These Jazz Practices Are Making Me Excited.

[GVC]

There is a decent chance one of our players breaks out big this season. We may have had a star without knowing it. The only reason I think this is possible is how Al and Paul performed on their new teams after leaving a Corbin led Jazz. Al in particular saw a drop in stats after Corbin took over. Granted both player played in the East against inferior teams, but both definitely upped their games after leaving the Jazz.

1. To the bolded: Al improved as an all-around player under Corbin. He was terrible in the (roughly) 50 games he played under Sloan (with Deron).

2. Neither Paul nor Al played noticeably better last season than they did under Corbin.

 

[[size/HUGE] fixed [/size]]

Millsap's playing style certainly changed. You can debate about whether it was an improvement or not. I'd argue it was, because he was having an impact on a larger portion of the playing surface.

 

[GVC]

Millsap's playing style certainly changed. You can debate about whether it was an improvement or not. I'd argue it was, because he was having an impact on a larger portion of the playing surface.

1. I think it's fair to say that the quality of their play was last season was easily in the same ball park as it was under Corbin. Millsap was used differently, sure, but much of that is due to roster differences. The Jazz were better under Corbin than the Hawks were last season.

2. Even if they did improve, it's awfully tough to disentangle the effect of the coaching change from improvements made by the player in the offseason independent of coaching. Millsap in particular has added little things to his game every offseason.

I've just noticed this sentiment a lot on this board, and don't think it's accurate. I get that people want to believe that the young players remaining on the team were held back by Corbin, and that their elite talent will finally present itself now that Ty is gone, but I think it's just wishful thinking. The Jazz still need a lot more talent.

 

[Peter Effin' Parker]

Have also heard Dante Exum's defensive ceiling is off the charts. His length, anticipation and height are causing issues in scrimmages

Good news? Or bad news because Trey is a midget?

 

[Joe Bagadonuts]

^Millsap had obviously added a three point game while he was still with us. Corbin just never greenlighted him to play that way.

Your comment about the Jazz being better under Corbin than the Hawks last season makes no sense.

 

[Stoked]

Agreed, but:

1. It is going to be fun to see if there is much more talent in this group than we could see under Corbin. How bad was Corbin vs how good is quin? I certainly hope to see considerable improvement among them individually and as a team. Could mean another 5 wins for each of those = 35 wins? that might be too high because the improvements that Quin can bring might take some time to take hold.

2. Hard to see us compete under even the most favorable outlook with someone like Cleveland with LBJ, Kyrie, and Love. Yikes.

Jazz beat Miami last year. Just saying...

 

[GVC]

Your comment about the Jazz being better under Corbin than the Hawks last season makes no sense.

It was a bit of a throw-away comment, but the Jazz had a better roster than the Hawks had for most of last season, so Millsap wasn't required to do as much on the court. As such, it makes sense that Millsap's raw numbers improved in Atlanta. Still, even though this was the case, Millsap's stats/impact weren't significantly different last season than they were under Corbin.

 

[Stoked]

I'm breaking down the schedule currently and I'm seeing 82 wins. So who do you have us losing to? Trap game to the TWolves?

A respectful nod to Hornacek. The Jazz let him have a game in Utah as a thank you for playing here and coachign here.

 

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1. I think it's fair to say that the quality of their play was last season was easily in the same ball park as it was under Corbin. Millsap was used differently, sure, but much of that is due to roster differences. The Jazz were better under Corbin than the Hawks were last season.

2. Even if they did improve, it's awfully tough to disentangle the effect of the coaching change from improvements made by the player in the offseason independent of coaching. Millsap in particular has added little things to his game every offseason.

I've just noticed this sentiment a lot on this board, and don't think it's accurate. I get that people want to believe that the young players remaining on the team was held back by Corbin, and that their elite talent will finally present itself now that Ty is gone, but I think it's just wishful thinking. The Jazz still need a lot more talent.

Surf through my last 10 posts and you'll see that I mostly agree with you.

I will disagree some about Millsap. I think he looked noticeably better under Budenholzer. Most of the reasons I'd give to support this are eye-testers. I'd also say that Corbin's jazz teams were more talented than that Hawks team (sans Horford), but that's a pissing contest type of argument.

 

[GVC]

Surf through my last 10 posts and you'll see that I mostly agree with you.

No need. I was responding to someone else, and the frequent scape-goating and wishful thinking attached to Corbin and his departure.

 

[fishonjazz]

I've just noticed this sentiment a lot on this board, and don't think it's accurate. I get that people want to believe that the young players remaining on the team was held back by Corbin, and that their elite talent will finally present itself now that Ty is gone, but I think it's just wishful thinking. The Jazz still need a lot more talent.

I guess we will see if the jazz win more or less games this year than last.

 

[Stoked]

I don't think they will all suddenly be superstars but I do expect noticeable improvement under Q.

 

[oldtimer]

I think more people are excited about the brand of basketball. No more pass to the post and hold for 15 seconds. Constant ball movement is exciting.

 

[Stifle Tower]

I don't think they will all suddenly be superstars but I do expect noticeable improvement under Q.

