Donald Fires FBI Director who's investigating Russian Election Hacking

[Zombie]

I follow Russia stuff. As soon as we started the Russia meddling probe, he went to his equivalent of Congress and did a huge rant about investigating how the US is meddling in Russian politics.

I think he'll have a damning case against us if we push any case against him. I think the sanctions are childish.

Also there's nothing more tiring to me then people playing the 'well we're not very nice to Russia either' card. If Syria was somehow able to launch drone strikes in the US, would you throw up your hands and say there's nothing we can do because we pull that **** too? Of course not.
America certainly isn't perfect but defending our democracy should be something every American can get behind whatever they think of our foreign policy.

 

[babe]

I'm not sure what any of that has to do with the president neglecting his duties under the constitution to enact laws passed by Congress.

Well, I think he could just veto it or send it back with some suggestions for improving it. But sitting on it might be less offensive to his R supporters, even if it gives his D opponents some ammo. It's a judgment call.... apparently based on politics not principle.

why are you this anxious about it? As I suggested above, it seems childish to sanction Russia when we have the CIA meddling all over the world, toppling leaders who don't do what we want.

 

[babe]

I'm not sure what any of that has to do with the president neglecting his duties under the constitution to enact laws passed by Congress.

Well, I think he could just veto it or send it back with some suggestions for improving it. But sitting on it might be less offensive to his R supporters, even if it gives his D opponents some ammo. It's a judgment call.... apparently based on politics not principle.

why are you this anxious about it? As I suggested above, it seems childish to sanction Russia when we have the CIA meddling all over the world, toppling leaders who don't do what we want.

Also there's nothing more tiring to me then people playing the 'well we're not very nice to Russia either' card. If Syria was somehow able to launch drone strikes in the US, would you throw up your hands and say there's nothing we can do because we pull that **** too? Of course not.
America certainly isn't perfect but defending our democracy should be something every American can get behind whatever they think of our foreign policy.

OK, for a sec thought you must be in Turkey or some remote corner of Syria still free from Assad..... in range of Syrian drones.... but if you sincerely think Russia has somehow been successful in subverting our democracy, you would find a few like-minded folks at a nearby John Birch Society meeting.... but then this new Russia fearmongering Press is the bapf Press.

Some people say be careful when pointing your finger in accusation.... three fingers pointing at yourself.... sorta saying projection is a tactic of deceit..... offense the best defense.... if you're afraid of being found out for a crime, accuse someone else first.

I think it is clear that Putin had substantial political dealmaking with Hillary. She got tons of money from him. Bill got tons of money "speaking" to select groups in Russia. Hillary really did compromise our democracy in doing these things, even from the seat of Sec of State and not the Pres. But of course, Hillary was a globalist and a big UN governance supporter, and a lot of our sophisticated leadership is on board with all that.

Under globalism, elected officials will pretty much be figureheads while all our laws are made by select UN committees for rubber-stamp implementation across the world. The committee seats will be brokered by corporate interests..... I call that fascism, and a serious threat to US democracy.

 

[Zombie]

Well, I think he could just veto it or send it back with some suggestions for improving it. But sitting on it might be less offensive to his R supporters, even if it gives his D opponents some ammo. It's a judgment call.... apparently based on politics not principle.

why are you this anxious about it? As I suggested above, it seems childish to sanction Russia when we have the CIA meddling all over the world, toppling leaders who don't do what we want.

You don't seem to understand. He signed the law when it was passed a year ago (due to it passing with a veto proof majority) his state dept is not putting it into action.

 

[babe]

OK, Z. I think you're right about Trump signing it. But it shows a little smarts not to actually implement it, as I suggested above. It was a childish act, and under the real circumstances it was just a political gesture. The sanctions won't stop anything. If Russia were interfering we just need to fix the ballot boxes so we can verify voter eligibility and have a paper trail all the way to the tally officials who report the results.

If Russia were to say drop leaflets all over the country advocating Vote for Trump... or surrender.... I don't think that would do the job. If Russia gave Trump help.... oh wait... Russia did give Hillary help. Russia made up the dossier the Dems used to get the FISA court to wiretap Trump. But that didn't succeed either. I think we can move on without the sanctions, but secure our ballot process anyway.

 

[Zombie]

OK, Z. I think you're right about Trump signing it. But it shows a little smarts not to actually implement it, as I suggested above. It was a childish act, and under the real circumstances it was just a political gesture. The sanctions won't stop anything. If Russia were interfering we just need to fix the ballot boxes so we can verify voter eligibility and have a paper trail all the way to the tally officials who report the results.

