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Alfalfa

Well-Known Member
Aargh. I wrote a long reply and somehow it all deleted right as I hit post. I'll try to re-create it. Here are my answers to your questions. No I don't think it's an advantage to a family to have a father in prison. No I don't think it's an advantage to a family to have a father who deals drugs. No I don't think it's true that a white woman earns more than a black woman for the same job. No I don't think it's an advantage to unskilled laborers to have open borders creating an endless supply of applicants for the jobs they qualify for along with the related downward pressures on wages. No I don't think it's an advantage to go to a bad school. No I don't think that people are on equal footing, nor do I believe they ever can, will or should be. No I do not think that income disparity matters, at all. Yes, I do think that it is possible for every American to build a quality life from the skills and assets they have. Yes I do think it's important for parents to try to assist their children and to put them in an even better position than the parents were. Yes I do believe in charity and I do contribute freely (though not nearly as freely as my wife who has a heart of gold). No I don't think life is fair, but I do think that capitalism is the basis for the greatest economic system that has ever existed on this planet.

Is that enough answers for you? I'm pretty sure we disagree on a lot. Hopefully we also agree on some important things.
I don't even know where to start with this much ignorance. Although I do appreciate you including the bit about your prejudice against brown people, even though it was never brought up. It's important for racists to be multifaceted in their bigotry.

And capitalism can suck my dick.

The day will come when the industrialists will claim that we can no longer afford entitlements (gee, those immigrants sure could've helped), while the poor cheer for them as they wallow in their poverty. I wonder if you'll still think the poor are your enemy then, and if you'll still be cheering for Rupert Murdoch.
 
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Joe Bagadonuts

Well-Known Member
I don't even know where to start with this much ignorance. Although I do appreciate you including the bit about your prejudice against brown people, even though it was never brought up. It's important for racists to be multifaceted in their bigotry.

And capitalism can suck my dick.

The day will come when the industrialists will claim that we can no longer afford entitlements (gee, those immigrants sure could've helped), while the poor cheer for them as they wallow in their poverty. I wonder if you'll still think the poor are your enemy then, and if you'll still be cheering for Rupert Murdoch.
I assume your reply accidentally got attached to the wrong post because other than your comment about capitalism (which tells me we are worlds apart in our perspectives) I don't even know what comments you are referring to. What did I say about brown people?
 

Joe Bagadonuts

Well-Known Member
I don't even know where to start with this much ignorance. Although I do appreciate you including the bit about your prejudice against brown people, even though it was never brought up. It's important for racists to be multifaceted in their bigotry.

And capitalism can suck my dick.

The day will come when the industrialists will claim that we can no longer afford entitlements (gee, those immigrants sure could've helped), while the poor cheer for them as they wallow in their poverty. I wonder if you'll still think the poor are your enemy then, and if you'll still be cheering for Rupert Murdoch.
Pretty amazing that this exchange came about because you claimed there was no reason for you to back up your claims that white supremacy is mainstream, and then that you claimed that you did back up your claim by saying that white people are doing better than black people economically.
I don't even know where to start with this much ignorance. Although I do appreciate you including the bit about your prejudice against brown people, even though it was never brought up. It's important for racists to be multifaceted in their bigotry.

And capitalism can suck my dick.

The day will come when the industrialists will claim that we can no longer afford entitlements (gee, those immigrants sure could've helped), while the poor cheer for them as they wallow in their poverty. I wonder if you'll still think the poor are your enemy then, and if you'll still be cheering for Rupert Murdoch.
Just realized that I probably misinterpereted your comment about capitalism. I would not let anyone or anything that I didn't love ever suck any part of me, and I assume you are the same.
 

Alfalfa

Well-Known Member
I assume your reply accidentally got attached to the wrong post because other than your comment about capitalism (which tells me we are worlds apart in our perspectives) I don't even know what comments you are referring to. What did I say about brown people?
The immigration part. You brought it up in your declaration of beliefs. Right after the part where you were explaining how blacks are to blame for their poverty. As for capitalism, it's nothing more than an economic system. I knew you'd take my cuss personally given the hilarious reverence you showed in your so called response.
 

Joe Bagadonuts

Well-Known Member
The immigration part. You brought it up in your declaration of beliefs. Right after the part where you were explaining how blacks are to blame for their poverty. As for capitalism, it's nothing more than an economic system. I knew you'd take my cuss personally given the hilarious reverence you showed in your so called response.
I mentioned the immigration part because it is very relevant to the wage challenges that unskilled workers face. It does not matter what color any of these people's skin are. What matters is that America is an amazing land of opportunity for millions of people but it cannot stay that way if we simply open the borders and let everyone in. There are very legitimate reasons for putting a system of legal immigration in place (and for trying to prevent illegal immigration). I'm not sure what your last sentence means. What is clear from this exchange is that our views are a long, long way apart. I certainly hope I never have to experience the America that the ideals you are striving for would create. I have a feeling that it would turn out vastly different than the utopia you have in mind.
 

