Jazz a middling franchise?

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The organization did a terrible job finding leadership to fill the power vacuum created when LHM died and then Sloan retired. That's not an easy thing from which to recover, but, all things considered, I still give them a low grade. Hopefully Lindsey and Snyder are the real deal. There's a lot riding on that.

 

[Fishsticks]

The OP linked only to an article that rates San Antonio number one. It says nothing whatsoever about Utah. We are complaining that the Jazz are rated as middling and we don't even know anything about their rating? How about linking to the article that rates the Jazz?

They changed my link. If in the future something is interesting enough for you to write a paragraph about how there is not a correct link, perhaps you should use your fat little fingers and look yourself.

https://espn.go.com/sportsnation/teamrankings/_/sport/nba#table

 

[Growlor]

 

[Ferguson_Mellochill]

I think the Jazz are in good shape going forward, in part because I really believe in Exum, Burks, Kanter and Gobert. I also believe the management is all pulling in the same direction.

I would be open to trading Hayward.

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

They changed my link. If in the future something is interesting enough for you to write a paragraph about how there is not a correct link, perhaps you should use your fat little fingers and look yourself.

https://espn.go.com/sportsnation/teamrankings/_/sport/nba#table

How can you ever forgive me for clicking on your link and not figuring out that ESPN was playing a trick on you? And by the way, my fingers are neither fat nor little.

 

[franklin]

https://espn.go.com/sportsnation/st...urs/san-antonio-spurs-no-1-ultimate-standings

Always thought the org was one of the best...I mean the Spurs copied the Jazz model and then of course improved on it, but still.

Wake the **** up bro. It's all a formula based on perception. They sell what we want to hear, year after year. There's no innovative thinking at the top. It's all about copying a model and selling it to fans. Think about it. How many times did Larry let slip that they needed to make playoff revenue to hit his targeted ROI?

Millers don't care about championships and they screwed over two of the best and most dedicated and loyal players ever in the name of profits. LHM said as much.

 

[cowhide]

https://espn.go.com/sportsnation/st...urs/san-antonio-spurs-no-1-ultimate-standings

Always thought the org was one of the best...I mean the Spurs copied the Jazz model and then of course improved on it, but still.

Everybody loves a winner. I don't know how they judged franchises but being in the middle is pretty good considering how bad the Jazz were last year. Rarely being on TV certainly impacts the ranking. The Spurs deserve the #1 ranking, they are a class organization and it is nice to see that they are getting kudos for playing great basketball. For years announcers were calling them boring, but if you are a basketball fan their performance in last years finals was for the ages. Hopefully, the Jazz can copy the Spurs model and have some of the same success in the future.

 

[cowhide]

I think the Jazz are in good shape going forward, in part because I really believe in Exum, Burks, Kanter and Gobert. I also believe the management is all pulling in the same direction.

I would be open to trading Hayward.

I don't know who would take him with the contract he just signed. Personally, I wouldn't trade him now. I think all these guys are going to perform better with Synder as the head coach. No he isn't the miracle man but just some of his comments about running and passing more makes me think Quinn has a plan.

 

[Fishsticks]

Wake the **** up bro. It's all a formula based on perception. They sell what we want to hear, year after year. There's no innovative thinking at the top. It's all about copying a model and selling it to fans. Think about it. How many times did Larry let slip that they needed to make playoff revenue to hit his targeted ROI?

Millers don't care about championships and they screwed over two of the best and most dedicated and loyal players ever in the name of profits. LHM said as much.

