2020 Annual All-Time NBA Draft

[Beer]

Imagine Wilt with modern gym facilities, trainers, nutritionists, coaches. Summer skill programs. He would have been Shaq-and-a-half. He would likely have been far more dominant than anything we have seen.

I'm sorry but I don't believe that for one second.

 

[LogGrad98]

I'm sorry but I don't believe that for one second.

What is your argument against it then? Do you deny that better nutrition and training and coaching can make a player better? Are you saying that the nutrition, training, and coaching of the 60's was exactly equivalent to that of today?

 

[Beer]

What is your argument against it then? Do you deny that better nutrition and training and coaching can make a player better? Are you saying that the nutrition, training, and coaching of the 60's was exactly equivalent to that of today?

Sure, Wilt probably would have been an NBA player still, maybe an All Star, hell maybe even a HOF'er. But to say he would have been Shaq and a half is ridiculous. I think Wilt is one who's sheer size and athleticism would have allowed him to be an NBA guy in any generation. There are lot of NBA legends that wouldn't have sniffed the league, probably not even D1, if they were born in 1995 instead just because they weren't big or athletic enough.

Listen to this if you have a minute. It's very interesting. https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podca...yers-of-all-time/id1483267868?i=1000474186426

Their arguments for Wilt being overrated are 1. The stats are so BS in his era because of the pace of play, the lack of skill, the fact guys played the entire game every game, the style of his play. It's pretty interesting.

Isaiah Thomas, Allen Iverson, and Wilt are their top 3 overrated of all time guys.

 

[LogGrad98]

Sure, Wilt probably would have been an NBA player still, maybe an All Star, hell maybe even a HOF'er. But to say he would have been Shaq and a half is ridiculous. I think Wilt is one who's sheer size and athleticism would have allowed him to be an NBA guy in any generation. There are lot of NBA legends that wouldn't have sniffed the league, probably not even D1, if they were born in 1995 instead just because they weren't big or athletic enough.

Listen to this if you have a minute. It's very interesting. https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podca...yers-of-all-time/id1483267868?i=1000474186426

Their arguments for Wilt being overrated are 1. The stats are so BS in his era because of the pace of play, the lack of skill, the fact guys played the entire game every game, the style of his play. It's pretty interesting.

Isaiah Thomas, Allen Iverson, and Wilt are their top 3 overrated of all time guys.

I think that is still underrating what modern advantages would have meant to many of these top players. But I see the argument.

 

[Elizah Huge]

Sure, Wilt probably would have been an NBA player still, maybe an All Star, hell maybe even a HOF'er. But to say he would have been Shaq and a half is ridiculous. I think Wilt is one who's sheer size and athleticism would have allowed him to be an NBA guy in any generation. There are lot of NBA legends that wouldn't have sniffed the league, probably not even D1, if they were born in 1995 instead just because they weren't big or athletic enough.

Listen to this if you have a minute. It's very interesting. https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podca...yers-of-all-time/id1483267868?i=1000474186426

Their arguments for Wilt being overrated are 1. The stats are so BS in his era because of the pace of play, the lack of skill, the fact guys played the entire game every game, the style of his play. It's pretty interesting.

Isaiah Thomas, Allen Iverson, and Wilt are their top 3 overrated of all time guys.

Wow! I usually like your takes but this is by far your worst one.

Wilt used to dominate Magic and the Lakers in the early 80’s at UCLA. He was in his 40’s too. Wilt is underrated if anything. I just think it’s funny that someone like Babe Ruth is so well respected but not Wilt Chamberlain.

 

[Beer]

I think that is still underrating what modern advantages would have meant to many of these top players. But I see the argument.

I don't completely disagree its just impossible to quantify. I have a hard time believing Dwight Howard placed in 1965 doesn't do exactly what Wilt did and is Dwight even considered a top 100 player, let alone top 10 like Wilt?

 

[Beer]

Wow! I usually like your takes but this is by far your worst one.

Wilt used to dominate Magic and the Lakers in the early 80’s at UCLA. He was in his 40’s too. Wilt is underrated if anything. I just think it’s funny that someone like Babe Ruth is so well respected but not Wilt Chamberlain.

