Help me out.... Butler’s health concerns

[TheGoldStandard]

I think they may have had an agreement pre-draft to slide back but who knows. It was odd to move back with "your guy" on the board just to get another second rounder that you'll flip for tax savings. By all accounts the draft room "erupted" when Butler was still on the board.

Otherwise i think it was slightly short-sighted because you would have loved to have Butler on a small 4 year deal (if he works out and you have faith in him).

If you believe that hype I have a bridge to sell you. Jazz wouldn't risk 9 other teams having a chance to pick "your guy" off the board. It was a no brainer when he was still there at 40.

If you think the talent is there, you want the long-term lock-up a 1st rd pick gives you.

It was the right "spin" by the Jazz to say that, especially because many apparently believed it.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

If you believe that hype I have a bridge to sell you. Jazz wouldn't risk 9 other teams having a chance to pick "your guy" off the board. It was a no brainer when he was still there at 40.

If you think the talent is there, you want the long-term lock-up a 1st rd pick gives you.

It was the right "spin" by the Jazz to say that, especially because many apparently believed it.

That's basically what I was saying... you don't **** around for a second round pick if that is your guy. So either they liked him but weren't sure or had a deal in place pre-draft they needed to honor. In one scenario the hype they sell might be true... in the other it is overstated. I don't think anyone's intel is good enough to know what will happen in between picks 30 and 40 to know the guy they were targeting would be there.

I damn near had a panic attack in the draft thread when they passed on him the first time. I think its plausible they thought he'd already be gone and had a deal in place with Memphis (or whoever it was) to move back and got lucky. Its much more likely they liked him and 3-4 other dudes and were willing to get an asset and take whatever was left. Jared may have been the preference... then you have to sell it after (as you pointed out). Like you wouldn't tell your prom date there were 3-4 other girls you'd be just as happy taking to the dance... It was always you and only you baby... even though I waited until a week before the dance to ask.

 

[fishonjazz]

This scenario has happened before... sometimes the player becomes Malcolm Brogdon and sometimes they become Perry Jones... Kevon Looney also had a hip issue that had him slide.

I don't think it has to be super serious for teams to get spooked. I think it is an uphill battle for guys to make it in the league and they see one thing that could derail them even if they overcome all the other stuff and write the player off their board. I think there is an inefficiency we took advantage of and I think it will pay off.

didn't michael porter jr have some big issue as well?

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

didn't michael porter jr have some big issue as well?

Good call… yes… terrible back issues. He was a consensus top 5 pick. I’d say gambling on guys that dropped because of medical red flags has paid off more often than not.

 

[Ineptimusprime]

It’ll be a damn shame if we can’t find minutes for Butler. Dude is clearly an NBA player.

If nothing else, it should make it easy to offload Clarkson if we need to pivot at the deadline.

We have too many guards and bigs and not nearly enough playable 3s.

 

[infection]

Good call… yes… terrible back issues. He was a consensus top 5 pick. I’d say gambling on guys that dropped because of medical red flags has paid off more often than not.

You may get a few Borchardts every now and again.

 

[gandalfe]

Jonathan Bender went 5. Was he supposed to go higher? Or are you talking about John Bender? Because that guy had a lot of red flags between substance abuse, truancy, an attitude problem, and not being able to finish jokes about naked blondes with poodles and salamis walking into a bar.

Didn't he get a scholarship?

 

[infection]

Didn't he get a scholarship?

I think he was just trying out for one.

 

[gandalfe]

I think he was just trying out for one.

Screws fall out all the time, the world is an imperfect place.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

You may get a few Borchardts every now and again.

Yeah there are a few but I’m not sure that guy is great even if the foot works. When they can’t play I guess you’ll never know. I’m fine risking a Borchadt in the 20s… hell I make take that over a Bradley.

 

[bombastic]

Complete speculation I dont have insider information.
For heart, the only condition that I can think of that can be a concern one day but you are cleared to play professional sports a few months later is some form of arrhythmia. Most likely a-fibs but there are other conditions too. It is not uncommon and usually not life-threatening. Many players have it and had good careers (LaMarcus Aldrige).

For knee who knows it could be 20 different things. Considering he is playing it was not ACL. One thing that would be concerning with the knee is if he had the meniscus completely removed. Usually very rarely done today in orthopedic surgery. This is the condition where he would be able to play today and feel no pain but in 3-4 years he would be out of the league (Bradon Roy).

 

[infection]

Complete speculation I dont have insider information.
For heart, the only condition that I can think of that can be a concern one day but you are cleared to play professional sports a few months later is some form of arrhythmia. Most likely a-fibs but there are other conditions too. It is not uncommon and usually not life-threatening. Many players have it and had good careers (LaMarcus Aldrige).

For knee who knows it could be 20 different things. Considering he is playing it was not ACL. One thing that would be concerning with the knee is if he had the meniscus completely removed. Usually very rarely done today in orthopedic surgery. This is the condition where he would be able to play today and feel no pain but in 3-4 years he would be out of the league (Bradon Roy).

He may have an underlying benign rhythm issue but it is not AFib. LMA does not have AFib but a rare condition called Wolff Parkinson White.

 

[Thee Idiotic Minivan K]

I mean the Jazz even dodged him as long as they possibly could.

This scenario has happened before... sometimes the player becomes Malcolm Brogdon

I'm not sure what the knee issue is but I think that type of red flag is common. The heart thing is likely the one that scared more people because it might be a Bosh type of thing where he just flat out can't play.

I can't recall anyone with two red flags either... if the heart is good I think the knee issue isn't one to worry about too much early in his career. If he ends up having issues I think its later in his career.

It’ll be a damn shame if we can’t find minutes for Butler. Dude is clearly an NBA player.

If nothing else, it should make it easy to offload Clarkson if we need to pivot at the deadline.

We have too many guards and bigs and not nearly enough playable 3s.

Relax man. If Butler really is this good he’ll get his minutes. Not worried

 

[framer]

Yeah there are a few but I’m not sure that guy is great even if the foot works. When they can’t play I guess you’ll never know. I’m fine risking a Borchadt in the 20s… hell I make take that over a Bradley.

Borchardt healthy would have been a Hell of a player.

 

[jazzfan1132]

He plays carrefully, no dunks, no flashes. Look like he knows game well and because of knees/heart game slows down for him. He has established position already
Another Thing is Quin gives him minutes.

 

[Thee Idiotic Minivan K]

Borchardt healthy would have been a Hell of a player.

I’m confused, he never looked good, even before his health issues, he looked mechanicalin his movements, just another big stiff in a long line of big stuffs from that era

 

[NAOS]

Look like he knows game well and because of knees/heart game slows down for him.

What the **** are you talking about?

 

[jazzfan1132]

What the **** are you talking about?

have you ever play basketball in games after being hurt on knees? if not you never understand this. He slows down because he can and want play like that. the worst thing for him is being INJ now. In Spurs game he didn't take dunk and get layup.

 

[NAOS]

have you ever play basketball in games after being hurt on knees? if not you never understand this. He slows down because he can and want play like that. the worst thing for him is being INJ now. In Spurs game he didn't take dunk and get layup.

Have you ever played at the D1 or professional levels? Don’t give me your pick-up-bball philosophy.

Butler has excellent change-of-speed athleticism. That puts as much or more stress on the knees as leaping does.

Etc.

 

[framer]

I’m confused, he never looked good, even before his health issues, he looked mechanicalin his movements, just another big stiff in a long line of big stuffs from that era

He could rebound, play defense, and score at an NBA level. In the era that was a damn good center. The Jazz have rarely had a center who could do all three. Do you remember the bullcrap we put up with at center until Memo?