Rittenhouse

[One Brow]

I suppose Politifact and all of math could be wrong

I'm not arguing with the Politifact article, it seems to be accurate AFAICT. I'm also not arguing about which arithmetic is used to calculate unemployment.

It's pretty simple: "how is X measured" is different from "why is X so high/low".

For an easy example, you can measure the height of the water in a pool by using markings on the side, or by dropping a line to the bottom and seeing how long it is, or by reflecting a sound off the bottom. None of these methods of measurement tell you why the pool is eight feet deep.

Politifact accurately stated that Ocasio-Cortez misidentified the reason for low unemployment. A reason for something is nonetheless different than a calculation of something. Ocasio-Cortez didn't talk about how unemployment was calculated, nor did Politifact.

but I'm going with the idea that you are doing some crazy mental gymnastics

I still refuse to believe that you are so dull that you don't understand "how" is different from "why" and think that it is "mental gymnastics". I guessing this is just such an appealing narrative for you that you don't care about the distinction nearly as much as the 'gotcha'. However, you could still persuade that I'm wrong on that point.

That isn't what she said

It's not a direct quote, but it's pretty obvious in context.

and no it isn't a coherent argument because that would be granting prosecutorial powers the officers do not have.

Please. For decades we didn't separate children of people claiming asylum from their families, and no one thought it was about prosecutorial powers. It was a matter of standard procedure that was altered by the Trump administration, and the decision was entirely bureaucratic.

Their job is to enforce the law.

The point being that how this law was enforced was altered by the Trump administration.

If AOC doesn't like the laws the officers are enforcing then maybe she should hold responsible the body who makes the laws in this country.

If she doesn't like enforcement decisions, she should talk to people responsible for making enforcement decisions. Like, say, Mr. Homan.

 

[Gameface]

Not sure it needs it's own thread, so here's this:

3 men charged in Ahmaud Arbery's death convicted of murder

Three men were convicted of murder Wednesday in the killing of Ahmaud Arbery, the Black man who was running empty-handed through a Georgia subdivision when the white strangers chased him, trapped him on a quiet street and blasted him with a shotgun.

www.ksl.com

 

[AlaskanAssassin]

Still trying to wrap my mind around all the controversy in the Rittenhouse case, people continually referencing numerous media-driven inaccuracies (if not outright lies) that are cleared up with even a modicum of understanding of the case or watching any amount of the trial, and the implication of white supremacy, particular for anyone not supporting conviction, but then near silence on the Arbery case. Three convictions, and virtually nobody on any side supporting those guys. Instead of attention on the murder convictions of three white guys who chased down and killed a black guy, we instead get the focus on a kid where the owners of a minority-owned business asked a group for help to protect their business that was set on fire the night before by largely-white rioters. Two white people were shot in what was determined by the courts to be self-defense, but all of the focus was on that trial and what they believed it said about white supremacy.

I'm struggling to understand it as well. I just went to the Yahoo homepage, assuming I'd find something on the Arbery case, and the first thing that pops up is "Kyle Rittenhouse proves that White Women birth White Supremacy while Black Mothers Birth its Victims."

Regardless of your position on anything, shouldn't there be some recognition in the media right now that our justice system got this one correct? Imagine the coverage this would have received if they were found non-guilty. It's become painfully obvious that the media's goal is to rile people up as opposed to reporting the news.

 

[babe]

I can't help but to think that a big reason why many on the right hate AOC is because she's so attractive. If she had been a 60 something overweight white dude with the same beliefs, I don't think we'd see near the vitriol. Just my opinion.

Trying to explain conservatives is not your best hand.

I think it is what she says, if not directly The Young Turks and Soros management. The strategy was to displace moderate Dem party deadwood in heavy Dem areas with "useful" revolutionaries. Co-ordinated plays with local prosecutors and city officials so the paid-for riot crews could make the news. Commie burn the village to build back "better" sort of stuff.

Lots of smart-looking chicks out there, in every ditch, every niche, every political party. After a while, guys grow old and actually learn to listen to what the chick says.

Looks to me like the revolution has lost its fizz already. Bankers rule.

 

[babe]

Not sure it needs it's own thread, so here's this:

3 men charged in Ahmaud Arbery's death convicted of murder

Three men were convicted of murder Wednesday in the killing of Ahmaud Arbery, the Black man who was running empty-handed through a Georgia subdivision when the white strangers chased him, trapped him on a quiet street and blasted him with a shotgun.

www.ksl.com

Good for a new thread.

 

[LogGrad98]

Not sure it needs it's own thread, so here's this:

3 men charged in Ahmaud Arbery's death convicted of murder

Three men were convicted of murder Wednesday in the killing of Ahmaud Arbery, the Black man who was running empty-handed through a Georgia subdivision when the white strangers chased him, trapped him on a quiet street and blasted him with a shotgun.

www.ksl.com

Hope they rot in prison before they rot in whatever version of hell you care to name.

