PRIDE Week.

[Stoked]

I think a lot of 19 year olds just have an outsized view of their own experiences. I wasn't a crazy liberal nut at nineteen (I was actually pretty conservative, voted for Bush even) but I was far more confident in my beliefs than I had any reason to be.

I also think that their influence is far less than the amount of attention they get.

I think they are having a tremendous influence on universities. And I don’t like what I’m seeing there.

Also they are helping push a far more liberal agenda. So, I do think they are having an impact

I agree about the over confidence.

 

[silesian]

Who ever said it was dead?
Legit curious. Anyone here?

I hear denial all the time. Moreso racism that anti LGBTQ. I don’t recall hearing it on jazzfanz.

 

[silesian]

I hear denial all the time. Moreso racism that anti LGBTQ. I don’t recall hearing it on jazzfanz.

Sorry, my eff you was broadly directed. Not to anyone here.

 

[fishonjazz]

I always think that Fish's girl is the luckiest girl alive. Fish is pretty much like the perfect and most likable guy.

Jesus's sign/symbol is a fish. Coincidence? I think not.




Hehepeepeecaca

Screen shot and sent to the wife.
That will show her.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using JazzFanz mobile app

 

[LogGrad98]

I think a lot of 19 year olds just have an outsized view of their own experiences. I wasn't a crazy liberal nut at nineteen (I was actually pretty conservative, voted for Bush even) but I was far more confident in my beliefs than I had any reason to be.

I also think that their influence is far less than the amount of attention they get.

I taught my kids about this, called it the circle of knowledge. Imagine everything you know is in a circle drawn on a chalkboard or something. Everything outside the circle is what you don't know. The line of the circle itself represents what you know you don't know. The smaller the circle, the less you know, but also the less you know you don't know, hence why younger and uneducated people think they know everything. Their circle of knowledge is small and they are not aware of as much that they don't know, so they think they know more than they do.

 

[Stoked]

Sorry, my eff you was broadly directed. Not to anyone here.

I didn’t take it personal. But I couldn’t think of anyone it applied to here

 

[Archie Moses]

Admittedly, there was a time period late in high school and early in college in which I questioned my sexuality. It wasn’t that I craved ****, lol, it has to do with other reasons. I’ll divulge them if people are curious. I guess my point is, again, it’s a tricky time and to come to a definitive conclusion about something so important could be, for lack of a better word, possibly wrong. At least at that point in time.

I'm curious to hear about your phase when you questioned your sexuality.

 

[Keefe]

I'm curious to hear about your phase when you questioned your sexuality.

When I have time I’ll respond. It might be a few days as I woke feeling like *******.

 

[jimmy eat jazz]

It is a constant source of wonderment for me why so many people make it their business to oppose/hate/discriminate against/meddle in the lives of/etc. people who are different. So what if someone identifies as trans? What does it cost anyone to acknowledge their humanity and treat them with respect and tolerance? Nothing, nothing at all. Identifying as trans threatens no one, harms no one, affects no one. Trans have been with us since the dawn of time; it's only now they now feel empowered to come out.

I also have an LGBT daughter. I love her unconditionally. She's a singular joy in my life. It's unfathomable to me how any parent could withhold their love from an LGBT child. Shame on them. Shame on other people who don't know my daughter and have no business in her life who would hate or condemn her for this and who would seek to limit her life's opportunities and experiences for it.

 

[Archie Moses]

I live in Daybreak and I want to point out that I've never seen so many Pride flags hanging from people's homes before. I would say there were at least one for every 10 homes in the area where I live. I'm glad to see the community showing their support.

 

[fishonjazz]

It is a constant source of wonderment for me why so many people make it their business to oppose/hate/discriminate against/meddle in the lives of/etc. people who are different. So what if someone identifies as trans? What does it cost anyone to acknowledge their humanity and treat them with respect and tolerance? Nothing, nothing at all. Identifying as trans threatens no one, harms no one, affects no one. Trans have been with us since the dawn of time; it's only now they now feel empowered to come out.

I also have an LGBT daughter. I love her unconditionally. She's a singular joy in my life. It's unfathomable to me how any parent could withhold their love from an LGBT child. Shame on them. Shame on other people who don't know my daughter and have no business in her life who would hate or condemn her for this and who would seek to limit her life's opportunities and experiences for it.

Agreed.

