Colorado Shooting

[bigb]

Are firearms (both the small ones and assault-rifle look-a-likes) so cheap in USA, that even those who work with minimum wage can afford them?
Does anybody know somebody who would buy a good looking/working expensive firearm instead of going to similarly priced vacation or something similar?

The two that Gameface chose to highlight would not be priced similarly at all. The first could be had right now for around $250. That’s a basic gun, with no accessories added on or anything like that. The second, with all those accessories, would cost around $1000.00.


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[bigb]

I absolutely agree that something needs to change with our current climate/system/attitude. I don’t know what that is. I don’t think banning “assault rifles” is the answer. I would like to see a ban on private gun sales (not that it would actually stop a lot of people) or require all sales be done with a background check. I think a psychiatrist/psychologist/sociologist/therapist that is treating someone having violent thoughts should be able (maybe required) to have that patients name out on a “no sell” list. Limiting ammo purchases or magazine capacity won’t do much, IMO.


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[Deleted member 365]

I’m interested in how red Flag laws might work and if they might have a significant impact on these events? The Parkland and Sandy Hook shooters as I remember, had issues and should have never been able to legally purchase guns. I know the Sandy Hook guy had access to his mother’s guns so that’s dicey. And I don’t remember how the Parkland shooter got access to his guns.

 

[Gameface]

I worry that "red flag" laws might deter people from seeking treatment that they need.

I honestly think the first order of business is to make standard "rules of engagement" laws that help to clarify what is and is not okay to do when you're carrying a firearm. There's a lot a gray area and I want to get into the details using specific cases but I'm not up for it right now. This is a subject where there should ideally be zero gray area and every incident where a gun is drawn and/or fired in "self defense" should be relatively straight forward in determining if it was legally justified or not.

I think we're lost in regard to "assault rifles" and mass shootings. I don't think there is any realistic way to make a meaningful difference in the short term. I think there needs to be a culture shift within the gun rights community leaning more towards emphasizing responsibility and disciplined gun ownership and use vs the "moar freedumb" mentality that currently dominates.

 

[lauriandres]

I own one of each and I can honestly tell you the touching, holding, or firing the second one does not make me “wet my vagina” or “have fever dreams of killing bad guys”. While I don’t consider myself a “gun nut”, I think a lot of people would. I currently own 6 different firearms and I have a total of approximately 4000-5000 rounds of ammo. Does that make me a gun nut?
I do agree with you that the second is treated and perceived much differently than the first.


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IMHO as long as it is legal and kids are not suffering - it is not my business how somebody is spending their hard earned money.

6 firearms and that much of ammo - i guess from a european perspective that is sign of being a gun nut unless you are planning to be a guide in Svalbard or some other location where you need firearm against some dangerous animal.
What were the conditions that made you to choose/buy guns and ammo instead of purchasing something for wife and kids or spending that money to travel or some other hobbies? Technically i am able to afford a firearm which costs about 1000 EUR, but for the same money i would a get almost 2 longhaul roundtrip plane tickets or 10 nights in a hotel, maybe even electrical cabling overhaul in our cottage (we still have electrical cables from the soviet time). 6 firearms and that much ammo would get us a sauna , something like this:

Two rooms oval sauna + terrace - Saunasell

saunasell.com

 

[bigb]

IMHO as long as it is legal and kids are not suffering - it is not my business how somebody is spending their hard earned money.

6 firearms and that much of ammo - i guess from a european perspective that is sign of being a gun nut unless you are planning to be a guide in Svalbard or some other location where you need firearm against some dangerous animal.
What were the conditions that made you to choose/buy guns and ammo instead of purchasing something for wife and kids or spending that money to travel or some other hobbies? Technically i am able to afford a firearm which costs about 1000 EUR, but for the same money i would a get almost 2 longhaul roundtrip plane tickets or 10 nights in a hotel, maybe even electrical cabling overhaul in our cottage (we still have electrical cables from the soviet time). 6 firearms and that much ammo would get us a sauna , something like this:

Two rooms oval sauna + terrace - Saunasell

saunasell.com

My first gun (a standard .22 rifle) was bought when I was 21 years old. Next I bought a 9mm handgun and got my concealed carry permit. That was about 6 years ago, so about 15 years after my first. I wanted to protect myself and my family. Then I bought a .45 handgun. It’s more compact than the other and easier to carry with my tools, etc. at work (I only carry this when I’m in certain areas for work). I bought the AR-15 after shooting one with a friend. Fun as hell to shoot. It’s a lower end one, and I haven’t added anything or “tricked it out”. I bought a 20 gauge shotgun from my uncle when he sold his collection. He was moving and didn’t want them anymore. My oldest boy (13) loves to shoot clay pigeons with that, plus it’s light enough the kick isn’t too much for him. It’s a great upland bird gun. I’ve killed plenty of pheasants with it. My last acquisition is a long rifle, shooting the 6.5 Creedmoor. I actually won this in a raffle from one of the local wildlife conservation organizations. I’ve actually never shot it in the 2 years I’ve owned it.
The ammo has been collected over time. When I see some at a good price, I buy it. It’s been a good long while since I’ve added any, as prices are sky high right now, if you can even find anything.
I only purchase guns and ammo with my “secret stash” of money. If I do a project and get paid in cash, that goes into my secret stash. I’m not taking my paycheck and spending it on firearms. My family is well fed and taken care of. My kids all play whatever sports they want. We travel, though only to their sports tournaments as they are playing one sport or another basically year round.
Its not like I took $10,000 and dropped it all at once on this. A couple hundred here, a couple hundred there.