 

[infection]

I'm struggling to understand it as well. I just went to the Yahoo homepage, assuming I'd find something on the Arbery case, and the first thing that pops up is "Kyle Rittenhouse proves that White Women birth White Supremacy while Black Mothers Birth its Victims."

Regardless of your position on anything, shouldn't there be some recognition in the media right now that our justice system got this one correct? Imagine the coverage this would have received if they were found non-guilty. It's become painfully obvious that the media's goal is to rile people up as opposed to reporting the news.

The one that will likely get even less attention is Ghislaine Maxwell.

 

[The Thriller]

This is very interesting:

In the days after Rittenhouse, 18, was acquitted of homicide in killing two and wounding a third amid unrest in Kenosha, Wis., two strains of Rittenhouse lionization developed on the right. One was sanitized, mainly treating his acquittal as heroic in that he evaded a would-be injustice at the hands of out-of-control leftism.



The other was darker and more explicit, treating Rittenhouse as a hero for what he did: cross state lines to deliberately place himself in a combustible situation, armed to kill, in a manner likely to provoke the fighting — and lead to the killing — that did indeed take place.



Trump has in effect aligned his movement squarely with the second strain: Rittenhouse’s conduct should never have been subjected to scrutiny by a jury of his peers in the first place; Rittenhouse is the one who meted out justice; his killing in a highly confusing situation should properly have been placed all along outside the procedural realm we describe as the “rule of law.”



As president in August 2020 just after the killing, Trump was already suggesting Rittenhouse had properly acted in self-defense. But it’s highly notable that Trump is now declaring he never should have stood trial after his acquittal.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/11/24/trump-kyle-rittenhouse-mar-a-lago-hannity/

 

[The Thriller]

Still trying to wrap my mind around all the controversy in the Rittenhouse case, people continually referencing numerous media-driven inaccuracies (if not outright lies) that are cleared up with even a modicum of understanding of the case or watching any amount of the trial, and the implication of white supremacy, particular for anyone not supporting conviction, but then near silence on the Arbery case. Three convictions, and virtually nobody on any side supporting those guys. Instead of attention on the murder convictions of three white guys who chased down and killed a black guy, we instead get the focus on a kid where the owners of a minority-owned business asked a group for help to protect their business that was set on fire the night before by largely-white rioters. Two white people were shot in what was determined by the courts to be self-defense, but all of the focus was on that trial and what they believed it said about white supremacy.

You don’t get to take the law into your own ****ing hands. It amazes me that people like you continue to defend this vigilantism. I don’t want to live in a society that supports this vigilantism. Most of the industrialized world surely wouldn’t.

Some much needed perspective here:

 

[The Thriller]

I'm struggling to understand it as well. I just went to the Yahoo homepage, assuming I'd find something on the Arbery case, and the first thing that pops up is "Kyle Rittenhouse proves that White Women birth White Supremacy while Black Mothers Birth its Victims."

Regardless of your position on anything, shouldn't there be some recognition in the media right now that our justice system got this one correct? Imagine the coverage this would have received if they were found non-guilty. It's become painfully obvious that the media's goal is to rile people up as opposed to reporting the news.

Welcome to journalism in the 21st century where clicks and outrage are more important than anything else. Maybe killing off local journalism was a mistake? And the internet gives millions of people across the world access to dumb articles like the one you cited.

Im not sure what the solution is, but the media does a poor job of actually informing anyone. It provides picaboo journalism, stuff that entertains and outrages us for a second, disappears, and then reappears to entertain and outrage once again. I don’t know if democracy can last in an era where expertise is diminished, local stories go unreported, and everything is nationalized and filtered through a lens of, “what will get the most outrage for clicks.”

 

[The Thriller]

The one that will likely get even less attention is Ghislaine Maxwell.

This maxwell?


I can think of some pretty important people who’d prefer her trial go unnoticed.

 

[infection]

You don’t get to take the law into your own ****ing hands. It amazes me that people like you continue to defend this vigilantism. I don’t want to live in a society that supports this vigilantism. Most of the industrialized world surely wouldn’t.

Some much needed perspective here:

1. Could you direct me to where I “defend his vigilantism”?
2. There are several people in this thread who watched the trial. None of them are what anyone could describe as “right-wingers.” Absolutely everyone in this thread who watched any substantial part of the trial has stated and known this case wasn’t about vigilantism, wasn’t about white supremacy, and wasn’t about him going there because he had an itch to scratch and/or tried to provoke anything. You’ve admittedly not availed yourself to the case and it’s silly to have that discussion about your supposed issues of the case that is unsupported by evidence, video footage, and testimony, but lives large in popular narrative. If you feel comfortable with your sources, then that’s fine. Just know that the people here who watched the case aren’t able to put your response in any context because it doesn’t pertain to the case.

 

[infection]

This maxwell?

View attachment 11417
I can think of some pretty important people who’d prefer her trial go unnoticed.