Alfalfa

Well-Known Member
I mentioned the immigration part because it is very relevant to the wage challenges that unskilled workers face. It does not matter what color any of these people's skin are. What matters is that America is an amazing land of opportunity for millions of people but it cannot stay that way if we simply open the borders and let everyone in. There are very legitimate reasons for putting a system of legal immigration in place (and for trying to prevent illegal immigration). I'm not sure what your last sentence means. What is clear from this exchange is that our views are a long, long way apart. I certainly hope I never have to experience the America that the ideals you are striving for would create. I have a feeling that it would turn out vastly different than the utopia you have in mind.
Oh ya, the unrealistic utopia where people feel the same way you do about America regardless of race. It's okay though. It's their fault they can't take advantage of this amazing land of opportunity. If only they were as hard working as white people.
 

Joe Bagadonuts

Well-Known Member
Oh ya, the unrealistic utopia where people feel the same way you do about America regardless of race. It's okay though. It's their fault they can't take advantage of this amazing land of opportunity. If only they were as hard working as white people.
No, the unrealistic utopia where wealth is redistributed and the government takes care of everything. Unfortunately that experiment has been played out many times. It turns out that when you take away the incentives to excel and innovate that pretty much everything goes to hell. As bad as you apparently think America is, there are damn good reasons that so many people for so many generations from so many other cultures have given up so much in order to try to get here.
 

fishonjazz

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Contributor
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No, the unrealistic utopia where wealth is redistributed and the government takes care of everything. Unfortunately that experiment has been played out many times. It turns out that when you take away the incentives to excel and innovate that pretty much everything goes to hell. As bad as you apparently think America is, there are damn good reasons that so many people for so many generations from so many other cultures have given up so much in order to try to get here.
I don't want to get into this argument but isn't the idea of communism a distribution of **** and no incentives and stuff?

Isn't China innovative and somewhat prosperous?

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Joe Bagadonuts

Well-Known Member
I don't want to get into this argument but isn't the idea of communism a distribution of **** and no incentives and stuff?

Isn't China innovative and somewhat prosperous?

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I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. If you are suggesting that China is the sort of country you would like to live in I would suggest you have a five minute conversation with anyone who has ever set foot on Chinese soil.
 

fishonjazz

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Contributor
2018 Award Winner
2019 Award Winner
I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. If you are suggesting that China is the sort of country you would like to live in I would suggest you have a five minute conversation with anyone who has ever set foot on Chinese soil.
I know lots of people choose to go there for some reason (I think our very own Ron Mexico is moving there. I also had a cousin who moved there, made hella money and got rich and then came back to the US and retired) but mostly I was speaking to innovation
They are a pretty innovative country it seems to me.

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Joe Bagadonuts

Well-Known Member
I know lots of people choose to go there for some reason (I think our very own Ron Mexico is moving there. I also had a cousin who moved there, made hella money and got rich and then came back to the US and retired) but mostly I was speaking to innovation
They are a pretty innovative country it seems to me.

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Interesting take. If stealing western technology is considered to be an innovation then I agree with you that they are at the cutting edge.
 

One Brow

Well-Known Member
Who would honestly think or believe blacks are any more horny than whites? This I am certain is not a wide spread subconscious or concious thought.
I heard jokes about this, in one way or another, frequently for the first 40 years of my life.
 

One Brow

Well-Known Member
No I don't think it's an advantage to a family to have a father in prison. No I don't think it's an advantage to a family to have a father who deals drugs.
It is also disadvantageous that, due to racist policing, the black father who did drugs was more likely to be stopped, searched, arrested, and charged, and treated more harshly at every step through the system. But go ahead and blame people who feel they have no viable, legal means of earning a living for turning to crime.

No I don't think it's true that a white woman earns more than a black woman for the same job.
Then you believe something contrary to known fact.

No I don't think it's an advantage to unskilled laborers to have open borders creating an endless supply of applicants for the jobs they qualify for along with the related downward pressures on wages.
This would not matter if the education systems in poor black communities turned out people who would be skilled workers.

No I don't think it's an advantage to go to a bad school.
What would you be willing to do to fix that?

No I don't think that people are on equal footing, nor do I believe they ever can, will or should be.
You support children being given less chance to prove their merit based upon their parents actions. How aristocratic of you.

Yes, I do think that it is possible for every American to build a quality life from the skills and assets they have.
As long as black people are twice as good as white people at their jobs, they are allowed to live as equals. How noble of you.

No I don't think life is fair, but I do think that capitalism is the basis for the greatest economic system that has ever existed on this planet.
I agree, as would countries like Sweden, Denmark, Germany, etc. Capitalism works best when paired with socialism.
 

Ron Mexico

Well-Known Member
Contributor
Interesting take. If stealing western technology is considered to be an innovation then I agree with you that they are at the cutting edge.
They do that, not that doesn't mean they also don't innovate. Those two things aren't mutually exclusive. Anecdotally, most the people I've talked to about living in China loved it. I've asked a lot of people about their experience there and isn't almost all positive.
 
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