If Russia were to say drop leaflets all over the country advocating Vote for Trump... or surrender.... I don't think that would do the job. If Russia gave Trump help.... oh wait... Russia did give Hillary help. Russia made up the dossier the Dems used to get the FISA court to wiretap Trump. But that didn't succeed either. I think we can move on without the sanctions, but secure our ballot process anyway.

Kind of defeats the purpose of an independent legislative body if the executive can just ignore the laws they pass. Regardless of how you feel about this particular bill I would think you'd have higher regard for the constitution than this.

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

Lol

You clearly don't

I was aware of them going crazy over the scandals before the scandals even happened.

 

[sirkickyass]

Dropped in on a whim. I think I've mentioned on this site at least one other time that my personal response to this entire Russian quagmire has been to spend significant amounts of time teaching myself Russian (although I ended up caving and hiring a private tutor, because that **** is hard) and reading Russian literature and history to get a sense of who it is that we are at a renewed cold war with.

There is very little doubt in my mind that the decision yesterday not to implement sanctions, and further to scuttle the process of actually compiling a useable list of sanctionable individuals, was a direct personal favor from the President to Putin. To understand Russia's political system, you need to wrap your head around the concept that they have a managed Democracy that features features of a Western Democratic process but serves entirely different political ends. Russia's leaders maintain power by consolidating support among a designated economic elite, who in turn allow the state to retain fundamental control over who has the right to exploit the country's resources. In a way, the Russian "oligarchs" are sort of like feudal lords that have the capacity, collectively, to overturn the power of a king. Putin is functionally an absolute leader, but does rely heavily on the consent of the oligarchy to retain control.

I read some Russian-published news sources with regularity, and the publication of the "Putin list" that was supposed to accompany these sanctions was a really hot button topic in Russia. This was going to the heart of the support structure that Putin needs to retain control, and could have placed several of these oligarchs in the position of needing regime change in order to unlock their wealth abroad. It would have really messed with the true power structure in Russian society in a way that merely naming all the people in the Duma does not.

News stories in Russian were being published about individuals and industrialists bringing cash back into Russia because they were terrified of ending up on this Putin list and being severed from their money overseas. The US ambassador to Russia, Jon Huntsman Jr., did an interview with a leading security publication that focuses on Russia and Eastern European issues and caters to a largely Russian audience. Most of the questions were about sanctions. Half of the interview were specifically about these sanctions.

http://www.interfax.com/interview.asp?id=806172

It is impossible to overstate how much Russia, and specifically Putin, wanted this to just go away. It's a much bigger favor to Putin, and the oligarchs he relies on to maintain power, than even most Trump critics realize.

До скоро!

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

When I came here, it's true as you say I found reasons to see the good in you. I used to have a good time with OneBrow because he took the time of day to try to straighten me out.... after actually listening to what I said.

I think the turning point in my view of you came when I was prattling about oh whatever... herbal remedies, maybe.... and you rolled out the hate and started asking who the hell I thought I was knowing as much as you thought I thought I did. I think in all fairness you applied that hate over a period of time, and it was evident you intended to run me outta here.

So I'm saying.... I think your claim about being exclusive to wanting to run Dutch out is false. I remember some other that have been treated that way in this forum, and I don't recall you standing up for any of them.

I think Stoked is just dead wrong.

I took Dutch as being perhaps abrupt, taunting, mocking, and insulting.... but I could see his point vis a vis the self-adulating politically correct fashions of thought prevailing in some peoples current views. The way you can tell when you're actually wrong is just this: If you can't bear being mocked, you are likely really, really wrong.

He indeed lacked manners and tact. He lives somewhere.... say in Holland as he claims..... says he's Jewish and black. When I was in Israel there were quite a lot of Ethiopian Jews there. Many of them were the most orthodox believers you could find. Standing at the wailing wall doing their prayers.

If he is Ethiopian, he's come from places where his life has indeed been under attack. I don't think he was all that bad you couldn't laugh a bit sometimes or actually enter into a discussion of his points.

Dutch I think had a valid point of view. He was sad to see America going down the drain, so to speak, as the world's bastion of true hope..... human liberty and human rights.... under a rising sea of "liberal" statism.

I could not agree more with this post, and I have also been the target of Bullet/Game's tactics. It's laughable to read him claiming that he ran Dutch off for bad manners, as if he is some sort of last bastion for decency. Bullet has gone off on me in a crude fashion on multiple occasions. As far as I know, the only thing that has provoked these name-calling sessions is that we disagree on various subjects. As a result of those differences he thinks it is fair game to make up lies about me and my family and to say disgusting things about us. I am definitely not a member of the Game fan club.

 

[babe]

Dropped in on a whim. I think I've mentioned on this site at least one other time that my personal response to this entire Russian quagmire has been to spend significant amounts of time teaching myself Russian (although I ended up caving and hiring a private tutor, because that **** is hard) and reading Russian literature and history to get a sense of who it is that we are at a renewed cold war with.