Yes, that Maxwell. And in case you haven’t paid attention to my posting over numerous years, I’ve consistently said that my biggest hang up on Trump was any connection he had to Epstein, and being baffled why nobody seemed to care about that while otherwise craving any kind of Trump outrage. When he was elected there was an active case of rape against he and Epstein. I’ll assume you didn’t know that. The media never touched that. We got things like Trump eats his fried chicken with a fork, or Trump may have started WWIII by taking a congratulatory phone call from the president of Taiwan. Or numerous years of the dossier.

Why do you think they didn’t talk about the connection to Epstein?

 

[fishonjazz]

I'm struggling to understand it as well. I just went to the Yahoo homepage, assuming I'd find something on the Arbery case, and the first thing that pops up is "Kyle Rittenhouse proves that White Women birth White Supremacy while Black Mothers Birth its Victims."

Regardless of your position on anything, shouldn't there be some recognition in the media right now that our justice system got this one correct? Imagine the coverage this would have received if they were found non-guilty. It's become painfully obvious that the media's goal is to rile people up as opposed to reporting the news.

To be fair, i think they want clicks/views. They show us what we want to see. I mean donald trump was actually voted to be our president. This is who we are as a society sadly. We crave being triggered. We would much rather fight with each other and argue with each other over anything else. The media plays their role and deserves some blame but they just give us what we want. If no one paid attention to rittenhouse and everyone was super interested in the arbery case then that is what would show up everywhere.

I mean the media doesn’t control jazzfanz right? How many posts/threads are there about the arbery case in comparison to the rittenhouse case.
The media is a reflection of us to a certain extent. Americans kind of suck right now. The main goal of trump seemed to be to divide us and rile us all up. I think he did a fantastic job in that area.


Sent from my iPad using JazzFanz mobile app

 

[fishonjazz]

The one that will likely get even less attention is Ghislaine Maxwell.

Yep. We as a society dont care about that case enough for some reason. If we did and we were craving coverage of that case then the media would give it to us. They love having our eyes on their articles and news programs.


Sent from my iPad using JazzFanz mobile app

 

[infection]

Yep. We as a society dont care about that case enough for some reason. If we did and we were craving coverage of that case then the media would give it to us. They love having our eyes on their articles and news programs.


Sent from my iPad using JazzFanz mobile app

I think you may not be cynical enough to appreciate the media’s ability to actually get people to care or not care about things, and that numerous people connected to Epstein (guilty or not) are very large donors to major media outlets. Trump being connected to Epstein and there having been an active child rape case against the two of them wasn’t not covered just because the viewers apparently didn’t demand Trump controversy.

 

[The Thriller]

I think you may not be cynical enough to appreciate the media’s ability to actually get people to care or not care about things, and that numerous people connected to Epstein (guilty or not) are very large donors to major media outlets. Trump being connected to Epstein and there having been an active child rape case against the two of them wasn’t not covered just because the viewers didn’t apparently didn’t demand Trump controversy.

Well, that and the majority of Trump supporters wouldn’t have cared. It would have been dismissed as, “fake news” and justified by tex cuts, conservative judges, and the “left is worse” excuses that justified all the other garbage that was justified by Trump supporters. It was and still is a dead-end story to connect Trump to Epstein since his followers won’t care and those who already dislike Trump will continue to dislike Trump.

 

[infection]

Well, that and the majority of Trump supporters wouldn’t have cared. It would have been dismissed as, “fake news” and justified by tex cuts, conservative judges, and the “left is worse” excuses that justified all the other garbage that was justified by Trump supporters. It was and still is a dead-end story to connect Trump to Epstein since his followers won’t care and those who already dislike Trump will continue to dislike Trump.

So instead focus on all the other things that Trump supporters surely cared about?

 

[The Thriller]

Yep. We as a society dont care about that case enough for some reason. If we did and we were craving coverage of that case then the media would give it to us. They love having our eyes on their articles and news programs.


Sent from my iPad using JazzFanz mobile app

The 24 hour news cycle crams too much News into our lives too fast. We can’t even process people being killed terrorist style by a SUV the other day before something worse being shown today and tomorrow. This was no truer than the Trump era when he would do or say something one day that would’ve ended anyone else and then the very next day do something just as despicable. The zone was flooded with so much **** that no one could fully process what was happening.

Because local journalism has died and everything has been nationalized, people can now choose which news silo/echo chamber they want to inhabit. And it’s all available at the touch of a phone. Not sure if phones and the internet have necessarily been great inventions tbh. Social media is mostly just filth. I wish we could put this genie back in its bottle.

 

[The Thriller]

So instead focus on all the other things that Trump supporters surely cared about?

I think this didn’t happen all at once. It’s been an ongoing experiment for 5 years now. The media rarely reports on the investigations into his finances anymore. I think there came a point where a lot of journalists just gave up. Even if today Maxwell admitted to serving up underage girls for Trump’s needs, it wouldn’t generate near the outrage as it would’ve pre presidency. Too many of his followers have their identity tied to his success. They’ve justified too much already. They’ll easily dismiss it, as they’ve already dismissed lying about business in Russia, racism, grabbing women by the *****, stormy Daniels, obstruction of Justice, blackmailing Ukraine, killing off millions unnecessarily to Covid, and Jan 6.