The Thriller
Well-Known Member
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Thread for responding to transphobic comments
- Thread starter One Brow
- Start date
One Brow
Well-Known Member
Apparently, he does not get it.
Safetydan
Well-Known Member
You're such a Lib. You complaining about responding to trolls just once, is twice as annoying as anything @One Brow has done. Jazzyfresh will get himself perma-banned sooner or later and you won't have to read replies to his unhinged rants anymore.
Some might find the refutations of right-wing talking points that Jazzy conveniently C and Ps into our forum on a daily basis useful. Most of us don't have the energy to do it. It's basically a public service at this point.
General thoughts on Trans individuals in sport - I personally am in favor of open divisions someday, but do see current value in cis-womens divisions in terms of encouraging a higher level of general fitness, and don't really see society as being ready to make that jump - there would seem to be better culture wars to fight imo. I sometimes have a difficult time understanding trans issues in particular as I identify as a bit of a gender abolitionist, and struggle to see why folks value gender so strongly.
I'm not sure I grok your thoughts in the above.
It's fine if a professional athletic league does it - why is it fine in that situation?
I'm not sure I grok your thoughts in the above.
It's fine if a professional athletic league does it - why is it fine in that situation?
I'm not answering for OB but my thought is that Sports in schools or that are subsidized by any government funds should be focused on teaching kids lessons or encouraging them to live more active healthy lives. Sports teaches kids things about good sportsmanship, being a gracious loser or winner, teamwork, working towards a goal, challenging yourself to improve, etc.. That should be the primary point of taxpayer funded sports programs for kids. I can't imagine a valid justification for denying trans kids from the benefits of sports programs. If the answer to that is "injury" then either that is not an appropriate sport for kids or the rules should be modified to protect the kids.
One Brow
Well-Known Member
@Gameface did an excellent job explaining the other half of my position (on why non-compensated athletics should be inclusive), I have nothing to add to that.
Professional sports leagues are private endeavors. There are 12 different owners/ownership groups in the WNBA, and they should be able to provide the product they want (although, notice I used "testosterone levels or similar notions", which might restrict non-trans women). They don't claim to open the basketball floor to members of the general public (as opposed to tickets, concessions, etc.), and if they are not sufficiently inclusive, they will suffer at the box office. I see the NCAA Division I in much the same light; it's a business much more than an educational opportunity. Division III is the opposite (IIUC), since there is no compensation, the possible restrictions should not exist.
Al-O-Meter
Well-Known Member
Nope. Women aren't handicapped males. The restrictions on athletes need to be based on the binary of male and female genetics. I think there should also be restrictions around testosterone but no measured level for any duration should allow males in the women's divisions. They aren't women. They're trans-women, a.k.a male.
Al-O-Meter
Well-Known Member
I also cannot imagine a valid justification for denying trans kids from the benefits of sports programs, but I can imagine a great justification for denying trans kids from competing in girls divisions. I've known you long enough to know you aren't really talking about access to sports writ large. You only phrase in that dishonest way to make it more palatable. What you want is for boys cosplaying as girls to be able to compete head-to-head against actual girls to further enhance their make believe.
If sport were about encouraging more active healthy lives, good sportsmanship, being a gracious loser or winner, teamwork, working towards a goal, challenging yourself to improve, etc., then why does that only come from competing in girls divisions? You are so full of it. I'm fine if boys want to wear dresses and sports bras when they compete but the competition needs to be with other males.
It seems like you view the main purpose of children's athletics is to find out who the most athletically gifted child is and not as an educational and/or healthy lifestyle tool. Am I correct in my reading of what your position is?
Or does this one boil down to the "those transgenders aren't going to trick me into playing along with their gender prank" category?
So no valid justification?
Yeah. Lifting the ignore curtain was clearly a mistake.
I know about 8 trans females, generally in the age range of 17-21. Not a one of them has the slightest interest in participating in sports. They didn't during high school. As I've said before, they basically refuse to use public restrooms. They all try to lay low and stick to themselves. THEY ARE NOT TRYING TO HURT YOU! Why are you always so cruel in how you speak about them? These are good people. Not a one has a criminal record. Not a one has a drug problem or even a recreational drug habit. None of them drink. When they've been over for a sleepover birthday party for my daughter (I think 4 years running now) they watch movies or youtubes and laugh their asses off and enjoy the snacks my wife has prepared for them. There's no drama, there's no sex stuff. What there is is relief and comfort. They are all isolated in their everyday lives. These human beings are just trying to survive (we've lost one) and pursue their life and their happiness. Give them the liberty to do that!
Al-O-Meter
Well-Known Member
My position is that sport is about competition. It is why we keep score. It is why we line athletes up, measure with lasers and clocks that count hundredths of a second. It is why we have rule books that detail faults, fouls, infractions, and penalties. Some sports are team competitions, some are individual, and sometimes it is only against yourself in a tiny competition versus a time you set earlier that no one but you know about.
Yes, sport has a lot of benefits but those benefits come from the very nature of sport being competition. I find your ideas of turning anything with government funding into participation trophy world to be abhorrent. Nearly as bad, and far more insulting to athletes, is your idea that sport is exclusively for the athletically gifted. It is work. It is really hard work with countless sacrifices made to put in the hours and days and years to hone skills.
If your kid wants to lay low, not drink or break laws, eat snacks that Mom prepares and watch movies or youtubes then fine. Don’t ruin sports especially when your kid has no interest in them.
Al-O-Meter
Well-Known Member
It doesn't matter. The exchange isn't about you. I was never going to change your mind. As Safetydan wrote, it is about the audience and they can read what I wrote.
Although I know you will never read this, I wish you no ill will. You have clearly made some choices in how you've raised your family that I would not have made, but I hope that you and yours do well.
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I see you've posted again, AIO. I hope it wasn't to me. I'm not listening. I am having a good time imagining you are responding to me however, when I don't hear a word you say. So if that's what you're doing, please continue. I like to laugh.
One Brow
Well-Known Member
Wow, that must have seemed so profound to you when you typed it.
Such binary does not exist, even at the genetic level. I mean, it can be declared by fiat, but reality has a way of confounding fiats.
That's not really thinking, just reacting.
Trans women are women.
One Brow
Well-Known Member
You say you're not transphobic, and then dismiss the lives of trans people as "cosplay", which is highly transphobic.
It shouldn't. Since you can learn those things in either division, there is no harm in letting the girls learn with the girls.
gandalfe
Well-Known Member
SteakNEggs
Well-Known Member
Some arent even hiding it anymore... Be you... But leave the damn kids alone... Hey though, they even have a name for these sickos. Minor attracted people. Show me another cult that has a name making it ok to be attracted to kids.
Claim: A video captured at the NYC Drag March on June 23, 2023, shows some of the attendees chanting, "We’re here, we’re queer, we’re coming for your children."
Rating: True
Exposing this is why certain sick disturbed people want to literally murder me or put me in internment camps. It takes the onus completely off of them and what they did to these innocent children as parents or acquaintances.
Claim: A video captured at the NYC Drag March on June 23, 2023, shows some of the attendees chanting, "We’re here, we’re queer, we’re coming for your children."
Rating: True
Exposing this is why certain sick disturbed people want to literally murder me or put me in internment camps. It takes the onus completely off of them and what they did to these innocent children as parents or acquaintances.
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One Brow
Well-Known Member
Less than a dozen people were chanting, and everyone knew it was a joke, except you.