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Game Thread Nov 17, 2023 08:00PM MT: Jazz vs. Suns (Tournament)

Added to Calendar: 11-17-23

Saint Cy of JFC said:

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*trigger warning I critique a rookie*

Just such an awful play by Keyonte. Picking up your dribble at 18 feet to Euro into a triple teamed floater with Lauri wide open in the corner.

The level of hate this play would have gotten if it was anyone else would have been pages long.
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It was terrible. He was on that adrenaline from the steal and the sweet behind-the-back split. Adrenaline does funny things, just ask Clarkson.

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Saint Cy of JFC said:

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George also had this big THT moment where it looks like he's about to get a really good shot but completely forgets about ball security.
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He had those terrible passing TO's early season now he has some bad ball handling turnovers coming as he becomes a scorer. He is evolving so quickly.

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hgb said:
What a great game. This right here is why tanking sucks. So many players with huge ups and downs (Keyonte, THT, Lauri all had times where they did extremely well, and times they had some complete head scratchers).

The stretch where Key really took it to Booker by first hitting that pull-up three in his grill and next time down easily blow up for a layup was my favourite part, I think,

Fontecchio is also really starting to look like an NBA player. He'll never be a star, obviously, but I thought he did really well and I think he'll be pretty serviceable off the bench. Hats off to Ochai as well, who had a great game.
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The dunk Simone had under the rim I was kind of shocked by how easily/quickly he got up and threw it down.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
The dunk Simone had under the rim I was kind of shocked by how easily/quickly he got up and threw it down.
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Ya i noticed that too. Looked way bouncier than expected
 
It appears to me that Yurt, Luka and Dunn are dead to Hardy. I know Dunn is guaranteed through the season but Yurt and Luka have club options coming up. It might be time to waive them and sign some guys to 10 days.
 
Step-Back Hook said:
He was not the 22-23 beast in the summer and he is not that right now. I know not everyone here will agree with me but having to serve even for the watered down version of military service affects traiing. It was few months making things different from what he has been used to it.

This is not to tell Lauri is bad. He is great but the greatness we saw last season might have to wait beyond this season. After he gets to train the becoming summer like he is used to do.
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I’m more optimistic. I agree with you that the military service is a factor but expect him to pick up his game once he can go back to playing the three as opposed to the five. Guarding behemoths like Nurkic in the paint takes a physical toll on your body.
 
Lauri played 40 minutes. He was asked to guard KD 1:1 most of those minutes. And then, because this team doesn't have/play a 5, he (as everyone else) was asked to help into the paint. That didn't end up so well, but who on this team could've guarded KD better 1:1? No-one.

Sure, he didn't get rebounds. That's a bit tough when on pretty much every play he's guarding KD (or sometimes Booker) outside or mid-range. Still, the Suns had a total of 5 O-rebs the whole game.

On offense he was passed the ball a total of 16 times. And with those he had 12 FGA and went to the line 6 times. He might've not had an offensive possession where he touched the ball and *didn't* try to score. Sure, KD was draped on him. But 21 points on 16 passes received is beyond efficient.

Yeah, the final play wasn't good. I don't get the design, but neither did Lauri execute it well. Doesn't really matter though as the Jazz win probability at that point was something like <0,1 % - the game was already lost.

Can't really fault the Jazz offense on a night they score 128, shooting ~45 % from 3, getting to the line 31 times, 27 assists etc. etc.

But this was not at all Lauri playing badly. The team chose not to play the ball to him, like, at all. Scoring 21 in a game like that is amazing.
 
homeytennis said:
It appears to me that Yurt, Luka and Dunn are dead to Hardy. I know Dunn is guaranteed through the season but Yurt and Luka have club options coming up. It might be time to waive them and sign some guys to 10 days.
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We all know what Dunn and Samanic are capable of from last season. But with a healthy team and the additions of George in the back court and Collins and Hendricks in the front court makes it hard (politically) for Hardy to promote a fringe guy in front of them. But with Kessler down and Yurt’s performance on 11/2 against Orlando in a tight game (3-3, 3 boards in 8 mins), that situation is a real head scratcher for me.
 
Tanktastic said:
Lauri played 40 minutes. He was asked to guard KD 1:1 most of those minutes. And then, because this team doesn't have/play a 5, he (as everyone else) was asked to help into the paint. That didn't end up so well, but who on this team could've guarded KD better 1:1? No-one.

Sure, he didn't get rebounds. That's a bit tough when on pretty much every play he's guarding KD (or sometimes Booker) outside or mid-range. Still, the Suns had a total of 5 O-rebs the whole game.

