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2020 Presidential election

RandyForRubio said:
So explain why the majority of states don't have an open primary for either party?
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I think there are a few arguments for restricting voting to party members. The strongest argument is most likely that permitting independents to vote could potentially sabotage the general election by nominating an unelectable candidate in the primary. A valid concern. Looking back at 2016, I might've voted for Trump in the primary hoping to sabotage the GOP for the general. Jeb Bush scared me far more than huckster Trump. However, seeing how polarized the two parties are and how extreme the right has become, I'm open to trying open primaries. I think opening up the primaries could help dilute some of the extremists in parties and help both parties nominate more moderate candidates.

I don't necessarily have a strong opinion on this issue. I'm just saying that I'd be open to opening up primaries to more (moderate) voters instead of die hards. I've been to Utah caucus nights. I've never been so scared for my life. The caucus night when I lived in Orem where incumbent Bob Bennett was ousted and Tim Bridgewater and Mike Lee were nominated was scary as hell. It was like being at a Trump rally before Trump was even a political figure. Lots of angry craziness. So anything to drown out the crazy John Birch Society Eagle Forum nutjobs in the caucuses is a good thing in my book.
 
RandyForRubio said:
Have you been following the conversation at all?

General elections are open votes to everybody. Primaries are not. Acting as if you voting for Romney is proof that the primary was an open vote, when you don't know if it was the general or primary is ridiculous.
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I was very specific in my example of being able to vote for Bernie but not a republican presidential candidate. That's what I don't like and doesn't make sense to me.

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The Thriller said:
I think there are a few arguments for restricting voting to party members. The strongest argument is most likely that permitting independents to vote could potentially sabotage the general election by nominating an unelectable candidate in the primary. A valid concern. Looking back at 2016, I might've voted for Trump in the primary hoping to sabotage the GOP for the general. Jeb Bush scared me far more than huckster Trump. However, seeing how polarized the two parties are and how extreme the right has become, I'm open to trying open primaries. I think opening up the primaries could help dilute some of the extremists in parties and help both parties nominate more moderate candidates.

I don't necessarily have a strong opinion on this issue. I'm just saying that I'd be open to opening up primaries to more (moderate) voters instead of die hards. I've been to Utah caucus nights. I've never been so scared for my life. The caucus night when I lived in Orem where incumbent Bob Bennett was ousted and Tim Bridgewater and Mike Lee were nominated was scary as hell. It was like being at a Trump rally before Trump was even a political figure. Lots of angry craziness. So anything to drown out the crazy John Birch Society Eagle Forum nutjobs in the caucuses is a good thing in my book.
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I wouldn't have huge issues with opening up the primaries, I'm just saying that I can see a lot of reasons why they wouldn't. It's not a black and white issue.

My only issue here is saying that a party is not inclusive bc of closed primaries is being close minded of all the valid reasons for doing it that way.
 
One Brow said:
Funny how trying to give equal treatment becomes "deference" to some people. Using loaded language doesn't help your look much.
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Agreed. Poor choice of words. I'll adjust it to this: The GOP is not your party if you're looking for a party that will fight for the rights of minorities.
 
Safetydan said:
Agreed. Poor choice of words. I'll adjust it to this: The GOP is not your party if you're looking for a party that will fight for the rights of minorities.
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Or women.
If you are unborn baby they will fight for you though... Right up until you are born. Then you are on your own.

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RandyForRubio said:
I wouldn't have huge issues with opening up the primaries, I'm just saying that I can see a lot of reasons why they wouldn't. It's not a black and white issue.

My only issue here is saying that a party is not inclusive bc of closed primaries is being close minded of all the valid reasons for doing it that way.
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I agree
 
In Utah, if you are registered Republican, you can choose to vote in the Republican or the Democrat primary election. I doubt few Republicans pick the Democrat option because it is rarely close enough to matter.

If you are a registered Democrat, you can only vote in the Democrat primary election.

If you are registered Unaffiliated, you can vote in the Democrat primary election, or if there are nonpartisan options you can choose a ballot with only those options. I vote by mail, and if there are nonpartisan options, I receive a letter telling me that I need to choose by mail or online which ballot I prefer.

All voters can vote in the general election. If you are registered Unaffiliated and voted for Mitt Romney for Senate, that had to be the general election. You wouldn't have had the option otherwise.

I don't like the closed Republican primaries, but I understand their reasoning, although since they have such a lock on the state it wouldn't matter anyway. If I didn't feel so strongly about being independent, I would change to Republican just to vote in the governor's race primary, but I just can't make myself align for even a day with either party.
 
JazzGal said:
In Utah, if you are registered Republican, you can choose to vote in the Republican or the Democrat primary election. I doubt few Republicans pick the Democrat option because it is rarely close enough to matter.

If you are a registered Democrat, you can only vote in the Democrat primary election.

If you are registered Unaffiliated, you can vote in the Democrat primary election, or if there are nonpartisan options you can choose a ballot with only those options. I vote by mail, and if there are nonpartisan options, I receive a letter telling me that I need to choose by mail or online which ballot I prefer.

All voters can vote in the general election. If you are registered Unaffiliated and voted for Mitt Romney for Senate, that had to be the general election. You wouldn't have had the option otherwise.

I don't like the closed Republican primaries, but I understand their reasoning, although since they have such a lock on the state it wouldn't matter anyway. If I didn't feel so strongly about being independent, I would change to Republican just to vote in the governor's race primary, but I just can't make myself align for even a day with either party.
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I don’t think it would make much of a difference in utah either. Perhaps it might force them to nominate a more moderate candidate? I mean would a guy like mike Lee be a Fix if moderate independents could vote in the republican primary? We all know the Republican candidate will win in the general election in utah. The question is, which Republican candidate? The moderate one or the crazy extremist one that seems to be winning the caucus primary at an ever increasing pace? And if not winning the nomination, at least winning the ideological battle as the moderate must now take ever increasingly extremist positions
 
fishonjazz said:
To bidens credit, at least he apologized for his stupid comment and admitted fault.

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a president who can admit a mistake? Like he’s a human being? What a crazy concept. And it’s funny to see people freaking out over this. Biden is full of gaffes. But I’ll take a president who makes a lame joke over one spewing antisemitism at a Ford plant.
 
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