Handlogten's Heros
Well-Known Member
2019 Award Winner
2020-21 Award Winner
2022 Award Winner
2023 Award Winner
2024 Award Winner
I get that vibe... even before the press conference.
Trade Rumors Involving the Jazz
- Thread starter Ferguson_Mellochill
- Start date
Whooo the **** cares where he wants to go (if it’s not the place willing to dole out the biggest trade package).
I know he's very obscure and there's no reason for a Jazz Fan to have heard of him, but some guy named Mark Eaton was still getting over 3.5 blocks per game at the age of 32.
Mark Eaton Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Draft Status and more | Basketball-Reference.com
Checkout the latest stats of Mark Eaton. Get info about his position, age, height, weight, draft status, shoots, school and more on Basketball-Reference.com
www.basketball-reference.com
Handlogten's Heros
Well-Known Member
2019 Award Winner
2020-21 Award Winner
2022 Award Winner
2023 Award Winner
2024 Award Winner
You won't die alone.
Yet another reason Donovan’s value almost certainly decreases with time is that the shorter the remaining time on his contract is, the more leverage he has in choosing a destination (from the “I won’t re-sign/extend with *team x*” angle), which depresses the number of teams bidding and competition, and which likely depresses the top bid.
Handlogten's Heros
Well-Known Member
2019 Award Winner
2020-21 Award Winner
2022 Award Winner
2023 Award Winner
2024 Award Winner
View: https://twitter.com/Mike_Schmitz/status/1522963610917502978
Here is maybe the main reason to trade Donovan now vs. a year from now... a 14% chance at this guy. Say you swipe an unprotected pick from the Knicks or some other team for Rudy and Donovan and it gives you a few more percentage chances at it.
To win at the highest levels you need top 5 or top 10 players. Those players are almost always found at the top of the draft. Give yourself as many chances as you can to getting one of those guys.
I want to say that there was an article saying that Quin declined an extension with the Jazz. Can anyone else corroborate or am I making things up? Either way…he’s on a one year deal and coaches do not coach on one year deals.
I don’t think he has a problem with Don, I think he just realize the change in the organization and that everyone is going to leave anyways. When new ownership comes in the incumbent coach is almost always on the hot seat. The people making decisions did not decide to hire Quin even if they want him back now.
Zeroing in on a single player, who you have a maximum of 14% chance of getting, when the alternative is the same opportunity a year later is not the most compelling argument.
Tanking now versus later does not give you more or less opportunities, so that last point is completely moot.
I've heard interest from the Warriors something to the tune of Wiggins, Wiseman, Moody, and potential picks for Rudy. I dunno if the Warriors would do that and say they win it all but if that was an offer, I think that is potentially the best of the lot. It's unlikely they give up Kuminga, he is crazy talented for a 19-year-old.
The other question is, would ownership have the stomach to trade him to the Warriors already with Steph, Klay, Poole, and Draymond? Might go into the fetal position for the first Warriors/Jazz game next year.
The other question is, would ownership have the stomach to trade him to the Warriors already with Steph, Klay, Poole, and Draymond? Might go into the fetal position for the first Warriors/Jazz game next year.
Handlogten's Heros
Well-Known Member
2019 Award Winner
2020-21 Award Winner
2022 Award Winner
2023 Award Winner
2024 Award Winner
Not every draft has a Duncan... Lebron... Luka... Joel... or even an AD. I believe Schmitz here... this is a generational talent. Not a can't miss guy because injuries come for everyone. So I don't believe the opportunity is the same. Winning the lotto in 2013 draft isn't the same as winning it in the 2018 or 2019 draft. If Memphis waits one more year to tear it down do they have JJJ and Ja right now? What about if Boston decided to hold onto KG and Paul Pierce for another run? Timing matters.
14% is better odds than this team ever had at winning a title imo. If you believe you are going to tear the whole thing down in 12 months you may as well get a crack at the best prospect that may come in the next few years.
Wiggins (expiring), Wiseman, Moody and picks is a good haul for Rudy. The Jazz could either take it as is or bring in a 3rd team to augment the return for Rudy. For example, the Hornets could take some of the Warriors' package and give the Jazz a player and picks #13 & #15.
It does make sense to involve another team. Likely get better assets overall with a three team deal.
