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Got into a pretty heated debate with my wife last night about race.

vlad tepes said:
You people are crazier than a fish with **** ! completely bonkers ! Although we hate with a passion communism and communists i must admit one good thing that came out of it is that for a considerable period of time we were protected from these cancerous concepts - "white privilege", "institutional racism", "intersectionality" etc. While reading trough the comments this whole thread reminds me of the characters from that music video - "Frontier Psychiatrist" by the Avalanches
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I used to work with the brother of a dude in that band. The rest of your post is *****
 
I’m pretty sure Beer has me on ignore—after maybe just one tepid (but certainly “spirited” from his point of view, it seems) disagreement. This factoid seems worth noting in this thread or any other where he attempts to come across as eminently reasonable and grounded.
 
LogGrad98 said:
Well, do you speak Mexican?

I speak German. And it's called Germany. It's called Mexico, and my friends who live in Spain don't call it Spanish, that call it Mexican. Because it's the dialect(s) spoken in Mexico.



Just being facetious. I understand the implications in America as opposed to the rest of the world.
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Yeah, but do you speak Canadian?
 
You think Commie is trolling? Nothing to think about. It’s obvious. I hope he just carries on with more of it. We need more jokers around here.
 
Ron Mexico said:
So every time they lose you in a debate when they say every? That's always an issue for you?
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Not lose, I'm just not interested in going back and forth with someone that can't deal in nuance. And yes, I understand the irony in my wording.
 
Beer said:
I agree Obama was horrendous in healing race relations. I put him in the same camp as Bush the younger though, pure at heart but just a failure.
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I could honestly believe as much and more about my sincere Marxist believer/car pool partner over many years. He made quite a point..... at every turn in the road and every conversational tangent as well, that "State Capitalism" is just another word for Fascism, and his analysis of mainland China, Russia, Cuba etc etc was that they were fake commies whol had their own little clique apart from the common folk, and that they were evil for claiming the mantle of the natural Utopia we could think would be a better world.

My buddy would have done anything to help a brother. Just like my religious mother would have given anything she had to anyone in need.

I can't really dissect or analyze good intentions, but I merely note that some Marxist ideologues of note have written expansively about how to make use of race issues, or any other potential community problem, to gain leverage for their cause. We know Obama sat in the "God Damn America" congregation with his family, and it is pretty simple to correlate that with a sincere belief in Grammcian principles and the need to first destroy what you intend to replace. As such a believer, I see no reason to believe Obama cared to "Make America Great Again" but rather was trusted by higher levels of Progressive management to be a useful tool for leveling America with the rest of the world, while fundamentally transforming the founding principles of the United States, such as the Declaration of Independence and the US Constitution.

I don't really know exactly what goes on in anyone's head or heart, for sure. But lets just say that Christian teachings like "Do Unto Others as you would have them do unto you", bearing well with your life circumstances taking what others do in stride while doing what you can do in good conscience to help even those who make the best effort they can against you...... all that religious precept of conscience..... is quite distinct from purposed "community organizers" or activists bent on forcing a change in power.

I will also just note that, on balance, the "Christian" Western world has at least some bearings in favor of civil rights, humanitarian service, and governments with some pretensions of service to the citizenry. Something a little better than liege servitude, which make most governments a kind of slaveholder organization.

As the mobs swirling around and inside the State infrastructural Architecture can hardly be expected to understand, it's better to consider what power and misdeeds the next tyrant will embrace before toppling the one you have.

What is profoundly absent from today's Progressive leaders is any kind of understanding about personally motivated goodness actually being the most essential element of any community. Obsessed with schemes to force virtue, the plan cannot actually become a viable new order of society.
 
Rubashov said:
As this boards long standing communist, im feeling crowded out
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Well, fwiw, you're one of lower rungs on the JFC commie profile ladder. An analytical evaluation of true communism would reveal a lot of self-identifying "Communists" with insufficiencies enough to get them hauled off to re-education camps or college for correction, just as a lot of self-avowed other category wannabes have more than enough true commie ideals.