1. San Antonio Spurs 1 8 1 1 3 18 1 1 5
2. Memphis Grizzlies 4 6 13 32 1 2 6 68 62
3. Oklahoma City Thunder 7 9 14 25 23 27 10 88 47
4. Dallas Mavericks 9 49 5 13 19 11 14 10 17
5. Indiana Pacers 18 1 65 30 8 25 92 66 68
6. Charlotte Hornets 29 27 30 56 14 45 41 33 79
7. Portland Trail Blazers 33 41 27 29 53 32 20 40 64
8. Miami Heat 34 62 20 16 65 43 35 45 24
9. Atlanta Hawks 48 37 46 72 28 83 45 38 94
10. Houston Rockets 49 46 70 44 54 50 68 89 45
11. Golden State Warriors 52 42 29 76 80 73 25 85 72
12. Chicago Bulls 53 86 41 61 87 52 8 11 35
13. Los Angeles Clippers 59 50 68 107 68 77 28 15 63
14. Phoenix Suns 64 74 69 78 59 82 40 30 92
15. New Orleans Pelicans 65 45 75 65 35 96 85 94 81
TEAM RNK BNG FRL OWN AFF STX PLA CCH TTR
16. Boston Celtics 66 111 52 41 75 75 61 54 28
17. Utah Jazz 68 89 55 39 27 58 87 101 102

Don't know bro, Hard to sell me ATL, CHA, NO and likely a few others are a better run organization than the Jazz. Winning does account for these ranking which does hurt, but only a few mistakes IMO and those being holding onto Corbin for so long and not flipping assets when we obviously had no intention of keeping them (Al, Paul, Mwill). We are rebuilding and everyone knows it. Loses are to be expected.

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

Wake the **** up bro. It's all a formula based on perception. They sell what we want to hear, year after year. There's no innovative thinking at the top. It's all about copying a model and selling it to fans. Think about it. How many times did Larry let slip that they needed to make playoff revenue to hit his targeted ROI?

Millers don't care about championships and they screwed over two of the best and most dedicated and loyal players ever in the name of profits. LHM said as much.

The fact that profitability mattered to Larry is not evidence that he was not in it to win a championship. His fire and passion for winning was obvious to anyone who was not so busy reading between the lines that they miss the obvious in the process.

Larry was a self made billionaire because of his attention to the numbers. That was a strength, not a weakness, of the way he ran his businesses and his team.

 

[franklin]

Don't know bro, Hard to sell me ATL, CHA, NO and likely a few others are a better run organization than the Jazz. Winning does account for these ranking which does hurt, but only a few mistakes IMO and those being holding onto Corbin for so long and not flipping assets when we obviously had no intention of keeping them (Al, Paul, Mwill). We are rebuilding and everyone knows it. Loses are to be expected.

I'm not talking about only the last couple years. Name me a single thing the Jazz have done that's not only taking a chance but doing it in an innovative way. They play it safe every time and try to sell playoff tickets. It's burned us with them not willing to think outside the box, especially when it comes to young white boys with promise. We were tanking last year and everyone knew Hayward would get a huge offer. They couldn't have traded him for assets and improved lotto position? Then signed Bledsoe and Stevenson? When was the last time a Baron Davis was brought in? Never.

Greg already told us the Jazz will never go into the luxury tax as long as his family owners them. It's a business and they are playing fans like fools.

 

[franklin]

The fact that profitability mattered to Larry is not evidence that he was not in it to win a championship. His fire and passion for winning was obvious to anyone who was not so busy reading between the lines that they miss the obvious in the process.

Larry was a self made billionaire because of his attention to the numbers. That was a strength, not a weakness, of the way he ran his businesses and his team.

Cool story bro but I've already heard this from Larry's pr machine a million times.

 

[Hotdog]

Lol

Wft?

Why is franklin now on the bash Larry Miller train?

 

[//r00t 4 Jazz]

Greg already told us the Jazz will never go into the luxury tax as long as his family owners them. It's a business and they are playing fans like fools.

I'm pretty sure you're just trollin' for a reaction.

With that said I never heard or read those quotes from Greg about never going into the luxury tax (but I think his dad may have said something to that effect) however if he did say that I think I understand your hatred because that would make him a LIAR! In his first two seasons taking over (the first his dad was still a live) he went over the tax, so how can you trust a liar..... well that is assuming you are correct that Greg did say that and that you're not a liar.

 

[//r00t 4 Jazz]

Oh and I haven't read the article but to say the Jazz are a "middling" franchise, if you just base on the post DWill era than from a national perspective I would have to agree. Going back to when the franchise moved to Utah then no, I would have to say they are at worst a top 10 franchise. I do think the Jazz have overcome a lot at once and it takes time to recover from that and I think they are doing a good job at it, not perfect by any stretch not close to it but a good job still.