There is very little doubt in my mind that the decision yesterday not to implement sanctions, and further to scuttle the process of actually compiling a useable list of sanctionable individuals, was a direct personal favor from the President to Putin. To understand Russia's political system, you need to wrap your head around the concept that they have a managed Democracy that features features of a Western Democratic process but serves entirely different political ends. Russia's leaders maintain power by consolidating support among a designated economic elite, who in turn allow the state to retain fundamental control over who has the right to exploit the country's resources. In a way, the Russian "oligarchs" are sort of like feudal lords that have the capacity, collectively, to overturn the power of a king. Putin is functionally an absolute leader, but does rely heavily on the consent of the oligarchy to retain control.

I read some Russian-published news sources with regularity, and the publication of the "Putin list" that was supposed to accompany these sanctions was a really hot button topic in Russia. This was going to the heart of the support structure that Putin needs to retain control, and could have placed several of these oligarchs in the position of needing regime change in order to unlock their wealth abroad. It would have really messed with the true power structure in Russian society in a way that merely naming all the people in the Duma does not.

News stories in Russian were being published about individuals and industrialists bringing cash back into Russia because they were terrified of ending up on this Putin list and being severed from their money overseas. The US ambassador to Russia, Jon Huntsman Jr., did an interview with a leading security publication that focuses on Russia and Eastern European issues and caters to a largely Russian audience. Most of the questions were about sanctions. Half of the interview were specifically about these sanctions.

http://www.interfax.com/interview.asp?id=806172

It is impossible to overstate how much Russia, and specifically Putin, wanted this to just go away. It's a much bigger favor to Putin, and the oligarchs he relies on to maintain power, than even most Trump critics realize.

До скоро!

somewhere far away and long ago.... I got the notion that you were related to Huntsman, like maybe a nephew. Like Huntsman, you are plenty smart. I had a very difficult time learning Russian and I don't even know how to find the Cyrillic alphabet on my computer to try to use it. Maybe I'll check back later if I figure that out. But I read Russian with a good dictionary and can understand some.

I've said nice things about Putin sometimes, because I realize he is quite westernized philosophically and only refers to Marxist ideology for convenience. Doesn't believe it all. He is truly an oligarch, much like I figured Hillary would prove to be.... well, and the whole kit and caboodle of politicians for the past hundred years plus, with very few exceptions. A virtual ruling class supported and kept in office by the right connections and for doing the expected stuff.

But your analysis seems to me to likely be very much the truth.

 

[Gameface]

I could not agree more with this post, and I have also been the target of Bullet/Game's tactics. It's laughable to read him claiming that he ran Dutch off for bad manners, as if he is some sort of last bastion for decency. Bullet has gone off on me in a crude fashion on multiple occasions. As far as I know, the only thing that has provoked these name-calling sessions is that we disagree on various subjects. As a result of those differences he thinks it is fair game to make up lies about me and my family and to say disgusting things about us. I am definitely not a member of the Game fan club.

If I had to guess I'd assume my popularity here is at an all-time low.

But I've explained in detail what you do specifically that gets under my skin. This post is a perfect example. We seem to completely talk past each other. I've given up.

 

[babe]

somewhere far away and long ago.... I got the notion that you were related to Huntsman, like maybe a nephew. Like Huntsman, you are plenty smart. I had a very difficult time learning Russian and I don't even know how to find the Cyrillic alphabet on my computer to try to use it. Maybe I'll check back later if I figure that out. But I read Russian with a good dictionary and can understand some.

I've said nice things about Putin sometimes, because I realize he is quite westernized philosophically and only refers to Marxist ideology for convenience. Doesn't believe it all. He is truly an oligarch, much like I figured Hillary would prove to be.... well, and the whole kit and caboodle of politicians for the past hundred years plus, with very few exceptions. A virtual ruling class supported and kept in office by the right connections and for doing the expected stuff.

But your analysis seems to me to likely be very much the truth.

uhmmm. OK, but maybe off on a most critical point. Trump might think he can get some help from Russia if he gives Putin what Putin really wants most.....like no nukes in Korea, or some kind of fav economic deal.

 

[babe]

If I had to guess I'd assume my popularity here is at an all-time low.

But I've explained in detail what you do specifically that gets under my skin. This post is a perfect example. We seem to completely talk past each other. I've given up.

well, don't throw in the towel just now. We might win tonight.

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

If I had to guess I'd assume my popularity here is at an all-time low.

But I've explained in detail what you do specifically that gets under my skin. This post is a perfect example. We seem to completely talk past each other. I've given up.