 

[JazzGal]

I've overheard a coworker in the next office talking about trans and commenting that she "doesn't believe in it." What does that even mean? I've tried to interject with a simple comment of "I have no idea what it feels like to be trans, but I certainly do not feel qualified to invalidate their experiences and feelings" and "just love and accept people as they are and let them define themselves." It stopped that particular conversation, but there have been others. It's frustrating to me that so many people have the mindset of "I haven't experienced it, therefore it doesn't and shouldn't exist."

 

[Gameface]

I've overheard a coworker in the next office talking about trans and commenting that she "doesn't believe in it." What does that even mean? I've tried to interject with a simple comment of "I have no idea what it feels like to be trans, but I certainly do not feel qualified to invalidate their experiences and feelings" and "just love and accept people as they are and let them define themselves." It stopped that particular conversation, but there have been others. It's frustrating to me that so many people have the mindset of "I haven't experienced it, therefore it doesn't and shouldn't exist."

That's a notion that I've encountered a few times as well. The idea that Trans people are just playing a trick on them and they're just too damn smart to fall for it.

 

[Archie Moses]

I've overheard a coworker in the next office talking about trans and commenting that she "doesn't believe in it." What does that even mean? I've tried to interject with a simple comment of "I have no idea what it feels like to be trans, but I certainly do not feel qualified to invalidate their experiences and feelings" and "just love and accept people as they are and let them define themselves." It stopped that particular conversation, but there have been others. It's frustrating to me that so many people have the mindset of "I haven't experienced it, therefore it doesn't and shouldn't exist."

I think it's more complicated than this. I also think that both sides on this issue need to find some common ground and acknowledge that they're going to have disagreements about it and I'll explain why.

While I didn't hear the conversation, I'm just going to guess (based off of people I know who say the same thing) your coworker saying that they "don't believe in transgenderism" - first, this doesn't mean that they don't believe transgender people don't feel like they were really misgendered at birth. It means they don't believe gender is fluid and they think males are born with penises and females are born with vaginas. Gender is the same as sex. I thought they were the same once upon a time too. Then I got educated (a lot because of Jazzfanz tbh.)

I hope that I don't get attacked for what I'm about to day. I personally would and do support transgender people. I hope everyone lives their life as they see fit and does what makes them happy. I hope every kid that is transgender has a parent like BP, who might not completely getting it at first, is able to evolve his personal experiences of normality and love and support his daughter. With that being said, I also think there are some things that are different with transgender people and it's fair for people to bring it up without being labeled a bigot or transphobic r.g sports, dating, compromising situations, etc. I unknowingly went on a date with a trans female I met online. That was kept from me before our date and I think it's fair to think that should have been shared with me beforehand. While I handled it the best I think I could have, I feel like I was mislead. While some may disagree and say I'm transphobic and that doesn't matter, it absolutely does matter to me and I don't feel like there's anything wrong not being into transgender people if that's not my thing.

Anyway, I think there are opportunities on both sides of this issue to help educate people. I hate that we live in a society where everyone who's arrived at their beliefs expects others to have the same or are looked down on. People do not have your life, your experiences, your thoughts or beliefs. If we kindly educate others about issues like this, we can help plant a seed or nurture one that has already been planted.

If I go back 10 years ago, I'd make homophobic comments, and believed marriage was only between a man and a woman. Looking back on some of my beliefs I had, I cringe. I don't think I was a bad person, I was just ignorant about the LGBT community and grew up in Utah. I've changed a ton and it probably took me later than others to get to where I am and others still aren't here yet. It's because we've all had different experiences that make us who we are. Less judging, more educating - I certainly need to be better at this.

 

[Gameface]

Was the guy serious? Sometimes I/we just say **** in jest.

He was serious. He had a similarly interesting response when asked if he had a daughter and she started dating a black person.

 

[Gameface]

First, congrats to your daughter for showing the poise to come out. I’m sure it’s a brutally difficult thing with which to grapple. Societal pressures, peer pressure, ignorance, family, hell, even possible personal fears, doubts about what was/is taking place that I know I’d have. So to come out, awesome on her.

Congrats on handling this with grace and love. That’s all you can do. Educate yourself, listen, and support her. While you seem to have alluded to some ways you could have handled it better, no worries. We’re imperfect as people and parents. I’m sure you’re daughter knows your love and support for her is unwavering and that’s what matters.

