Will Burks and Kanter get contract extensions?

[franklin]

We haven't complained enough about burks being benched and only getting 30 minutes per game. Let's do more of this thing.

 

[da ThRONe]

Yup.
He was corbined

What player on the team wasn't except for maybe Hayward(and you could make a case that he was by virtue of being asked to do too much)

 

[fishonjazz]

We haven't complained enough about burks being benched and only getting 30 minutes per game. Let's do more of this thing.

30 minutes per game?

Im gonna need a link to this info cause i looked it up and what i found tells me you are wrong

 

[jimmy eat jazz]

Yup.
He was corbined

This brings up a question. How much of defensive efficiency is a product of:

1. Individual defensive skills
2. Effort
3. Defensive scheme/coaching

The fact that Charlotte managed to create a (I think) top third defense this last year with Jefferson manning the post, leads me to believe that perhaps the strongest factor explaining the Jazz defensive woes these last seasons is the defensive scheme/coaching. Aside from perhaps Kanter, I don't see any of the remaining C4 who seem to me to be inherently weak defenders. Put them in a good system, give them good coaching, and I suspect we'll see significant improvements, probably even Kanter too.

 

[GVC]

Yup.
He was corbined

Burks has good length. He's a twig though. Neither Burks nor Hayward can handle physical wings. It would be awesome if people would allow for the possibility that not everything is Corbin's fault.

Bradley beal and ariza are not alot different than burks and hayward as far as size and athleticism imo and thier team had a nice playoff run iirc.

In fact i consider burks to have more physical tools (wingspan, reach, quickness, vertical) than beal.

Beal is bigger, stronger than Burks. Same goes for Ariza and Hayward (with strength anyway). They're a much better defensive combo AND can fill roles as decent spot-up shooters. You wouldn't trade Gordo and Alec for Beal and Ariza?

 

[fishonjazz]

Burks has good length. He's a twig though. Neither Burks nor Hayward can handle physical wings. It would be awesome if people would allow for the possibility that not everything is Corbin's fault.

Beal is bigger, stronger than Burks. Same goes for Ariza and Hayward (with strength anyway). They're a much better defensive combo AND can fill roles as decent spot-up shooters. You wouldn't trade Gordo and Alec for Beal and Ariza?

I would trade burks for beal but not for defensive reasons (which is what we were discussing)..... beal will be an elite shooter. And even in that trade i would be worried that with a new coach and larger role burks has a chance to be the better player.

I would take hayward over ariza. Ariza is better right now mainly due to experience. Once gordon gets 10 years under his belt, i believe he will be the better player.

I still maintain that on paper, lookinh simply at physical attributes, hayward/burks SHOULD BE = beal/ariza defensively.

I believe that coaching does make a difference in this instance.

 

[GVC]

The fact that Charlotte managed to create a (I think) top third defense this last year with Jefferson manning the post, leads me to believe that perhaps the strongest factor explaining the Jazz defensive woes these last seasons is the defensive scheme/coaching. Aside from perhaps Kanter, I don't see any of the remaining C4 who seem to me to be inherently weak defenders. Put them in a good system, give them good coaching, and I suspect we'll see significant improvements, probably even Kanter too.

Burke-Burks-Gordo is a disaster defensively. Burke is an inherently bad defender. Burks and Gordo are inherently bad defenders against physical wing players. It's not 1983 anymore...strength matters.

MKG and Gerald Henderson provided plenty of resistance on the perimeter for Charlotte.

 

[fishonjazz]

Beal is bigger, stronger than Burks. Same goes for Ariza and Hayward (with strength anyway).

Just looked it up.
Espn says:
Alec burks 6 foot 6 inches and 211 lbs
Bradley beal 6 foot 5 inches and 207

Gordon hayward 6 foot 8 and 220
Ariza 6 foot 8 and 220.

Plus i know that burks has more length, speed/quickness, and hops than beal.

On paper burks and hayward should be as good as beal and ariza on defense..... maybe even better.


Edit: haywards muscles appear bigger than arizas too

 

[jimmy eat jazz]

Burke-Burks-Gordo is a disaster defensively. Burke is an inherently bad defender. Burks and Gordo are inherently bad defenders against physical wing players. It's not 1983 anymore...strength matters.

MKG and Gerald Henderson provided plenty of resistance on the perimeter for Charlotte.

Perhaps so, but I think it's premature to reach this conclusion until we see them in a different scheme with improved coaching.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

I would trade burks for beal but not for defensive reasons (which is what we were discussing)..... beal will be an elite shooter. And even in that trade i would be worried that with a new coach and larger role burks has a chance to be the better player.

I would take hayward over ariza. Ariza is better right now mainly due to experience. Once gordon gets 10 years under his belt, i believe he will be the better player.

