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John Stockton Claims He Had Proof of 1000 Athletes Dying of Vaccine

You tell me what I'm speculating and provide the actual quote seeing how I didnt speculate a single thing. The only ones speculating are you all thinking I'm speculating.
You posted that the heart attack was "sketchy" after 1) another poster said that it was a direct result of the vaccine, and 2) you've posted other antivax positions. The potential for conflation should have been obvious. You're pretense at innocence is unconvincing.
 
You really think that people are basing their decisions on something John Stockton said? By the time he said this people have already made up their minds. I find the argument ridiculous.
Tell me you understand nothing about what motivates people without saying it directly.
 
... and how it was unconstitutionally mandated.
How was it unconstitutionally mandated (by that, I mean described when and where is was mandated, and why that mandate was unconstitutional)? You've repeated that claim often, but offered no examples of it. Can you support what you claim, or are you full of hot air?
 
This sounds like he missed most of the 2010s and 2000s.
What happened in 2000-2019 that made people this hateful, not with just strangers but with family members and loved ones? I honestly do not recall a situation that resulted in this type of intense dislike of someone else.

Even after all of which has happened, people in this forum and many other places online and in human to human interactions (work place, church, social groups) are vile to each other.

The election of Trump or Obama, weapons of mass destruction, tea party, Obamacare, none of this has created the hatred that has come with Covid. People could still socially support a friend who voted for a different party. It was polarizing but not what it’s like now.

From the start of lockdowns, people took up a side, not a political tribe but more financially driven. People who didn’t loose a job against a business forced to close or laid-off employees. Then policy decisions, which not all of these are political tribes either… Maskers vs Non maskers, therapeutics/vitamins/ivermectin vs misinformation, vax or natural immunity, mandate vs choice. Citizen vs Ruler (rules for me not for them).

Everyone lost patience for the other side and still are throwing mud and stones at each other. Trying to group people together without knowing their intentions or heart. Maybe someone is deeply concerned that people could be getting myocarditis from the vaccine; the same way someone is deeply concerned for people who have not received the vaccine.

I really don’t know what happened before that you suggested that was this bad.
 
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What happened in 2000-2019 that made people this hateful, not with just strangers but with family members and loved ones? I honestly do not recall a situation that resulted in this type of intense dislike of someone else.
No one event, but there has been a deliberate campaign to increase the partisanship in this country since Gingrich in 1994.

The election of Trump or Obama, weapons of mass destruction, tea party, Obamacare, none of this has created the hatred that has come with Covid.
Online, I saw increasing levels of hatred at the elections of both Obama and Trump. To a lesser degree, GWB. Covid19 may have accelerated the process slightly, but it's been building for over 2 decades.

I really don’t know what happened before that you suggested that was this bad.
For a couple of decades, I've been told I supported child murder (vaccination), pedophilia (LGBTQ+ positions), and racial hatred (hope that's obvious). In my personal life, I have seen no increased animosity, but I have a small social circle. All this is nothing new to me.
 
What happened in 2000-2019 that made people this hateful, not with just strangers but with family members and loved ones? I honestly do not recall a situation that resulted in this type of intense dislike of someone else.

Even after all of which has happened, people in this forum and many other places online and in human to human interactions (work place, church, social groups) are vile to each other.

The election of Trump or Obama, weapons of mass destruction, tea party, Obamacare, none of this has created the hatred that has come with Covid. People could still socially support a friend who voted for a different party. It was polarizing but not what it’s like now.

From the start of lockdowns, people took up a side, not a political tribe but more financially driven. People who didn’t loose a job against a business forced to close or laid-off employees. Then policy decisions, which not all of these are political tribes either… Maskers vs Non maskers, therapeutics/vitamins/ivermectin vs misinformation, vax or natural immunity, mandate vs choice. Citizen vs Ruler (rules for me not for them).

Everyone lost patience for the other side and still are throwing mud and stones at each other. Trying to group people together without knowing their intentions or heart. Maybe someone is deeply concerned that people could be getting myocarditis from the vaccine; the same way someone is deeply concerned for people who have not received the vaccine.

I really don’t know what happened before that you suggested that was this bad.
Should be painfully obvious. The Internet and the rise of social media, the birthplace of hatred and confirmation bias.
 
No one event, but there has been a deliberate campaign to increase the partisanship in this country since Gingrich in 1994.