Having said all that, I have some questions because I myself am not educated on the topic. Like, at all tbh. She was born a male? And then at some point started identifying as a female? At what age? Is this something that she or others would have surgery for and take hormones for? I apologize if I appear to be prying. I’m curious more than anything.

In addition, how did you handle it semi-poorly at first as you’ve mentioned. I could see me doing the same and basically having the mindset that kids are dumb as **** and that they shouldn’t jump to any conclusions about sexuality or identity as it’s such a hormonal, tricky time. Admittedly, there was a time period late in high school and early in college in which I questioned my sexuality. It wasn’t that I craved ****, lol, it has to do with other reasons. I’ll divulge them if people are curious. I guess my point is, again, it’s a tricky time and to come to a definitive conclusion about something so important could be, for lack of a better word, possibly wrong. At least at that point in time.
I feel like one should listen to one’s self but not do anything life altering til maybe 22-23 years old as we are so vulnerable at a younger age. **** can be confusing. That said, if an 18 year old is that sure about something like this, I doubt they’re “wrong” and would feel differently 4-5 years later.

Anyway, you know I think you’re a great dude. You’re highly intelligent and compassionate which are perhaps two of the most important qualities a parent could have in helping raise and support a transgender child. I hope you did not take my comments as doubtful or crossing a line or anything of that nature.

I'm on my phone at work but I'll try to respond when I get home in the morning.

 

[TroutBum]

It grinds my gears that GF even felt like he had to make this post in the first place. Then I saw The Thriller attempt to insert his mind-blowing idiocy on the very next post and my thoughts were shifted to abortion; I wish his mother would’ve been pro-choice.

Anyway, I freaking love you GameFace (I hate your new name - you’ll always be my GF) and to a lesser extent, Fish. If I were half as gay as Archie or Wes, I’d throw both of you down. Pick you up. Throw you down again.

#mancrush

 

[Gameface]

I think it's more complicated than this. I also think that both sides on this issue need to find some common ground and knowledge that they're going to have disagreements about it and I'll explain why.

While I didn't hear the conversation, I'm just going to guess (based off of people I know who say the same thing) your coworker saying that they "don't believe in transgenderism" - first, this doesn't mean that they don't believe transgender people don't feel like they were really misgendered at birth. It means, they don't believe gender is fluid and they think males are born with penises and females are born with vaginas. Gender is the same as sex. I thought they were the same once upon a time too. Then I got educated (a lot because of Jazzfanz tbh.)

I hope that I don't get attacked for what I'm about to day. I personally would and do support transgender people. I hope everyone lives their life as they see fit and does what makes them happy. I hope every kid that is transgender has a parent like BP, who might not completely getting it at first, is able to evolve his personal experiences of normality and love and support his daughter. With that being said, I also think there are some things that are different with transgender people and it's fair for people to bring it up without being labeled a bigot or transphobic r.g sports, dating, compromising situations, etc. I unknowingly went on a date with a trans female I met online. That was kept from me before our date and I think it's fair to think that should have been shared with me beforehand. While I handled it the best I think I could have, I feel like I was mislead. While some may disagree and say I'm transphobic and that doesn't matter, it absolutely does matter to me and I don't feel like there's anything wrong not being into transgender people if that's not my thing.

Anyway, I think there are opportunities on both sides of this issue to help educate people. I hate that we live in a society where everyone who's arrived at their beliefs expects others to have the same or are looked down on. People do not have your life, your experiences, your thoughts or beliefs. If we kindly educate others about issues like this, we can help plant a seed or nurture one that has already been planted.

If I go back 10 years ago, I'd make homophobic comments, and believed marriage was only between a man and a woman. Looking back on some of my beliefs I had, I cringe. I don't think I was a bad person, I was just ignorant about the LGBT community and grew up in Utah. I've changed a ton and it probably took me later than others to get to where I am and others still aren't here yet. It's because we've all had different experiences that make us who we are. Less judging, more educating - I certainly need to be better at this.

I think the trans person going on dates without disclosing that fact is putting themself in significant danger.

The hardest part of being the parent of a transgender person for me has been learning of the astronomical increase in the risk of violent assault and murder. To put it in some perspective, gay people are at a significantly greater risk of being assaulted or killed than the general public. Transgender people face many times more risk of violent assault or murder than gay people.

