2023 Trade Rumors and Gossip Involving the Jazz

[KqWIN]

I was referring to we don't get DLo without Conley

I mean I said a piece of a first like 12 times... but its a higher quality first than either one of the ones we gave up so add that to the equation. Its equally ridiculous to think the deal doesn't get done without Mike and that he was a negative.

Lol... he made a difference. He helped one of our stars quite a bit... and honestly helped both of them.

The rest of the stuff set us up for failure... Conley absolutely contributed to our success. Of course other things could have been done but the Conley deal didn't prevent many of those options if any.

Do you know who also helped our stars and contributed to the same amount of playoff series wins? Ricky Rubio. If that’s what made the Conley trade worth it we could have kept Rubio who was dying to come back. We didn’t just give up picks but good players as well. I am not a Jae crowder guy but he went to the finals twice after the Jazz as a key contributor and Grayson turned into a rotation player. The cost for Conley was not cheap, and there’s not much to show for the trade.

His regular season performance was mixed as well as his playoff performance. Some good, some bad, and some injuries. He was a good player but stylistically made any issues you have with Mitchell and Gobert worse.

Of course he contributed in some ways, but if you’re making the argument that it was impossible to find the right guy Conley made it more important to find that guy and also more difficult to acquire that guy because of the assets it cost to get him. The Jazz continued to compound this issue with the way they filled out the rest of the roster.

Again, it wasn’t the death nail. This conversation started with me disagreeing with Conley being the main cause for the previous Jazz failure. There were many worse failures and the situation could have been salved. But I still do not think it was a good idea to invest heavily in such a flawed combo. I didn’t love it back then and with the benefit of hindsight I still do not think it was a great move.

 

[jazfan23]

Rudy didn’t make first or second defensive team

Pretty much backs up what I and a few others have been saying , yet get blasted because someone who can’t catch a ball is your hero

 

[NUMBERICA]

Do you know who also helped our stars and contributed to the same amount of playoff series wins? Ricky Rubio..

lol k dude

 

[kcgar]

Rudy didn’t make first or second defensive team

Pretty much backs up what I and a few others have been saying , yet get blasted because someone who can’t catch a ball is your hero

You sound smart

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Do you know who also helped our stars and contributed to the same amount of playoff series wins? Ricky Rubio. If that’s what made the Conley trade worth it we could have kept Rubio who was dying to come back. We didn’t just give up picks but good players as well. I am not a Jae crowder guy but he went to the finals twice after the Jazz as a key contributor and Grayson turned into a rotation player. The cost for Conley was not cheap, and there’s not much to show for the trade.

Mike was fine in the Denver series and helped us win a playoff series by helping us get the #1 seed. He broke down in the playoffs due to injury... so did Ricky in the Houston series. Ricky also not an iron man. Grayson lol... he was traded for a second round pick after he had a good year in Memphis.

His regular season performance was mixed as well as his playoff performance. Some good, some bad, and some injuries. He was a good player but stylistically made any issues you have with Mitchell and Gobert worse.

Of course he contributed in some ways, but if you’re making the argument that it was impossible to find the right guy Conley made it more important to find that guy and also more difficult to acquire that guy because of the assets it cost to get him. The Jazz continued to compound this issue with the way they filled out the rest of the roster.

They don't have the best offense in the league without Mike... he helped a lot on offense for both Don and Rudy.

Again, it wasn’t the death nail.

Its death knell.

This conversation started with me disagreeing with Conley being the main cause for the previous Jazz failure. There were many worse failures and the situation could have been salved. But I still do not think it was a good idea to invest heavily in such a flawed combo. I didn’t love it back then and with the benefit of hindsight I still do not think it was a great move.

The primary issue viewing the Conley trade as bad. I really don't think it was considering the cost, his production, and the fact we got something on the backend. So very few deals become homeruns and the cost that we ate was fine. Its like 7th or 8th on things I might change about the Don/Rudy era.

 

[416Klawzz]

Rudy didn’t make first or second defensive team

Pretty much backs up what I and a few others have been saying , yet get blasted because someone who can’t catch a ball is your hero

Amen brother. Don't know why everyone on this board blows their load for an offensively challenged stiff. Ainge did the right thing and traded his scrub ***

What could the Timberwolves get if they traded Rudy Gobert? Probably less than you think

 

[jazfan23]

Amen brother. Don't know why everyone on this board blows their load for an offensively challenged stiff. Ainge did the right thing and traded his scrub ***

What could the Timberwolves get if they traded Rudy Gobert? Probably less than you think

Wow that article shows just how bad Rudy has been , I didn’t realise he has a 25/26 player option , good luck in trading him for anything other than a team absorbing his contract .