Whatever. You claim to be some sort of protector of good manners, but you occasionally come unglued and exhibit terrible manners.

 

[Gameface]

Whatever. You claim to be some sort of protector of good manners, but you occasionally come unglued and exhibit terrible manners.

True...

 

[Gameface]

well, don't throw in the towel just now. We might win tonight.

I've given up on Joe ever understanding anything I say.

 

[babe]

I've given up on Joe ever understanding anything I say.

but, more importantly, the Jazz could win tonight, right?

 

[Gameface]

but, more importantly, the Jazz could win tonight, right?

Yes

 

[The Thriller]

Washington (CNN)Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein visited the White House in December seeking President Donald Trump's help. The top Justice Department official in the Russia investigation wanted Trump's support in fighting off document demands from House Intelligence Chairman Devin Nunes.

But the President had other priorities ahead of a key appearance by Rosenstein on the Hill, according to sources familiar with the meeting. Trump wanted to know where the special counsel's Russia investigation was heading. And he wanted to know whether Rosenstein was "on my team."

https://www.cnn.com/2018/01/31/politics/donald-trump-rod-rosenstein-december-meeting/index.html

 

[The Thriller]

Dropped in on a whim. I think I've mentioned on this site at least one other time that my personal response to this entire Russian quagmire has been to spend significant amounts of time teaching myself Russian (although I ended up caving and hiring a private tutor, because that **** is hard) and reading Russian literature and history to get a sense of who it is that we are at a renewed cold war with.

There is very little doubt in my mind that the decision yesterday not to implement sanctions, and further to scuttle the process of actually compiling a useable list of sanctionable individuals, was a direct personal favor from the President to Putin. To understand Russia's political system, you need to wrap your head around the concept that they have a managed Democracy that features features of a Western Democratic process but serves entirely different political ends. Russia's leaders maintain power by consolidating support among a designated economic elite, who in turn allow the state to retain fundamental control over who has the right to exploit the country's resources. In a way, the Russian "oligarchs" are sort of like feudal lords that have the capacity, collectively, to overturn the power of a king. Putin is functionally an absolute leader, but does rely heavily on the consent of the oligarchy to retain control.

I read some Russian-published news sources with regularity, and the publication of the "Putin list" that was supposed to accompany these sanctions was a really hot button topic in Russia. This was going to the heart of the support structure that Putin needs to retain control, and could have placed several of these oligarchs in the position of needing regime change in order to unlock their wealth abroad. It would have really messed with the true power structure in Russian society in a way that merely naming all the people in the Duma does not.

News stories in Russian were being published about individuals and industrialists bringing cash back into Russia because they were terrified of ending up on this Putin list and being severed from their money overseas. The US ambassador to Russia, Jon Huntsman Jr., did an interview with a leading security publication that focuses on Russia and Eastern European issues and caters to a largely Russian audience. Most of the questions were about sanctions. Half of the interview were specifically about these sanctions.

http://www.interfax.com/interview.asp?id=806172

It is impossible to overstate how much Russia, and specifically Putin, wanted this to just go away. It's a much bigger favor to Putin, and the oligarchs he relies on to maintain power, than even most Trump critics realize.

До скоро!

Along those same lines comes this:

http://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blog...dent-trump-gets-revenge-for-russian-sanctions

On July 28, the US Senate voted 98-2 to adopt the new Combating America’s Adversaries Through Sanctions Act (CAATSA). President Donald Trump had little choice and signed it into law on August 2, although the main aim of the law was to make sure that the president could not revoke the sanctions against Russia because of its military aggression in Ukraine on his own.

The most interesting element of the new law was section 241. It called on the secretary of the treasury, in consultation with the director of national intelligence and the secretary of state, to submit within 180 days a detailed report identifying “the most significant senior foreign political figures and oligarchs” in Russia, “as determined by their closeness to the Russian regime and their net worth” and an “assessment of the relationship between individuals" and "President Vladimir Putin or other members of the Russian ruling elite” and an “identification of any indices of corruption with respect to those individuals.”

This anticipated report was called the “Kremlin list” and it was due at midnight on January 29. The obvious aim was to identify those who had made their fortune on illicit contacts with the Kremlin. The various US government bodies involved clearly carried out conscientious work along these lines.

At the last minute, however, somebody high up—no one knows who at this point—threw out the experts’ work and instead wrote down the names of the top officials in the Russian presidential administration and government plus the 96 Russian billionaires on the Forbes list. In doing so, this senior official ridiculed the government experts who had prepared another report, rendering CAATSA ineffective and mocking US sanctions on Russia overall.

Can it be any more obvious that this presidency along with its foul party has been corrupted by Russian oligarchs’ money???