Jazz4ever
Well-Known Member
Knight was such a good prospect he was passed over by 4 other teams after the Jazz for more euro unknowns. The GMs did their homework on Knight, he is not some can't miss prospect.
How good or bad is Enes Kanter. Really.
- Thread starter Xsy
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Knight was such a good prospect he was passed over by 4 other teams after the Jazz for more euro unknowns. The GMs did their homework on Knight, he is not some can't miss prospect.
Appears to be everyone is impressed with Memo's recovery, conditioning, and shooting. Looks like Kanter may barely see the floor this year if one of the big men isn't traded.
You really don't know anything about european basketball , do you?
I can pick 12 random guys from this forum, i can be the coach, and compete in eurocup
I think Memo was doing pretty well most of games he played in turkey, i believe many people will be surprised about his performance
you should forget about JV and cheer for Donatas Motiejunas instead,
I agree, Donatas has more potential and he may surprise many people in nba. I don't know why he was drafted so late.
Also i mentioned in a previous post but, Eurocup and Eurochallange, really sucks. The difference between euroleague and these platforms is bigger than NBA - D league
Fishsticks
Banned
Ohhhh I get it. GM's never make mistakes. Gotcha.
Knight is a well-rounded player, but I'm not sure what his skill set is that enables him to take over a game. He's a nice pick, but I'm not sure he's a Top-3 pick in last year's draft.
MVP
Well-Known Member
Sorry but this is moronic statement - you training 12 guys from this forum would lose to any Eurocup tam by 120 pts. Rytas just played CSKA ( arguably best team in Europe now) in VTB league in Moscow and lost only in 4th quarter by 13pts. Those Eurocup teams played in Euroleague at some point and only due to politics are out of it. Rytas was in top 16 in Euroleague last year, so why they were removed from it? Simple thing is ULEB wants to have more teams from rich basketball countries like Spain, Greece, Italy and Turkey to get more money from endorsements and thats why you have some weak teams in Euroleague and strong teams in Eurocup. It is more politics then sports sometimes.
MVP
Well-Known Member
Motiejunas could not even make Lithuanian national team this year. He is very talented but his work ethic is poor and he is like poor man's Bargnani - soft 7 footer who plays on perimeter. If he will start banging inside more and develop some post game then he could be something... And remember he is already 21 year old, thats why he was drafted later then 19 year olds.
MK11
Active Member
I am not gonna lie. Like I stated earlier in my post, he is not bigger than most big men. He is also not a legit 6 foot 11. He hasn't got wide shoulders. But besides his shoulders he has a thick body. It is just his body type, and it is not sandglass type body like Howard's and many other athlethic-explosive guy's. And his thick neck and big head doesn't help to the eye either. Additionally sometimes he puts on a posture like my grandma's. But these facts don't change some other facts. He is massive. He is strong. He is not strong strong. He is very very strong. He is powerful. Especially when he is well grounded. He has quick upper body and quickness in his general movement. His mass can produce force quite effectively. Power occurs with force and velocity. He has plenty of both of them. This somewhat explains his strenght that comes through his waist and his back. It is quite enjoying to watch him backing down bigger guys in post.
Like Jazz4ever stated he still has several years for sizing up his body. And I believe his natural growth still goes on. Even its fading out he can end up as a very legit 6 foot 11. Furthermore is possible too.
By the way I don't like talking this much about men's bodies... Just saying...
LogGrad98
Well-Known Member
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Actually, it depends on what you call a mistake. The lottery is just that, a gamble. There is no guarantee. No matter how much you might like Player A there is no way you can unequivocally state that he will 100% be better than Player B. If you are that convinced he is a no-miss prospect, would you stake your livelihood on it? I mean that semi-seriously, will you bet your job, as in quit your job if you are wrong, that Knight will be the best player in the draft, or at least better than every player taken before him from 3 on? Well that is the gamble that most GMs make every time they make a draft pick or a trade or anything else like that. They are staking their jobs on it. I am reasonably certain they have more and better information than you or I or anyone else on Jazz Fanz how the top prospects stack up. Do they make mistakes? Sure as hell right they do. But believe it or not, they are few and far between, because really a failed draft pick is not a mistake, it is probability getting the best of them. The only real mistakes were consensus better players a GM passed up on that every other GM was drolling over and made everyone say "what the ****?" when you picked your guy ahead of them. Sam Bowie anyone? But if there is any debate about whether it was a mistake or not, or if plenty of other GMs passed on that player too, well that is just the luck of the draw. It is monumentally easy to monday-morning quarterback when we can see how the future actually turned out a few years down the road, it is equally monumentally difficult to guess the future that you simply cannot see, and when your reputation, job, and livelihood are on the line.