 

[416Klawzz]

Wow that article shows just how bad Rudy has been , I didn’t realise he has a 25/26 player option , good luck in trading him for anything other than a team absorbing his contract .

He will be out of the league very soon. He will then try his hand in boxing and get knocked the f out by D Will.

 

[KqWIN]

Mike was fine in the Denver series and helped us win a playoff series by helping us get the #1 seed. He broke down in the playoffs due to injury... so did Ricky in the Houston series. Ricky also not an iron man. Grayson lol... he was traded for a second round pick after he had a good year in Memphis.

They don't have the best offense in the league without Mike... he helped a lot on offense for both Don and Rudy.

Its death knell.

The primary issue viewing the Conley trade as bad. I really don't think it was considering the cost, his production, and the fact we got something on the backend. So very few deals become homeruns and the cost that we ate was fine. Its like 7th or 8th on things I might change about the Don/Rudy era.

We could have retained Rubio without losing any assets. For all the assets we gave up for Conley, there is not much more team success to show for it. Like Rubio, he obvious flaws that did not mesh with the star players as well as some things that helped a ton. We did not get eviscerated year after year on defense in the playoffs with Rubio. It was the right decision to move on from Rubio, it was the wrong decision to bet on a player that also does not fit next to your best players. To be a successful trade, you don't have to meet the standard that Rubio set you have to go far beyond it because we gave up a lot for him and was also paid a much higher salary. If you think it was worth it to improve our regular season play, to each their own. But the playoff success wasn't there. While Conley had some good games and helped us he also went down to injury (which was a risk you had to factor in at time of trade) and had a horrific two-way series against DAL.

When you make a move like that I think it ought to be with playoff success in mind and the Conley/Mitchell was inevitably going to get destroyed on defense, and that's what happened. The Conley trade was bad because it makes it very difficult to build around. I do not believe in commtting lots of assets to create a roster that does not fit. This is no different than surrounding Gobert with non-shooters, it's just not a good idea. The fact that it is hard to find two way wings is not justification for the trade it is the reason why you don't spend a bunch of assets to create a tiny, defensively deficient backcourt. I would not justify getting a non shooting big to pair with Gobert because it's too hard to get a wing.

I never said it was the biggest mistake, but I would not do it again given the choice. Yeah we made more critical mistakes, but if we could start over I would not think about pairing Donovan with a small PG who also can't defend in the playoffs...especially given that we had the ideal backcourt partner already on the team. This doesn't mean Mike was a net negative player or didn't provide any value at all, but not worth the price and not the best use of assets given the fit issues with Mitchell.

 

[416Klawzz]

Rubio just couldn't shoot the 3 man, we gave up all of our future for Crapoley. Mike and Rudy Gobert were why we couldn't advance. And Doka what a dumbass DL was. Excited to see him fail in Dallas what an idiot

 

[fishonjazz]

I could see it go either way, but Wemby is supposed to be a generational talent a la Dr. J and he will cost $6 - $10 million for 4 years and not $40 - $50 million.

You can build a contender around Laur, Kessler, Wemby, and 2 all stars that you use assets to collect.

Not sure about a contender with Lauri, Luka, assrts, and no cap space.

He will also probably have some painful developing during those 4 cheap years.

 

[fishonjazz]

There is no way I give this much for Luka, no way. I don't care if Wemby is a star or not. I don't care about Luka at all. Why would I give them Walker and all those picks [and I think it would take 1-2 more players from Dallas' perspective] for a player while very good, is a killer for team dynamics. He is not a team player. He is a black hole that isn't worth getting and mortgaging the future for. I am not and will never be a Luka fan, nor do I ever want to see him in a Jazz uni. Just suicide if you go after him. He's never accomplished anything, but scoring. He doesn't get in shape. He has toxic relationships with his team mates. I'm sorry, you will never convince me that he is the answer.

He actually averages hella assists.

 

[fishonjazz]

I remember when the Jazz traded all their roll players and their future picks for the player that would put the Gobert/Mitchel Jazz over the top. Conolly was a really good player, but that deal sunk any chance for the Jazz to improve for years .

Ya conley had never been an all star. Luka is a guaranteed all star every year and a possible mvp candidate. Apples to oranges.