Here's an example, but the Jazz would want at least a pick from the Warriors and a pick from the Hornets.
http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=y4sugfhg
I'm a Wemby skeptic (compared to Luka as prospect for example), but even if it was Luka I wouldn't operate my franchise in that way. I'd put it under some consideration, of course, but not enough for me to take a worse trade for Donovan for example. It's 14% if and only if you're the top team (most of the tankiest teams you admire have failed to get the best odds), landing the #1 pick doesn't mean Wembanyana is automatically better than whoever is next year, and landing the generational prospect is not the same thing as winning the title.
I don't believe you get the best deal out of Donovan if you put the deadline on trading him before the season starts, so I wouldn't do it personally. You're absolutely right that timing is important, but that's not something I'd try to predict. You could just as easily luck out next year. You can't just look at the success and say "man that would have been if they had waited". You would also have to look at all the high draft picks that were taken that leave a team saying "man it would have been great to have had that pick a year later". This dance is not something I'd rely on and even if you're 100% right about Wemby, you're talking yourself into a very unlikely scenario to begin with.
It would be a stronger argument if you believe the top 5 were better than the following year's top 5...I think that holds some weight. But that can always backfire too. The draft is a real crapshoot, and I'd prioritize the best package for Don over tanking immediately.
Thee Idiotic Minivan K
Well-Known Member
Which is another reason to trade Mitchell
LoPo
Well-Known Member
Yeah, all those years we contended built around ole Mark Eaton.....I know he's very obscure and there's no reason for a Jazz Fan to have heard of him, but some guy named Mark Eaton was still getting over 3.5 blocks per game at the age of 32.
Mark Eaton Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Draft Status and more | Basketball-Reference.com
Checkout the latest stats of Mark Eaton. Get info about his position, age, height, weight, draft status, shoots, school and more on Basketball-Reference.com
Big men get schemed out. I swear this is the dumbest fanbase.
Rudy's "Mann" literally lights us up every postseason. Kleber became Larry Bird. How do yall not see it? So busy blaming anything and everything but the obvious - Rudy will get schemed to an average output. And it's a damn shame he has zero offensive game whatsoever.
It's not all his fault, but Rudy aint dominating a playoff series. He isn't going to carry us anywhere. Wake the F up people.
Sent from my SM-A516U using JazzFanz mobile app
Handlogten's Heros
Well-Known Member
2019 Award Winner
2020-21 Award Winner
2022 Award Winner
2023 Award Winner
2024 Award Winner
My favorite part of this particular argument is where you put all these self imposed "deadlines" that I never have... I have literally said the most important thing is getting the best deal for both Donovan and Rudy. Like I am somehow limiting the value we will get by forcing it now. If the return is not there then pass. I just think it should be an open opportunity at this point... you increase the chances of getting the best offer if you are open for business. That doesn't just mean you'd do it for a "godfather offer". That means you are open for a solid value pay. Say my house is worth a million dollars and someone says they would make me a good offer and I reply with "$2M or go **** yourself". That ain't gonna work... but if can get an offer of 1.2-1.3M then its likely better to sell the house... especially if I plan on moving in 12 months. Of course if they come in with $800k I will just wait the year. I think we could get the slightly better offer now if we wanted and having better odds in a draft with a massive prospect is a nice cherry on the top.
The strength of the 2023 draft at the top is regarded as better than the 2022 draft but I haven't done a deep dive. Wemby may be more along the lines of AD as a prospect and not Luka. But Luka went 3rd and a few teams passed on him (I thought it was complete nonsense). Not every draft has the crown jewel and in drafts that do you can find other stuff in the top 4 that slides further than it would normally... like Mobley would be the consensus number 1 in the 2022 draft.
Also it is 14% for the bottom 3... not just the worst. #4 has a 12.5% chance... so lets say its a 10%ish chance.
I don't see a ton of tank "competition" as Kings are going to try... its really just Houston and OKC (who will have to bench guys to be in the bottom 4). So executing a tank shouldn't be difficult...
You can wait the market out and sell Donovan later if you want. But you lose runway and markets can shift. Right now I don't see much on the market for stars... Its a ****** free agent market. Inventory is low so you might get that premium that makes it worth it.