MVP
Well-Known Member
Well, so how come he could not bench press more then Jimmer?
freakazoid
Well-Known Member
GVC
Well-Known Member
He did twice as many reps as Dwight Howard did pre-draft. 14 reps is legit, and Jimmer is strong. Kanter's strength isn't primarily in his upper body anyway. Dude's lower body is huge. He had absolutely no trouble backing down everyone this summer, including a few NBA centers (Gasol, Kaman, Noah).
Look, Kanter is largely an unknown, but so is JV. Jonas is going to have a lot of trouble staying on the court if he can't hold his ground, which seemed like a real problem this summer. Kanter's going to have to refine his post moves, and continue to get stronger, since he's not an explosive athlete (there's a good chance his shot gets swatted a lot this year). I think Kanter's built more for the NBA, but both these guys have a lot of growing to do still, and Kanter's missed out on a lot of opportunities to play the last couple years (he was better than JV before he stopped playing real competitive basketball).
I thought JV was the better prospect prior to Eurobasket, but I came away much more impressed with Kanter.
spycam1
Well-Known Member
He's talking about body strength, not necessarily the strength of his arms.
Fishsticks
Banned
Stfu already.
You tell yourself, he filled a need, but KOC prefered to get the best pick available instead of most suitable pick, so you can't criticize him much because of this choice
MVP
Well-Known Member
Who are you to tell me what to do? Deny facts if you can donk.
MK11
Active Member
OK, fair question for giving a try to answer.
First of all we really don't know what was their form and willing situation about a strength endurance test in draft tests.
Which one did care, which one have really trained on purpose etc. So I am not for saying anything about someone's strength just base on a bench press test.
Even if I was for...
The max strength and repetition are different things. Both of them can be increased in some limits with training. Repetition is more about endurance. As far as I know bench press test is about 190 lbs. At least I am sure it's not more than 200 lbs.
In my opinion the most important thing to call someone strong is his natural strength. Enes has that and his structure and his muscles can carry more of it.
Strength endurance also requires regular training on purpose. I could manage 75 good form push ups and 17 full chin ups in a row this late summer. Last week I tried and couldn't manage 40 and 10 of them in a row.
And now let me tell an interesting thing about this. I played basketball as an undersized sg a few years but my main talent was about soccer. I started to play it about age 5, and I played it more than 20 years regularly(half of it was semi-professional). I've seen a lot of very strong guys(a lot stronger than me) who can't beat me in push ups, bench presses and chinups. There were many bulls who barely can do 20 regular pushups. But most of those bulls were able to beat me in arm wrestling(I am not a bad arm wrestler by the way). And I always knew that if they were trained on strength endurance
they would do push ups etc just many as I could do. Because strength endurance limits are not variable as much as max strength or strength capacity.
Now about Enes. With true training in purpose of max amount of bench pressing, he would do just fine as much as any pro athlete do. And with true training in purpose of max strength, he can twirl a package of three Jimmer Fredette in air three times and throw it 30 feet away. And you know what, Jimmer can't do that! Because max strength limits are way more variable to the person than strength endurance limits are.
All I want now for Enes is him being in a true training way in purpose of good basketball.
MVP
Well-Known Member
Bench press is about chest, shoulders and only then arms. While it is not the best indicator of overall strength it is third best compounded weight lifting exercise - so pretty good indication of general strength. I wish they would do squats and dead lifts in pre-draft workouts - that would give us better idea but still...