 

[fishonjazz]

I don’t understand how Conley was viewed as a negative when the deal doesn’t happen without him and the Lakers best returning asset was from the team that took Conley in the deal.

The deal doesn't happen without westbrick so westbricks contract was also awesome.

 

[fishonjazz]

Negative contracts are involved in trades all the time where the deal could not happen without them. The Timberwolves received incentive to trade Russell for Conley. It was not a 1 for 1 swap for Russell/Conley.

This. Westbricks contract was trash for his production for the lakers. They LOVED getting rid of him. The deal couldn't have happened without westbrick so now that means his contract was a postive? Ya, no. Just because a player with a crap contract is traded doesn't make that contract not crap.

 

[fishonjazz]

So who was extremely valuable then, Vando or Beasley?

Well no one was extremely valuable. If anyone was valuable in the trade then there wouldn't have been 4 players, two picks, and taking on a bad contract all neccessary to get 1 protected pick lol.

 

[fishonjazz]

Russell was the main attraction for the Lakers in that deal. We don't get Russell without Mike. Beasley and Vando and Mike all had second round pick value by themselves... not sure how you can pinpoint Beasley and Vando as more valuable than Mike... Vando maybe but Mike was the best NBA player in the deal... we supposedly had at least one offer from NO for him.

So mike had 2nd round pick value. Nuff said. (2nds aren't very valuable in case anyone was wondering)

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

So mike had 2nd round pick value. Nuff said. (2nds aren't very valuable in case anyone was wondering)

I would say Mike/Vando/Malik were all worth multiple second round picks because we got a really good first in the deal. The firsts that we gave were in the 20s (one we knew was in the 20s and the other had protections) I’m just saying the net cost really wasn’t “bad” for what we got. Did we want it to be better? Fo sho. Whatever value you want to assign on the backend is fine but we got value there. So if that’s equivalent to expiring salary and 2-3 seconds… that’s definitely something.

We did fine in the Conley deal and a lot of the deals we could have done would have turned out worse or roughly the same value. Having watched how Dons career is working out… I’m not sure what we could have put next to him that was possible and would build a title contender.

 

[fishonjazz]

I would say Mike/Vando/Malik were all worth multiple second round picks because we got a really good first in the deal. The firsts that we gave were in the 20s (one we knew was in the 20s and the other had protections) I’m just saying the net cost really wasn’t “bad” for what we got. Did we want it to be better? Fo sho. Whatever value you want to assign on the backend is fine but we got value there. So if that’s equivalent to expiring salary and 2-3 seconds… that’s definitely something.

We did fine in the Conley deal and a lot of the deals we could have done would have turned out worse or roughly the same value. Having watched how Dons career is working out… I’m not sure what we could have put next to him that was possible and would build a title contender.

Ya I was commenting on whether conleys contract was negative or positive. To me it was clearly negative if an all star player is only worth a second round pick. Usually all stars are worth more than a 2nd round pick imo.
Also in that trade we took westbrick off the lakers hands so when you add that into the equation then it makes all the players, conley included, appear even less valuable. I remember when everyone was certain we could get an unprotected first (or 2) for simply taking westbrook. Not even giving any good players. So we take westbrook, get 1 protected pick, and give up 4 players and 2 picks. Ya, that tells me that conleys contract was no bueno.

Conley is making 24 and a half million next year. No way is he worth that. Part of the reason the jazz made the trade is because they didn't want to pay him that contract next season imo. I think conley was in the trade just as much because the jazz wanted to get rid of him as much as because minny wanted him.

 

[Handlogten's Heros]

Ya I was commenting on whether conleys contract was negative or positive. To me it was clearly negative if an all star player is only worth a second round pick. Usually all stars are worth more than a 2nd round pick imo.
Also in that trade we took westbrick off the lakers hands so when you add that into the equation then it makes all the players, conley included, appear even less valuable. I remember when everyone was certain we could get an unprotected first (or 2) for simply taking westbrook. Not even giving any good players. So we take westbrook, get 1 protected pick, and give up 4 players and 2 picks. Ya, that tells me that conleys contract was no bueno.

Conley is making 24 and a half million next year. No way is he worth that. Part of the reason the jazz made the trade is because they didn't want to pay him that contract next season imo. I think conley was in the trade just as much because the jazz wanted to get rid of him as much as because minny wanted him.

It’s not negative though… it may not be super positive but not negative.