Canadian community (at least in my university community) to refer to Indigenous Peoples as that, and not Indians-- in lecture, in papers, anything (other than referring to their legal status directly). We might just have to chalk it up as a cultural difference.

One is a violation of social expectations, the other inflicts substantive harm. The distinction is clear, and the two should not be equated because doing so devalues the moral worth of doing harm.

I think there is something to the claim of cultural differences. For example, I was with a group of friends, and one friend mentioned "Eskimos" only to be corrected by a Canadian guy. Apparently, the correct term is Inuit. None of us had heard that before.

But yes, I too am drained.

 

[Deleted member 848]

There is my question again for ya (so you don't have to go search for it like you want me to do with your "answer")

It's a very specific scenario.
Not sure if you will be able to handle it. We will see. The ball is in your court

Blacks being good dancers is a pretty poor example of a positive stereotype. Blacks being good at dancing has for decades been tied closely together to their purported sexual promiscuity, which whites have long used as a stereotype against black people.