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Jazz and Knicks discussing Donovan Mitchell trade per Shams Charania and Tony Jones


Coach Ellis

Well-Known Member
That's possible and I'm not saying we should definitely go after Barrett(I personally am lower on him than most so I wouldn't do it)... but what I'm saying is - IF they actually have super high valuation on him and they think very highly of him and think he can actually be a star in this league, I'm good with getting him in the trade package.
Great thoughts, and I agree completely. I can see the concern in paying Barrett - even though the cap is going to go up - it’s still a lot of money to invest in a guy unless you’re 100% convinced he’s going to take the next step up in his development. If that’s the case, then you should absolutely try to get him and pay him.
 


Coach Ellis

Well-Known Member
I’m glad you brought up SGA and the Thunder. They sit him as much as they can get away with because they have to try really hard to lose. They are actually a pretty competitive team when they’re not pulling ****.

I’m not trying to pull **** on the actual floor. I think tanking starts becoming shameful when the coaching staff has to pull **** to lose games and I’m not looking for that, personally. I also think that’s where the arguments of how tanking has a negative influence on winning culture and habits starts to have merit.

OKC ****ed up when they didn’t go more scorched earth in the CP3 season. Their rebuild is taking longer than it had to because they missed their opportunity to lean into being organically bad and getting to the top of the draft earlier.

On the topic of RJ; he just isn’t in play. He probably costs two unprotected 1sts in the deal and that is an absolute, 1000% non-starter.
Tanking should be a front office decision. As far as coaching goes, they can decided to emphasize young player development over winning with veterans - but that gets messy. Coaches should coach to win - players should play to win. Those two elements of a team should never actively try to lose.

If a front office is worried that a guy will help them win too many games instead of allowing the coach to develop young guys, then they should trade him for whatever they can get. You tank by bottoming out your talent level and then work to get the assets to build it back up again.

That’s what I think the Jazz are going to do.
 

Elizah Huge

Respect All, Fear None
Contributor
I’m glad you brought up SGA and the Thunder. They sit him as much as they can get away with because they have to try really hard to lose. They are actually a pretty competitive team when they’re not pulling ****.

I’m not trying to pull **** on the actual floor. I think tanking starts becoming shameful when the coaching staff has to pull **** to lose games and I’m not looking for that, personally. I also think that’s where the arguments of how tanking has a negative influence on winning culture and habits starts to have merit.

OKC ****ed up when they didn’t go more scorched earth in the CP3 season. Their rebuild is taking longer than it had to because they missed their opportunity to lean into being organically bad and getting to the top of the draft earlier.

On the topic of RJ; he just isn’t in play. He probably costs two unprotected 1sts in the deal and that is an absolute, 1000% non-starter.

I’d much rather have Barrett than two firsts. Our best case scenario is one of those picks end up in the top-3 and we get a player like Barrett. Come on here what are we even talking about guys. Let’s stop it with this crazy obsession with picks and zero functional players. They’re awesome but at some point we need to be realistic. We received plenty from Minnesota and we have our own too. We will have plenty more coming from a Donovan deal plus all of the other vets we have to deal. We do not pass on Barrett or Herro for two picks. That’s ridiculous.
 

Elizah Huge

Respect All, Fear None
Contributor
I would think asking for Barrett would be more of a negotiating tactic than a true desire to obtain him. It gives the Knicks something to hold out for. Similar to how the Jazz were reportedly interested in Jaden McDaniels and then came off that position in the final deal. Regardless, I still think the Knicks deal will come around to something acceptable to Danny Ainge and Donovan is most likely going to end up in New York this next season.

Except Barrett is much better than McDaniels.
 

default

Well-Known Member
Lets say the value of RJ Barrett right now is about 2 1st round picks. What would you rather do - rehab/develop his value into something similar to what Donovan's value is now or try to rehab/develop the value of someone like... Beasley? IMO there is much more value and potential in developing Barrett than there is in trying to rehab some random fringe rotational player into legit rotational player(aka one 1st round pick). IMO the return on someone like Barrett would be stronger than the random rehabilitation projects teams usually take on into 20-25M salary cap space.

I also think you are overestimating the impact of single players on really bad teams. Even players as good as SGA couldn't make OKC a competitive team. IMO if we trade most of our good vets for picks we would be bad enough for it to not affect our lottery odds a ton. And the little it will affect it will be worth it in case you actually hit big on one of those players.
I'm just curious. Am I the only person on this board that actually likes Beasley as a player? I see a lot of talent and someone who is only 25 years old and has been a 20+ points a game scorer already. He had an off the court incident that seems to have people forgetting how talented he actually is.
 

Coach Ellis

Well-Known Member
I'm just curious. Am I the only person on this board that actually likes Beasley as a player? I see a lot of talent and someone who is only 25 years old and has been a 20+ points a game scorer already. He had an off the court incident that seems to have people forgetting how talented he actually is.
I like him too, but I think in the Jazz current state he’s going to be more valuable as an asset. With that said, I think it’s entirely likely that he gets traded at the deadline this year due to his contract situation - which is incredibly favorable for the Jazz.

Wouldn’t complain if he was in a trade for Westbrook either.
 

sip

Well-Known Member
I like him too, but I think in the Jazz current state he’s going to be more valuable as an asset. With that said, I think it’s entirely likely that he gets traded at the deadline this year due to his contract situation - which is incredibly favorable for the Jazz.

Wouldn’t complain if he was in a trade for Westbrook either.

We are definitely the perfect team to rehab his value. Whether we keep Donovan to start the season or not he is in a position to succeed. Paired with Donovan he is a great fit at the 2 offensively because he is such a good spot up shooter. Without Donovan he is going to be force fed shots so 20+ pts a game is highly likely.
 

Coach Ellis

Well-Known Member
We are definitely the perfect team to rehab his value. Whether we keep Donovan to start the season or not he is in a position to succeed. Paired with Donovan he is a great fit at the 2 offensively because he is such a good spot up shooter. Without Donovan he is going to be force fed shots so 20+ pts a game is highly likely.
Plus his contract is perfect for the Jazz to extract maximum value as it operates as a 2 year bargain deal if he breaks out, or as a $15 million expiring if a team wants to decline his option next year to open up additional cap space.

Jazz have plenty of time to sit and wait to see how he performs before they decide what to do with him. They could flip him now if the value is there, or hold him and see how he does in a starting/leadership role before making a move.
 

TheStormofWar

Well-Known Member
According to Katz, if the tampering evidence is pretty egregious, the Knicks may lose a 1st, if not more. And, let's be honest here, this is the Knicks. I really am suspecting the investigation needs to wrap prior to a Mitchell deal being done.
 

Keefe

Well-Known Member
I think that the Jazz are hanging onto the other role players until a decision is made with Don (imo). If others are cleared out then everyone knows we don't want to re-tool and run it back, and the negotiating price/tactics worsen.

Once Donovan is gone, Conley + Bojan + Clarkson will shortly follow.

- George
I’d much rather have Barrett than two firsts. Our best case scenario is one of those picks end up in the top-3 and we get a player like Barrett. Come on here what are we even talking about guys. Let’s stop it with this crazy obsession with picks and zero functional players. They’re awesome but at some point we need to be realistic. We received plenty from Minnesota and we have our own too. We will have plenty more coming from a Donovan deal plus all of the other vets we have to deal. We do not pass on Barrett or Herro for two picks. That’s ridiculous.

That’s not best case. Best case is we draft top 3 and get someone better than Barrett.
 


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