I still maintain that on paper, lookinh simply at physical attributes, hayward/burks SHOULD BE = beal/ariza defensively.

I believe that coaching does make a difference in this instance.

Holy lol.

Beal >>>>>>>>>>>>> Burks.

 

[GVC]

Just looked it up.
Espn says:
Alec burks 6 foot 6 inches and 211 lbs
Bradley beal 6 foot 5 inches and 207

Gordon hayward 6 foot 8 and 220
Ariza 6 foot 8 and 220.

Plus i know that burks has more length, speed/quickness, and hops than beal.

On paper burks and hayward should be as good as beal and ariza on defense..... maybe even better.


Edit: haywards muscles appear bigger than arizas too

Do Gordo and Alec play strong in games? Did you miss this season? Do you really think Burke-Burks-Gordo on the perimeter is ever getting you close to a title?

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Just looked it up.
Espn says:
Alec burks 6 foot 6 inches and 211 lbs
Bradley beal 6 foot 5 inches and 207

Gordon hayward 6 foot 8 and 220
Ariza 6 foot 8 and 220.

Plus i know that burks has more length, speed/quickness, and hops than beal.

On paper burks and hayward should be as good as beal and ariza on defense..... maybe even better.


Edit: haywards muscles appear bigger than arizas too

Weight and strength are 2 different things.

 

[fishonjazz]

Do Gordo and Alec play strong in games? Did you miss this season? Do you really think Burke-Burks-Gordo on the perimeter is ever getting you close to a title?

Weight and strength are 2 different things.

Gvc said that ariza and beal are bigger than burks and hayward and i looked it up on espn.
Espn disagrees so get at them dog.

@ cy
Who has won in weightlifting and armwrestleling events between ariza burks hayward and beal?
Was it televised?

 

[fishonjazz]

Do you really think Burke-Burks-Gordo on the perimeter is ever getting you close to a title?

Not really
So maybe burke is the one that needs to go
Wizards are doing well with smaller players than burks and hayward at the wings so maybe we would be fine with burks and hayward as well if we draft exum to play point and have favors and another good defender (gobert?) down low

 

[GVC]

Not really
So maybe burke is the one that needs to go
Wizards are doing well with smaller players than burks and hayward at the wings so maybe we would be fine with burks and hayward as well if we draft exum to play point and have favors and another good defender (gobert?) down low

Gobert-Favors-Gordo-Alec-Exum? Bottom 10 offense and defense. ****ing brilliant.

The young talent on the Jazz simply isn't that good. If the Jazz keep all 5 of Trey, Alec, Gordo, Kanter and Favors, and it costs them $50mm+ to do so, they're ****ed. I'd be shopping Trey, Kanter and Gordo pretty hard.

 

[fishonjazz]

Gobert-Favors-Gordo-Alec-Exum? Bottom 10 offense and defense. ****ing brilliant.

The young talent on the Jazz simply isn't that good. If the Jazz keep all 5 of Trey, Alec, Gordo, Kanter and Favors, and it costs them $50mm+ to do so, they're ****ed. I'd be shopping Trey, Kanter and Gordo pretty hard.

Yo gvc...my arguement is simply this:
Burks/hayward are not worse defensively than beal/ariza due to size.

I think the fact that burks and hayward are bigger than ariza and beal proves that i am correct.

I am in no way argueing that burks and hayward are a better basketball playing combo than ariza and beal.

Though with the right coach and more experience we have no way of knowing

 

[fishonjazz]

Holy lol.

Beal >>>>>>>>>>>>> Burks.

Holy lol
I said i would trade burks for beal.
And i have stated that i would rather have beal than burks multiple times in multiple threads.

Dat reading comprehension doe.

 

[GVC]

Yo gvc...my arguement is simply this:
Burks/hayward are not worse defensively than beal/ariza due to size.

I think the fact that burks and hayward are bigger than ariza and beal proves that i am correct.

They're worse because of strength, primarily. Again, neither can handle physical wing players. Alec is a ball watcher who gets buried on screens all the damn time. Gordo is incredibly slow rotating and closing out on shooters (no doubt, partly due to his poor foot speed). Will they get better? Sure, but so will other young players. If those two are starting at the 2 and 3, you'd better have some pretty ****ing talented players at the 1, 4 and 5 if you're actually trying to win games.

I just don't understand why people want this team to hold onto and overpay mediocre talent.

 

[Stoked]

Holy lol
I said i would trade burks for beal.
And i have stated that i would rather have beal than burks multiple times in multiple threads.

Dat reading comprehension doe.

Haha

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Holy lol
I said i would trade burks for beal.
And i have stated that i would rather have beal than burks multiple times in multiple threads.

Dat reading comprehension doe.

All I'm saying is Beal is way better and there is no chance Burks ever becomes better.

Dat reading comprehension doe.