You're the GM this offseason. What do you do?

[infection]

Again, that was due to a timeline pressure.

I think my point will show that we should have had a timeline pressure when all is said and done (regarding then and now) -- two years down the road -- that "hey, we should have had a bit more urgency.. but hey, you can't worry about the past!"

 

[latin jazz]

Those are kind of silly reasons, though. Maybe we should have just waited for George Hill free agency to begin with.

ETA: Also, regarding Grayson, I kept saying we weren't going to suck. When everyone was eyeballing a top 3 pick, I attempted (without luck) to clue people into reality regarding us bouncing back when Rudy returned. I don't ride with the perceived highs and lows.

While improvement could be expected, almost no one saw that run coming. Even with Rudy, missing the playoffs was still a possibility at the time (with the deadline quickly approaching). It would have a very very risky move with all the uncertainty surrounding the pick. We were close to get him, but the Boggie injury placed NO into panic mode.

We could get Niko for small change now, just when our window is opening. Both NO and the Bucks ended up overpaying for him.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

I did support the don't give a first for Niko at that trade deadline, so I won't cry about the trade. Last year I wouldn't have traded for him either because he was hurt. I think it was a decent risk and that was how I called it without the benefit of hindsight. I thought we were going to miss the playoffs and should have considered going that way... I was really wrong... @infection nailed it that year and never lost faith. Had I known it was a pick in the low/mid 20s and not a lotto or late teens pick I might have been pro trading Burks and a first for Niko.

My issue is I think he'd come here for around 12-13M per year, but only if he is projected as a starter. Retaining Favs causes some issues with getting a decent stretch 4 in because I don't think they would guarantee him 18M just to be a backup 5. Maybe I listen to TJ too much, but I don't think our front office will swap Favs for Niko and consider it an upgrade. I would.

If we went with Niko now we'd need a little more playmaking from the perimeter still. He'd help address one of our issues and I do think Quin could do some things with him. I think we'd need some other things to break our way, but that he could be part of the answer.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

While improvement could be expected, almost no one saw that run coming. Even with Rudy, missing the playoffs was still a possibility at the time (with the deadline quickly approaching). It would have a very very risky move with all the uncertainty surrounding the pick. We were close to get him, but the Boggie injury placed NO into panic mode.

We could get Niko for small change now, just when our window is opening. Both NO and the Bucks ended up overpaying for him.

To be fair though... @infection called it the whole time and wasn't shy about it. I do think you are correct though... long-term this may have been what is best if we do get him. On the high end I think he costs 50% of what Kevin Love would. Not sure where we get creation and playmaking we need, but that guy may not be available in free agency.

 

[fishonjazz]

He isn't wrong. People ignore all the moves DL has made. He's been an above average GM in terms of making aggressive proactive moves.

His point was that this season DL literally has to make a move where as in years past he didn't.
So that kind of seems to indicate that he thinks DL usually don't do **** but this year he will be forced to.

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[fishonjazz]

Exactly. He's easily gettable now. The ludicrous trade ideas infection was crying about would have been a total waste.

Ludicrous trade ideas? I remember infection suggesting they trade a late first round pick for him.

Did the first rounder that we ended up taking with that pick help us more than mirotic might have?

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[Saint Cy of JFC]

Ludicrous trade ideas? I remember infection suggesting they trade a late first round pick for him.

Did the first rounder that we ended up taking with that pick help us more than mirotic might have?

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TBD, because you know, a first round pick has up to 8 years of team control.

And again, looking at is strictly as Allen vs Mirotic is wrong. Mirotic would have changed the pick. It might have been the 14th pick and we miss out on Michael Porter.

 

[fishonjazz]

And again, if the Jazz trade for Mirotic in that year, they might have missed the playoffs due to Mirotic being complete *** for the first month after being traded.

That's a ludacris thing to say. In a post just before this you said that the jazz system would make mirotic look good. Lol
And that's kinda what you want I would think. Guys who look good in your system. Unless you think the jazz should target players who suck in the jazz system.

Also, since we wouldn't have given any players up we could have just played our same rotation we were using prior to trading for mirotic if the coach wanted to.

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[Saint Cy of JFC]

To be fair though... @infection called it the whole time and wasn't shy about it. I do think you are correct though... long-term this may have been what is best if we do get him. On the high end I think he costs 50% of what Kevin Love would. Not sure where we get creation and playmaking we need, but that guy may not be available in free agency.

He shouldn't cost a dime over 10 million per year at most and I would balk at anything higher. Give me Aminu 10/10 times over Mirotic.