You know one of the most unreliable forms of evidence in a criminal case is an eyewitness right. People like to remember what they want and romanticize the past. Wilt not allowing NBA stars to score at all in his 40's in a pickup game is a fun but silly story. Ever listen to your dad and grandpa tell stories and absolutely know for a fact they a complete bs even though they aren't necessarily lying? Same thing.

 

[LogGrad98]

I don't completely disagree its just impossible to quantify. I have a hard time believing Dwight Howard placed in 1965 doesn't do exactly what Wilt did and is Dwight even considered a top 100 player, let alone top 10 like Wilt?

This is a chicken and egg scenario. Is Dwight simply a better athlete from the level of the DNA or is he just as much a product of the machine that makes athletes into what they are in the modern era? No doubt he would be a stellar athlete, but I think Wilt would be that much better again today with the same modern advantages, for example.

And yes, it is impossible to quantify, it is an interesting thought exercise however.

 

[Beer]

This is a chicken and egg scenario. Is Dwight simply a better athlete from the level of the DNA or is he just as much a product of the machine that makes athletes into what they are in the modern era? No doubt he would be a stellar athlete, but I think Wilt would be that much better again today with the same modern advantages, for example.

And yes, it is impossible to quantify, it is an interesting thought exercise however.

I think they are similar athletes with similar skill sets. One is good not great NBA journeyman and one is an all time legend. Hell I'd even throw Andre Drummond into the mix. Using pure stats as a measuring stick is silly. Wilt averaged 48.5 min a game one year. What are his per 36 stats instead? Adjusted for pace of play. What type of competition is he playing against?

There is a lot you can do to really get into the minutia and have a better opinion on it but I'm too lazy so I'll stand by my premise of every new generations produces far superior players than the next.

 

[gandalfe]

I think we have to be careful with this kind of comparison. I mean, these guys were all-world athletes in their eras, all the while most of them smoked, the training facilities, although cutting edge at that time, were YMCA gyms compared to modern facilities. They didn't have the benefits of modern nutritionists, 60+ years of basketball knowledge and experience in coaching. They didn't have people who specialized in nothing but perfecting their shot, or footwork, or what-have-you. Give any of them these modern advantages and how much better would they have been?

Also I am not a fan of the "but the league was small, there was no competition" argument. I would actually argue their competition was much stronger. The talent at the time was concentrated into fewer teams. They faced multiple all-star and all-league level players in every single game, not just maybe 1 or 2 with a bunch of role players around them. Now the talent is diluted. Imagine how much stronger the teams would be if we shrink the league today to say 20 teams. Or even 25.

Imagine Wilt with modern gym facilities, trainers, nutritionists, coaches. Summer skill programs. He would have been Shaq-and-a-half. He would likely have been far more dominant than anything we have seen.

So if we are comparing eras and thinking about dropping them all into the same arena, we have to give them the credit of the same inputs and acknowledge that the players of previous eras would just be that much better as the support facilities and staff around them improved.

I read that Bill Russell was talking with Steve Kerr, and said "Steve, in my day, you never would have made that game winning shot in the finals. Why? Because you would have been in the f***ing stands watching the game."

 

[Beer]

I read that Bill Russell was talking with Steve Kerr, and said "Steve, in my day, you never would have made that game winning shot in the finals. Why? Because you would have been in the f***ing stands watching the game."

Why? Because he wouldn't have been able to beat out the other short unathletic white guards of the day?

 

[LogGrad98]

I think they are similar athletes with similar skill sets. One is good not great NBA journeyman and one is an all time legend. Hell I'd even throw Andre Drummond into the mix. Using pure stats as a measuring stick is silly. Wilt averaged 48.5 min a game one year. What are his per 36 stats instead? Adjusted for pace of play. What type of competition is he playing against?

There is a lot you can do to really get into the minutia and have a better opinion on it but I'm too lazy so I'll stand by my premise of every new generations produces far superior players than the next.

I don't agree with the "far" piece, so you would not take Karl Malone over, say Blake Griffin in their prime? Because Griffin is a generation further along? I also still argue that at least part of that improvement is due to training and facilities improvements, not just the DNA gets better and better.