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D'Angelo Russell

Jingled said:
If we could add Russell and somehow also add a quality stretch 4 like Porter, Niko or Gallo then I'd be all for it. Just replacing Rubio with Russell isn't going to be the needle much, if at all, and it's not going to make us anywhere close to being contenders.
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I agree, but we have to get the improvement while we can. Right now, we need to improve PG AND PF play to be a contender. If we get improvement at PG, we just have to be more aggressive getting that help at PF.
 
Handlogten's Heros said:
I've decided all FA need to meet the Tim Hardaway Jr. test for me (it's the mendoza line for me).

I think he could be had for straight expiring salary... he's a solid but flawed player. He's owed about 18M a year and his deal runs for two years after this one. Anyone that does not provide more value than that is a no for me. I think Russell will get around 18-22M per for 3 or 4 years... I'd prefer Hardaway... he's better, more certain, and has a shorter deal. Thus Russell fails the THJ test for me and I'm out.
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I'm on the record saying that I would make a move for Hardaway. However, I think Russell is a smarter fit next to Donovan for the long term. Russell can run an offense, facilitate, and spot up shoot. He will improve on defense like almost all 22 year old professionals do. His entire game will improve like almost all 22 year old professionals do.
 
LoPo said:
I'm on the record saying that I would make a move for Hardaway. However, I think Russell is a smarter fit next to Donovan for the long term. Russell can run an offense, facilitate, and spot up shoot. He will improve on defense like almost all 22 year old professionals do. His entire game will improve like almost all 22 year old professionals do.
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I can see why someone would want him... I don't because I think the price will exceed the value.
 
What if I told you there was a guy that is almost Russell exact same age... that is a more efficient scorer this year, but has some of the same knocks. This player also can be had for about half the price and has recently had a 9 game run where they put up 20 and 6 in 30 mins a game on 57% TS... you want him... how much would you pay a year for him?
 
I'm not a big fan of Russell but a Russell trade is about 30000x better of an idea than trading for Jabari Parker.
 
There's an argument that picking up Jabari Parker after he gets cuts or his option decline next year is a better move than trying to get Russell.

Both average offensive players who suck on D and have locker-room concerns. One is a lot cheaper than the other and has a higher ceiling potential.
 
Sandman822 said:
I'm not a big fan of Russell but a Russell trade is about 30000x better of an idea than trading for Jabari Parker.
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Wasting assets to trade for either is a terrible move.

As far as signing them next year, Parker is probably going to be cheaper. He has been humbled. He certainly has the higher ceiling as well.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Wasting assets to trade for either is a terrible move.

As far as signing them next year, Parker is probably going to be cheaper. He has been humbled. He certainly has the higher ceiling as well.
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I wasn't really advocating for trading for Russell I was simply saying it's a better idea than trading for Parker.

I've already said in previous threads that the Jazz should wait until the offseason if they're that desperate to take a flyer on Parker.
 
I get why people are intruiged by Russell, I was too until the other week.

If you just look at some of his stats at face value he looks nice. If you're actually capable of critical thinking he falls apart real quick. Lopo just doesnt have the brain power i guess and is fueled by an irrational hatred of Rubio.
 
LoPo said:
He can't get to the free throws so he much be garbage. Damn near Jimmer. Shun him.
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No, he's more in the neighborhood of Rodney Hood because he can't get to the FT line.

Do you remember Hood? Yes, he had an amazing dribble pullup game and could really shoot it. But like any player he goes through cold spells, and since he cant get to the FT line, those cold spells are extreme. There's a reason why Utah didnt want to pay Hood, and a lot of it had to do with that aspect of his game along with his lacklust D approach.
 
LoPo said:
I respect your stance on it.

If we just wait until summer free agency, who would you target?
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The big thing here is there is a lot of serious free agents so just by that virtue alone, you snag one.

Still in on any/all of them. I’m not sure how the etiquette works here, but the gist is just throw big money on the table for Middleton, Mirotic, Harris, Butler, Klay, Kawhi, and whoever I’m missing, then leave it up to them to leave it on the table. The next window to make any kind of similar move (good team with max cap space and lots of good free agents) probably doesn’t happen again while Donovan and Gobert are here, so try to follow through with the plan.

The other thing is there are likely teams that will try to jettison salary coming into the offseason. Decent players might be had just for having the space.
 
And the unchecked Rubio hate here is ridiculous.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/r/rubiori01/on-off/2019

Jazz are a +6.2 net rating with Rubio on the floor compared to off. These last two losses? The huge droughts have come with Rubio off the floor.

I don't think Rubio has to stay on the team, but it's disgusting how quickly some people want to ship him off for an average player.

And if you're were wondering, here are Russell's on/off stats: https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/r/russeda01/on-off/2019

Theyre a worse team with him on the court. A net rating of -3.5 with him on the court compared to off. Oh, and it's been like that every year of his career.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
And the unchecked Rubio hate here is ridiculous.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/r/rubiori01/on-off/2019

Jazz are a +6.2 net rating with Rubio on the floor compared to off. These last two losses? The huge droughts have come with Rubio off the floor.

I don't think Rubio has to stay on the team, but it's disgusting how quickly some people want to ship him off for an average player.

And if you're were wondering, here are Russell's on/off stats: https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/r/russeda01/on-off/2019

Theyre a worse team with him on the court. A net rating of -3.5 with him on the court compared to off. Oh, and it's been like that every year of his career.
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I think Rubio could work if DM was a more consistent shooter and we added a shooting 4. Ingles also being off also kills us.

I think its and either or thing with him. Like if we keep him we need to get a change of pace shooter as a backup (exum needs to go if Rubio stays) and have shooting bigs.

Its the combination of all of those things that leads to the huge swings we have. It isn't exclusively a Ricky thing. My worry with Ricky is are we pounding a square peg into a round hole... like does he fit the system and style... definitely not perfectly. If his next contract reflects the clunky fit he could be a keeper... and I think his market will be a bit limited so if a couple teams pass we could get a continuity discount.
 
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