Exactly. I still think the Jazz - even with player development - will need to make a trade or two to upgrade at certain positions. Kind of like finally getting Hornacek at SG. The key is having decent depth and enough draft picks to offer.

Still too early to tell which players can be part of a contending core going forward. I think any of the "core-8" Utah has right now could be key rotation guys.

 

[b_line]

No need. I was responding to someone else, and the frequent scape-goating and wishful thinking attached to Corbin and his departure.

Another thing that will add to the scape-goat talk this year is that a lot of our players will have inflated numbers due to the fact that we are going to have a lot more possessions than last year. I imagine the team under quin will play super fast like d'antoni teams, but add in defense.

If hayward comes out and averages 20, 6 and 6, he might only be slightly improved, but will look a ton better just because of the higher averages. Same with alec. I don't think we have superstar talent (possibly excluding Dante) on this team yet, but they might look really good in Quins system.

 

[Doublea]

Another thing that will add to the scape-goat talk this year is that a lot of our players will have inflated numbers due to the fact that we are going to have a lot more possessions than last year. I imagine the team under quin will play super fast like d'antoni teams, but add in defense.

If hayward comes out and averages 20, 6 and 6, he might only be slightly improved, but will look a ton better just because of the higher averages. Same with alec. I don't think we have superstar talent (possibly excluding Dante) on this team yet, but they might look really good in Quins system.

So you're saying we might put up good numbers, but lose still?

 

[mhindy]

Another thing that will add to the scape-goat talk this year is that a lot of our players will have inflated numbers due to the fact that we are going to have a lot more possessions than last year. I imagine the team under quin will play super fast like d'antoni teams, but add in defense.

If hayward comes out and averages 20, 6 and 6, he might only be slightly improved, but will look a ton better just because of the higher averages. Same with alec. I don't think we have superstar talent (possibly excluding Dante) on this team yet, but they might look really good in Quins system.

If you're a ****ty team I'd rather play with a bit of pace as opposed to grinding it out with a TON of ugly possessions like the last few years.

 

[The Midnight]

Locke does a really good description of what went on in the practices so far here and a bit about how Quin conducts his practices.


Some pretty good insight if you haven't already watched/listened. Start at about 7.50min for the stuff about practices.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yzJRTGQPn8&list=TLM6XZB2YXWEquWzD-5p8mLR3oeDqK9G_s

 

[BabyPeterzz]

1. To the bolded: Al improved as an all-around player under Corbin. He was terrible in the (roughly) 50 games he played under Sloan (with Deron).

2. Neither Paul nor Al played noticeably better last season than they did under Corbin.

I disagree. First, are you saying that Corbin is a better coach than Clifford and Budenholzer? I don't think you are, but your comments lead to that conclusion. Clifford coached a 28 win Hornets team to a 43-39 record, turned them into one of the best defensive teams in the NBA, with Al Jefferson as the main scorer. You could try to argue that Corbin is better than Bud. His WL record is similar to Corbins. But if you watched the Hawks play last season you know he's a better coach.

That being said, you're wrong about both players performances last season. They were noticeably and statistically one of their best seasons. Al had one of the best statistical seasons he's ever had, averaging 21 and 10. If you watched him last season, I never saw him play like that in Utah. Plus he played on one of the best defensive teams in the NBA, something the Jazz never even sniffed. We all know Al's defensive rep here and around the league. As for his Sloan 1/2 year. How can you count that considering the circumstances? I'll give you his improved passing, but thats it. You have to credit his new coach for this improvement, and give some credence to Corbin's inept coaching to his lack luster performance, especially defensively, here.

Paul was an All Star, granted in the East. But he put up 17.9 (18) pts, 8.5 rebs, and 3 asst. All career highs, outside of rebs (his high is 8.6). He was better last season than any other with the Jazz. Period. Paul is a good player, but you have to give credit where it's due. He was put in a position to succeed, and his coach can take a lot of credit there.

Coaching matters, especially when players are young. I would say Corbin's short comings hurt out young players even more than the vets, who obviously struggled more under Corbin. His scheme was obviously flawed and he wasn't able to execute his plan. He had questionable relationships with the players, notably Hayward. He was a bad coach, and bad coaches fail.

If I'm wrong, lets hear it with more than conjecture.

 

[BabyPeterzz]

1. I think it's fair to say that the quality of their play was last season was easily in the same ball park as it was under Corbin. Millsap was used differently, sure, but much of that is due to roster differences. The Jazz were better under Corbin than the Hawks were last season.

2. Even if they did improve, it's awfully tough to disentangle the effect of the coaching change from improvements made by the player in the offseason independent of coaching. Millsap in particular has added little things to his game every offseason.

I've just noticed this sentiment a lot on this board, and don't think it's accurate. I get that people want to believe that the young players remaining on the team were held back by Corbin, and that their elite talent will finally present itself now that Ty is gone, but I think it's just wishful thinking. The Jazz still need a lot more talent.

How many games did Corbin coach without Al or Paul, cause the Hawk lost Horford early. If Corbin lost Al or Paul for an entire season the Jazz would win 30 games.

You're are not giving enough credit to coaching. Implementing schemes to put players in a position to succeed is their job and it plays a big role.

You're denial smells like Corbin apologetics. He was a poor head coach.