I don't think transgender people should date without disclosing that fact. I think they owe it to the person they are dating because it is each person's choice if that's a romantic situation they want to be in or not. But they owe it to their self to not be in that situation that could easily turn violent. Many men (in particular) might become very angry if they feel that they have been "tricked" into being attracted to what they consider a man. I just think that's an incredibly bad idea all around.

 

[Gameface]

First, congrats to your daughter for showing the poise to come out. I’m sure it’s a brutally difficult thing with which to grapple. Societal pressures, peer pressure, ignorance, family, hell, even possible personal fears, doubts about what was/is taking place that I know I’d have. So to come out, awesome on her.

Congrats on handling this with grace and love. That’s all you can do. Educate yourself, listen, and support her. While you seem to have alluded to some ways you could have handled it better, no worries. We’re imperfect as people and parents. I’m sure you’re daughter knows your love and support for her is unwavering and that’s what matters.

Having said all that, I have some questions because I myself am not educated on the topic. Like, at all tbh. She was born a male? And then at some point started identifying as a female? At what age? Is this something that she or others would have surgery for and take hormones for? I apologize if I appear to be prying. I’m curious more than anything.

In addition, how did you handle it semi-poorly at first as you’ve mentioned. I could see me doing the same and basically having the mindset that kids are dumb as **** and that they shouldn’t jump to any conclusions about sexuality or identity as it’s such a hormonal, tricky time. Admittedly, there was a time period late in high school and early in college in which I questioned my sexuality. It wasn’t that I craved ****, lol, it has to do with other reasons. I’ll divulge them if people are curious. I guess my point is, again, it’s a tricky time and to come to a definitive conclusion about something so important could be, for lack of a better word, possibly wrong. At least at that point in time.
I feel like one should listen to one’s self but not do anything life altering til maybe 22-23 years old as we are so vulnerable at a younger age. **** can be confusing. That said, if an 18 year old is that sure about something like this, I doubt they’re “wrong” and would feel differently 4-5 years later.

Anyway, you know I think you’re a great dude. You’re highly intelligent and compassionate which are perhaps two of the most important qualities a parent could have in helping raise and support a transgender child. I hope you did not take my comments as doubtful or crossing a line or anything of that nature.

My child was born a male. At some point began identifying as female. How long that had been going on before she told my wife, I don't know. But she wrote a letter to my wife because she wasn't sure how I would react. I was a little surprised by that, honestly. I wrote her a letter in return making clear how I felt and that she had my unconditional support.

It was awkward and challenging for a little while to adjust to female pronouns and to her new name. But it has become easier. Although before and after I use "kiddo" more than her name.

Like I said before, I can tell my story and it's not really my place to tell hers. I'm not going to get into any kind of details about medical stuff. What I can say is that she does have a doctor that exclusively deals with transgender patients. She's an amazing doctor who has been in the field for more than 30 years and has been around the U.S. and Europe and has worked with many other doctors and professionals in the field. So I feel lucky to have her.

I think I handled it semi-poorly not in my actions towards my daughter, really, but because I didn't really know what to do or how to relate. It has changed our relationship. I'm honestly just a lot less certain on how I should parent. I'm less of a disclapinarian than I was. My wife, on the other hand has embraced it more than I have, even still.She takes our daughter to get her hair dyed, nails done, buy clothes, etc.. She found a transgender youth support group for her and she has met most of her current friends through that group. So in a way I say I could have been better because my wife has been better. But this hasn't been easy for me. Like I said, I wished it would just go away. It wasn't something I wanted to deal with at all. It wasn't something I expected people I knew would really accept or understand. So I haven't talked about it openly until now.

I have a lot of the same feelings that all decisions should be taken carefully. I think there have been people who have identified one way and then identified another way and then sometimes identified some other way. I have no idea how common that is, but I thinks it's enough of a reason to be very deliberate in how a person deals with this type of thing. That said, my kid is nearly 18 and will be able to make her own decisions.

 

[addictionary]

It is about time.

My child, my only child, is transgender.

It is PRIDE week.

I am PROUD of my child. I LOVE my child.

I will fight and I am willing to die to protect my child's rights.

I served the U.S. Navy for rar less. And I was perfectly willing to die in my service of the U.S. Navy.

I give my life to protect my child. I am willing to sacrifice everything.

I am PROUD of my child.

If you have something to say, say it. I'm right here.

That is awesome dude. I support you and your kid 100%