Oh and whoever mentioned ATL as being better run, Danny Ferry and soon to be ex majority owner would like you to call them, I think they're interested in working for you. You also included the Pelicans as better run I would not think so and not even close, however they did get the Saints owner so things could be trending up with him running the show now.

 

[franklin]

I'm pretty sure you're just trollin' for a reaction.

With that said I never heard or read those quotes from Greg about never going into the luxury tax (but I think his dad may have said something to that effect) however if he did say that I think I understand your hatred because that would make him a LIAR! In his first two seasons taking over (the first his dad was still a live) he went over the tax, so how can you trust a liar..... well that is assuming you are correct that Greg did say that and that you're not a liar.

How many of these do the Millers send out to cover their slip ups? "Heyhey never said that" is the best they could come up with?

 

[silesian]

In the last 3 years The Jazz appear to have been more interested in managing the cap than creating a winning team.

The salary cap has been completely irrelevant the last 3 years. They have focused on accumulation of assets and young talent. One certainly can argue how effective they have been at this.

But the salary cap????

 

[silesian]

I've always argued that under LHM the franchise was not committed to winning a championship. They were trying to financially survive. As a result, they did not invest in building a quality supporting cast in the late 80s/ early 90s.

 

[Stifle Tower]

It's been a rough time going since the Jazz let Boozer go for Al Jefferson. Think about it. We lost our franchise player for...uh...Favors? Kanter? Two guys that led us to the worst record in the West. Our top 10 pick is an undersized PG. We just drafted a HUGE project at #5. We will probably be a top 5 team again this next year. We are still 2-3 years away from contending...for a playoff spot. Sloan quit and Corbin sucked.

In all seriousness, what was the one move the last 5 years that screams we are headed in the right direction? What happens if Exum busts out? If Exum doesn't turn into a superstar, we are the Timberwolves or Kings.

We are right there teetering on the line of team with a plan who will be amazing in 5 years and horrible run franchise stuck in the lottery for the next 5 years.

Our future for the next 5-10 years rests in Exum and our pick this next year's hands. Crazy.

Well, the trade of Deron was really the defining point.
But would you say the Lakers after Magic left, or the Celtics after Bird or Bulls after MJ were "middling franchises?"
ALL teams have to go through periods of rebuilding. Even SA will have to rebuild once Parker, Duncan and "Pops" are gone.

Yep. We have a lot of hope tied up in Exum. But isn't that the case with all teams that draft a top-5 pick? What if Wiggins, Parker or Gordon are busts? What happens if Noel and Embiid don't come back strong from their injuries and develop?

I think there are a LOT of reasons to be excited and optimistic about the future. But if you are so miserable, why don't you just chase the team du jour? Go be a Cavs fan.

 

[Stifle Tower]

Wake the **** up bro. It's all a formula based on perception. They sell what we want to hear, year after year. There's no innovative thinking at the top. It's all about copying a model and selling it to fans. Think about it. How many times did Larry let slip that they needed to make playoff revenue to hit his targeted ROI?

Millers don't care about championships and they screwed over two of the best and most dedicated and loyal players ever in the name of profits. LHM said as much.

Yes, LHM did say on a few occasions he would not exceed the luxury tax. He did give Stockton and Malone weak benches at times. But Utah TRIED to make some bold moves. However, for various reasons, most of them cultural, many players just did not want to play for Utah, even when they were very close to a championship (e.g Seikaly and Harper).

LHM DID exceed the luxury tax to keep Millsap. That was put in motion before Greg took over. He opened his pocketbook to put together what looked like a very good squad in Williams, Okur, Boozer and AK. Of course, we learned neither Carlos nor Andrei had the physical or mental toughness to make a legitimate championship run.

I think we've just been too spoiled by 25 years of very good teams. Now some don't have the patience to go through a rebuild. Please, go ahead and show me any other franchise that HASN'T needed to rebuild. Only case you might make is for the SA Spurs after '89/'90. Amazing luck...the one year they completely "suck" they get the #1 pick and add Duncan.