On offense he was passed the ball a total of 16 times. And with those he had 12 FGA and went to the line 6 times. He might've not had an offensive possession where he touched the ball and *didn't* try to score. Sure, KD was draped on him. But 21 points on 16 passes received is beyond efficient.

Yeah, the final play wasn't good. I don't get the design, but neither did Lauri execute it well. Doesn't really matter though as the Jazz win probability at that point was something like <0,1 % - the game was already lost.

Can't really fault the Jazz offense on a night they score 128, shooting ~45 % from 3, getting to the line 31 times, 27 assists etc. etc.

But this was not at all Lauri playing badly. The team chose not to play the ball to him, like, at all. Scoring 21 in a game like that is amazing.
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Clarkson is right now making himself a target with his effective high scoring numbers. That will help Lauri tremendously going forward.

Also Key has just recently taken the starter role, and I'm pretty sure Key+Lauri designed actions are going to increase going forward.
 
Release the Kraken said:
We all know what Dunn and Samanic are capable of from last season. But with a healthy team and the additions of George in the back court and Collins and Hendricks in the front court makes it hard (politically) for Hardy to promote a fringe guy in front of them. But with Kessler down and Yurt’s performance on 11/2 against Orlando in a tight game (3-3, 3 boards in 8 mins), that situation is a real head scratcher for me.
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Last night our bench did us no favors. Hardy apparently does not trust the three aforementioned players or the two draftees at the moment. Maybe just let it roll as is.
 
Also forget whatever I said about the last drive from Lauri. Eubanks could have not fouled much clearer he did. There was a block but his off hand was all over Lauris shoulder and face :D God damn these referees.
 
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str8line said:
It was terrible. He was on that adrenaline from the steal and the sweet behind-the-back split. Adrenaline does funny things, just ask Clarkson.

Sent from my SM-G986U using JazzFanz mobile app
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It was going for his moment kinda hero ball. He may not have seen him… idk he played so well most of last night and it’s his first nationally televised game so I’m sure part of him really wanted that highlight. He’s had so few “dumb rookie” moments that it’s hard to completely crush him but that would have been huge.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
It was going for his moment kinda hero ball. He may not have seen him… idk he played so well most of last night and it’s his first nationally televised game so I’m sure part of him really wanted that highlight. He’s had so few “dumb rookie” moments that it’s hard to completely crush him but that would have been huge.
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I think he gets it right next time. He is very smart and Hardy always talks about the "percentage plays" which tells me he uses the offense by analytics approach. You probably had almost 2 expected points with that wide open 3 by Lauri, which is about as high as it gets unless you can draw a near guaranteed foul and get a shot off that has a good chance to go in.

Btw shoutout to Key also for taking the free 3 FT play against Eubanks(?) who jumped premature on his 3 pointer. Some rookies and vets dribble past those jumps and take a deep 2 pointer instead, which means giving up MASSIVE margin on expected points (2.3 vs 0.9 or something along those lines).
 
HermanG said:
I think he gets it right next time. He is very smart and Hardy always talks about the "percentage plays" which tells me he uses the offense by analytics approach. You probably had almost 2 expected points with that wide open 3 by Lauri, which is about as high as it gets unless you can draw a near guaranteed foul and get a shot off that has a good chance to go in.

Btw shoutout to Key also for taking the free 3 FT play against Eubanks(?) who jumped premature on his 3 pointer. Some rookies and vets dribble past those jumps and take a deep 2 pointer instead, which means giving up MASSIVE margin on expected points (2.3 vs 0.9 or something along those lines).
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The reason I’m so high on Key is the stuff he was supposed to be iffy on has been so much better. He had some bad defensive moments last night but in general he’s been neutral and you can see some potential and effort there. His passing has been phenomenal. He seems quite mature and like a high IQ player. I didn’t have much doubt he could be a 20 ppg guy on decent efficiency based on summer league… but if you layer that on top of being a really good passer and solid defender (all projection… he’s not there yet) then you really have something.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
The reason I’m so high on Key is the stuff he was supposed to be iffy on has been so much better. He had some bad defensive moments last night but in general he’s been neutral and you can see some potential and effort there. His passing has been phenomenal. He seems quite mature and like a high IQ player. I didn’t have much doubt he could be a 20 ppg guy on decent efficiency based on summer league… but if you layer that on top of being a really good passer and solid defender (all projection… he’s not there yet) then you really have something.
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Right now Key is massively weak. Makes sense because he did an extremely drastic weight cut during the off-season. That's the main thing that hurts him on D right now. Dudes just move him like it's nothing.
 
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