Online, I saw increasing levels of hatred at the elections of both Obama and Trump. To a lesser degree, GWB. Covid19 may have accelerated the process slightly, but it's been building for over 2 decades.


For a couple of decades, I've been told I supported child murder (vaccination), pedophilia (LGBTQ+ positions), and racial hatred (hope that's obvious). In my personal life, I have seen no increased animosity, but I have a small social circle. All this is nothing new to me.
Good post.

This really accelerated under Gingrich. He taught fellow Republicans how to obstruct and demonize political opponents. Bush exploited racial, social, and cultural fissures within American society with his campaigns against McCain in South Carolina, Kerry in 2004, and various cultural issues (like gay marriage). I remember being called anti American on the campus of UVSC for asking where the WMDs were in Iraq.

The 2008 campaign once Palin entered the arena became a nasty contest. The GOP invited the kooks and crazies that Palin attracted into the pool. She brought it energy that older Republicans (like mccain) lacked. This was a mistake as It’s been eating their establishment faces off ever since. Even today a large segment of the GOP believes Obama isn’t an American citizen. When simple facts aren’t recognized and stupidity and emotional are values more than expertise and evidence, then compromise and governing become impossible.

After 2012’s loss, the GOP conducted an autopsy that has obviously been ignored. It essentially stated that the party needed to become less mean, less rigid ideologically, and more welcoming to women and minorities. Ignoring this sound advice has only increased the right’s extremism.

In 2016, they won not by appealing to the majority of the electorate, but by juicing the base and winning the EC. Trump combined with other factors like Fox News and social media, has led to a continued denigration of norms. Which brings us to today where Republicans can’t even elect a speaker of the House. Folks like Boebert and Gaetz are fighting with MTG.

The problem therein lies in the GOP’s base that has become radicalized. They then demand radicalized bomb throwers to “own their enemies.” Once they elect bomb throwers, Fox News radicalizes the base further and the base demands even more radicalized bomb throwers.

The radicalization of one of the major political parties in this country comes at a time where local news is dying. People become less connected to their communities as they don’t follow local news. Everything becomes a win/lose mentality because all news and politics becomes nationalized. People find their echo chambers on social media which keeps them ignorant of topics, believing the worst of their neighbors, and unable to crucially think. All this contributes to a more divided country. Social media really makes things worse as people seek to have their views confirmed and seek connection with others. Often, the connection they find is fool’s gold and it leads to further radicalization.

Some insightful reading

Articles:






Books:
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Amazon product ASIN 0061733644View: https://www.amazon.com/Game-Change-Clintons-McCain-Lifetime/dp/0061733644/ref=mp_s_a_1_2?crid=2Q6O13UKD0S45&keywords=game+time+sarah+palin&qid=1672807481&sprefix=game+time+sarah+palin%2Caps%2C132&sr=8-2


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Amazon product ASIN B0088R936OView: https://www.amazon.com/Even-Worse-Than-Looks-Constitutional/dp/B0088R936O/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?crid=2EGRXOJADEX0I&keywords=its+even+worse+than+it+looks&qid=1672807526&sprefix=its+even+worse+%2Caps%2C129&sr=8-1

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Should be painfully obvious. The Internet and the rise of social media, the birthplace of hatred and confirmation bias.
This.

It also creates a distrust of established experts and expertise. Why listen to doctors who might say something that I disagree with when I can quickly go onto Facebook and find any quack who’ll tell me what I want to hear. If everyone is an expert then no one is. My surface level expertise is just as good if not better than your deep level expertise because all expertise is the same because I easily found info on social media that I agree with.
 
Should be painfully obvious. The Internet and the rise of social media, the birthplace of hatred and confirmation bias.
I’m not disagreeing with this but the internet/social media is the tool to post hate, not an event. I was asking for an event or situation where it stoked this much anger.
 
Good post.

This really accelerated under Gingrich. He taught fellow Republicans how to obstruct and demonize political opponents. Bush exploited racial, social, and cultural fissures within American society with his campaigns against McCain in South Carolina, Kerry in 2004, and various cultural issues (like gay marriage). I remember being called anti American on the campus of UVSC for asking where the WMDs were in Iraq.