I keep trying to sell my view that Marx and other "Communist" thinkers are really just fake British Royals trying to subvert the real humanitarian revolution that began, imperfectly for sure, with the "American Revolution". Gotta divide the masses to manage them appropriately. Anywhooo...... the net result of communist revolutions so far has been the same as the run of the mill Nobleman ruling over the peasantry huddles under the walls of his castle. No real human freedom, no opportunity in life, and nothing to do but slavishly patronize the lords and ladies of the elite insider class.

Does anyone see all the billionaires lined up to force the final takedown of America????

I really doubt we will have any representative democracy left. What votes cannot be got by simply duping the rubes (no offense Rubashov), can now be bought from local crooks with vans full of negotiable ballots, for sale as needed.
 
Beer said:
Some context. We are both white, were raised upper middle class, in a very predominantly white area.

She was telling me about some podcast where the guest, a black woman, went to some Ivy league school and how weird it was when she got there that everyone there grew up with a washing machine and dryer and how her white roommates were so ungrateful for everything they had growing up. Being the sadist I am I decide to interject, that she's acting like being poor is strictly a black phenomenon. That there are no poor asians, mexicans, jews, whites, etc ..... What about the white coal miner in rural Kentucky doing back breaking work for $15 an hour for 12 hours a day, getting lung cancer because the company doesn't give a **** about them. What do you say to them about white privilege? Now I absolutely do believe white privilege exists, but I also think that economics and area where you are born play just as big a role as race into someones opportunities in life.

So she says a few insane things ....

1. EVERY WHITE PERSON HAS MORE OPPORTUNITIES THAN EVERY BLACK PERSON. No, absolutely not even kind of true. An outright lie.
2. THAT THE ONLY REASON MY GRANDPA BECAME A MILLIONAIRE WAS BECAUSE HE WAS WHITE. In reality he leased land from the state in his 20's, built out a very large fruit farm over 50 years, sold all his land in his late 70's and made a **** ton of money. But not until he had been doing back breaking manual labor for 50 years. Her Grandpa has almost the exact same story. So, not sure where his whiteness caused this.
3. SHE FEELS GUILTY FOR BEING WHITE. This is idiocy, I almost lost my god damned mind when she said this. I told her I 100% I do not feel 1 ounce of guilt. I am grateful as I do understand that I was born into a much easier situation than a vast majority minorities, and so I was extremely lucky to be born to the family I have and in the area we live, I do not feel guilt. I would recognize I am lucky and would do what I can to help raise up those that have been born into much harder situations.
4. She gets deeply offended whenever I ask her what the answers are. What needs to be done to fix the wrongs these people have most certainly experienced? I'm not interested in talking about slavery anymore, It was awful and caused generations of pain and suffering. 99.999% of the country recognizes this. So what do we do now to fix it? What can we do to help? What can we do to lift up black youth? That needs to be the focal point of these discussions. Not focusing on everything that happened 100, 80, 50, years ago. Most everyone recognizes and agrees that black society was wronged for a long long time. What can we do now to try and help?

My main point was sure, blacks have had it rough, very very rough. And a ton of things have held them down for a long long time. But my point was I think someones economic situation is also very very relevant to one's opportunities. Not just one's race. That being born into poverty and into an area with very few economic opportunities is not just a black issue.
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Please never say "Im not interested in talking about slavery anymore" as a white person lmao.
 
Beer wants to talk about how hard his grandpa worked 80 years ago to become a millionaire.

Does not want to talk about how slaves were forced to work while being beaten, killed, sold, raped, etc. because it happened in the past lmao.

And no, not everyone recognizes it to the extent that they should. It's a footnote in history classes taught in K-12 schools.
 
Saint Cy of JFC said:
Please never say "Im not interested in talking about slavery anymore" as a white person lmao.
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My point being it happened, I know it happened, stop trying to convince me something happened that I acknowledge happened. I'm more interested in discussing solutions than going over the terrible past over and over and over again for the next 100 years. Where do we go from here is a far more fruitful and useful convo to have.
 
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