Jazz need athletes, not inconsistent chuckers.

 

[fishonjazz]

While improvement could be expected, almost no one saw that run coming. Even with Rudy, missing the playoffs was still a possibility at the time (with the deadline quickly approaching). It would have a very very risky move with all the uncertainty surrounding the pick. We were close to get him, but the Boggie injury placed NO into panic mode.

We could get Niko for small change now, just when our window is opening. Both NO and the Bucks ended up overpaying for him.

It wasn't just Rudy being out. It was also that our schedule was very tough early on and was going to turn into the easiest schedule in the league

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[latin jazz]

To be fair though... @infection called it the whole time and wasn't shy about it. I do think you are correct though... long-term this may have been what is best if we do get him. On the high end I think he costs 50% of what Kevin Love would. Not sure where we get creation and playmaking we need, but that guy may not be available in free agency.

He is a good player but yeah, he doesn't provide much playmaking. It has to come from someone else besides DM and Ingles. I'm wondering if the Jazz are still high on him.

 

[fishonjazz]

TBD, because you know, a first round pick has up to 8 years of team control.

And again, looking at is strictly as Allen vs Mirotic is wrong. Mirotic would have changed the pick. It might have been the 14th pick and we miss out on Michael Porter.

Thank God we have have 8 years control of Bradley, Grayson and Exum lol.

But really though, if you have Rudy and DM and Ingles, and a good coach and are a playoff talented team then I think the here and now is more important than 8 years from now.
Agree to disagree

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[Saint Cy of JFC]

That's a ludacris thing to say. In a post just before this you said that the jazz system would make mirotic look good. Lol
And that's kinda what you want I would think. Guys who look good in your system. Unless you think the jazz should target players who suck in the jazz system.

Also, since we wouldn't have given any players up we could have just played our same rotation we were using prior to trading for mirotic if the coach wanted to.

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I think the Jazz system would have made him look good in time. I dont think he comes in right away and is good. He shot 38% from the field his first month with the Pelicans (a team that also has a system that helped him a lot, as much or more than Utah's would due to their pace). The fact is that his struggles would have really hurt the Jazz because in the same time frame Favors played really well for Utah.

 

[Saint Cy of JFC]

Thank God we have have 8 years control of Bradley, Grayson and Exum lol.

But really though, if you have Rudy and DM and Ingles, and a good coach and are a playoff talented team then I think the here and now is more important than 8 years from now.
Agree to disagree

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Mirotic was benched in the playoffs in favor of a career journey man who cost 7 million per year.

 

[fishonjazz]

I think the Jazz system would have made him look good in time. I dont think he comes in right away and is good. He shot 38% from the field his first month with the Pelicans (a team that also has a system that helped him a lot, as much or more than Utah's would due to their pace). The fact is that his struggles would have really hurt the Jazz because in the same time frame Favors played really well for Utah.

Could just play favors more in that case.
Let mirotic get to know the system first and get chemistry with his teammates.
Favors would have still be on the roster in a trade that is a first for Niko

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[fishonjazz]

Mirotic was benched in the playoffs in favor of a career journey man who cost 7 million per year.

I agree with you here. Though it's irrelevant.

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[Saint Cy of JFC]

Could just play favors more in that case.
Let mirotic get to know the system first and her chemistry with his teammates.
Favors would have still be on the roster in a trade that is a first for Niko

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lmao

 

[latin jazz]

It wasn't just Rudy being out. It was also that our schedule was very tough early on and was going to turn into the easiest schedule in the league

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Yeah, as I said we could expect improvement and maybe make the playoffs in the West. But I don't think most fans expected finishing 29-5 or something like that.

 

[fishonjazz]

Yeah, as I said we could expect improvement and maybe make the playoffs in the West. But I don't think most fans expected finishing 29-5 or something like that.

Truth.
I also didn't expect whoever we drafted to help us much.

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[Handlogten's Heros]

He shouldn't cost a dime over 10 million per year at most and I would balk at anything higher. Give me Aminu 10/10 times over Mirotic.

Jazz need athletes, not inconsistent chuckers.

Aminu is fine too, but I prefer to have a shooter... even if he is not consistent. His TS% has been consistently above average for his career... so I would want him to aggressively look for his shot. I'm not sure Aminu would work as well for us. Like you don't want him dribbling and his shot really comes and goes. His defense is really good, but I'm not sure he transforms our defense... we already really good on that end.

I think Niko gets slightly more than MLE so that is why I put him at 12Mish... I won't quibble over the difference between $10M and 12M.