The 2008 campaign once Palin entered the arena became a nasty contest. The GOP invited the kooks and crazies that Palin attracted into the pool. She brought it energy that older Republicans (like mccain) lacked. This was a mistake as It’s been eating their establishment faces off ever since. Even today a large segment of the GOP believes Obama isn’t an American citizen. When simple facts aren’t recognized and stupidity and emotional are values more than expertise and evidence, then compromise and governing become impossible.

After 2012’s loss, the GOP conducted an autopsy that has obviously been ignored. It essentially stated that the party needed to become less mean, less rigid ideologically, and more welcoming to women and minorities. Ignoring this sound advice has only increased the right’s extremism.

In 2016, they won not by appealing to the majority of the electorate, but by juicing the base and winning the EC. Trump combined with other factors like Fox News and social media, has led to a continued denigration of norms. Which brings us to today where Republicans can’t even elect a speaker of the House. Folks like Boebert and Gaetz are fighting with MTG.

The problem therein lies in the GOP’s base that has become radicalized. They then demand radicalized bomb throwers to “own their enemies.” Once they elect bomb throwers, Fox News radicalizes the base further and the base demands even more radicalized bomb throwers.

The radicalization of one of the major political parties in this country comes at a time where local news is dying. People become less connected to their communities as they don’t follow local news. Everything becomes a win/lose mentality because all news and politics becomes nationalized. People find their echo chambers on social media which keeps them ignorant of topics, believing the worst of their neighbors, and unable to crucially think. All this contributes to a more divided country. Social media really makes things worse as people seek to have their views confirmed and seek connection with others. Often, the connection they find is fool’s gold and it leads to further radicalization.
So your response was it’s because of the right? Only the right? The reason there is this much hate is because of:
Gingrich
Bush
Palin
Winning by EC
Trump
GOP

The left is perfect. They are all inclusive and care about everyone. They are the party of Love. No hate coming from the left.

Even if you really believe that, not one of those events brought as much hate as Covid.
 
So your response was it’s because of the right? Only the right? The reason there is this much hate is because of:
Gingrich
Bush
Palin
Winning by EC
Trump
GOP

The left is perfect. They are all inclusive and care about everyone. They are the party of Love. No hate coming from the left.

Even if you really believe that, not one of those events brought as much hate as Covid.
The left isn’t perfect but the primary reason for the political and social upheaval in America has been the radicalization of the right and its political party. What do you see as the left’s role in this? Fighting for civil rights for LGBTs? This has been a sticking pt for many conservatives where I live. Often, things the right finds divisive is equality. It’s part of living in a multicultural democracy that has fueled anger because it’s perceived as infringing on their own rights and privileges when in reality it’s merely extending those same rights and privileges to others. I’m interested to hear what you have to say about the left’s role.

The base has rejected multiculturalism, democracy, and has created an alt reality (Covid is the flu, Obama is a Kenyan Muslim, CRT is being taught in schools, elections aren’t fair, Biden is a socialist, build a wall to stop immigrants, etc). The party leadership for decades has eroded democratic norms and demonized its opponents in way that just drive wedges in-between people (began with Gingrich). The recent (failed) midterms and the inability to choose a speaker right now speaks volumes as to how radical the base and party has become. This has come to a head at a time of demographic and technological change and the loss of local newspapers. All of this contributes to a more divided, less informed, and more disconnected society.

I provided you with reading sources, many of them conservatives who have been calling out extremism from their own side. Many of the sources I cited are political scientists and historians, experts in their fields. I’d suggest you read up on your country’s and party’s own history before you continue to be dismissive in this discussion. Perhaps one of the reasons why the country is so divided is because conservatives complain about division but then dismiss what others say? Taking a critical view of American society and struggling democracy might reveal unsavory truths about one’s party, society, technology, and how it has failed to accept changing economy and demographics.

The funny thing here is, it’s not just America that’s seeing democratic erosion and the rise of a radicalized right. See Brexit in the UK, Le Pen in France, Orban in Hungary, Bolsonaro in Brazil, etc. these movements have been years in the making (like America since Gingrich) and have relied on the same handful of issues that have contributed to the radicalization of the right and the division of society; changing economies, changing technologies, rejection of changing demographics, rejection of reality and the creation of alt realities through propaganda, and narcissism. Francis Fukuyama’s new book details this well if you’re interested in reading about other countries:
Amazon product ASIN 0374606714View: https://www.amazon.com/Liberalism-Its-Discontents-Francis-Fukuyama/dp/0374606714
 
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