 

[fishonjazz]

My first gun (a standard .22 rifle) was bought when I was 21 years old. Next I bought a 9mm handgun and got my concealed carry permit. That was about 6 years ago, so about 15 years after my first. I wanted to protect myself and my family. Then I bought a .45 handgun. It’s more compact than the other and easier to carry with my tools, etc. at work (I only carry this when I’m in certain areas for work). I bought the AR-15 after shooting one with a friend. Fun as hell to shoot. It’s a lower end one, and I haven’t added anything or “tricked it out”. I bought a 20 gauge shotgun from my uncle when he sold his collection. He was moving and didn’t want them anymore. My oldest boy (13) loves to shoot clay pigeons with that, plus it’s light enough the kick isn’t too much for him. It’s a great upland bird gun. I’ve killed plenty of pheasants with it. My last acquisition is a long rifle, shooting the 6.5 Creedmoor. I actually won this in a raffle from one of the local wildlife conservation organizations. I’ve actually never shot it in the 2 years I’ve owned it.
The ammo has been collected over time. When I see some at a good price, I buy it. It’s been a good long while since I’ve added any, as prices are sky high right now, if you can even find anything.
I only purchase guns and ammo with my “secret stash” of money. If I do a project and get paid in cash, that goes into my secret stash. I’m not taking my paycheck and spending it on firearms. My family is well fed and taken care of. My kids all play whatever sports they want. We travel, though only to their sports tournaments as they are playing one sport or another basically year round.
Its not like I took $10,000 and dropped it all at once on this. A couple hundred here, a couple hundred there.

Are you still finding pheasants these days?
That was always my favorite hunt by far (and I hunted just about everything) but the last couple times I went we couldn't find any roosters and rarely even found any hens. And we have some really good bird dogs with us too. (They find grouse and chuckers with no problem)

Actually had to go to a pheasant farm and pay for some roosters. My dad and one of my brothers even drove to North Dakota to pheasant hunt because they are so scarce here now

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[JazzGal]

We would need a cultural shift to change anything in the US, and I don't see that happening any time soon. When the Sandy Hook shooting didn't change anything, it became clear to me that nothing will be done. We have a Wild West mentality and an exaggerated sense of rights.

In my own fantasy world, I would like to incorporate rules that some other countries have. Like all guns being registered (we have to with cars, why not guns). And gun safety training for anyone owning a gun (again, we have to have training to drive a car). Since most gun deaths are suicides, I also like laws where someone can put themselves on a list to not be able to purchase a gun. And those with mental health issues that include violent tendencies should also be on a list to not be able to purchase a gun (although this can be a slippery slope since not all mental health issues are the same).

And heaven knows we need to spend our money on mental health issues instead of putting everyone in prison. But honestly, I would be happy if the laws we have in place were actually enforced. That would be a start.

 

[bigb]

Are you still finding pheasants these days?
That was always my favorite hunt by far (and I hunted just about everything) but the last couple times I went we couldn't find any roosters and rarely even found any hens. And we have some really good bird dogs with us too. (They find grouse and chuckers with no problem)

Actually had to go to a pheasant farm and pay for some roosters. My dad and one of my brothers even drove to North Dakota to pheasant hunt because they are so scarce here now

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I haven’t hunted in years (way too many kids playing way too many sports) but that’s what I hear as well. The pheasant hunt is hard to come by in these parts.


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[AlaskanAssassin]

I think we're lost in regard to "assault rifles" and mass shootings. I don't think there is any realistic way to make a meaningful difference in the short term. I think there needs to be a culture shift within the gun rights community leaning more towards emphasizing responsibility and disciplined gun ownership and use vs the "moar freedumb" mentality that currently dominates.

Totally agree. With more rights comes more responsibility, right? I actually think most people (even the vast majority of gun owners) are okay with sensible restrictions on firearm ownership. I think proficiency and safety testing, along with proof that you can secure your firearms (safe or locked case), should be required before being allowed to buy a gun.

Obviously gun manufacturers and the NRA don't want to hear that.

 

[AlaskanAssassin]

Careful with some of the "data" we receive about how many more mass shootings the US has than the rest of the world. I don't pretend to be an expert in this area, but studies such as the one covered by Stossel below are contested. Much of it might boil down to what is defined as a "mass shooting".

*This is not meant to be an argument that don't need to improve our laws surrounding gun ownership. *

 

[babe]

Careful with some of the "data" we receive about how many more mass shootings the US has than the rest of the world. I don't pretend to be an expert in this area, but studies such as the one covered by Stossel below are contested. Much of it might boil down to what is defined as a "mass shooting".

*This is not meant to be an argument that don't need to improve our laws surrounding gun ownership. *

I think both sides here are just damn ignoramuses.

Having been "around" a bit, I know that intense local animosities are at the root of a lot of small-time gun attacks, like on markets or water holes where a determined partisan can do his bit.

Not very many countries have the kind of mental cases we have. I also wonder how much of this boils down to a "copy-cat culture". I wish our media played it differently and did not sensationalize it or make so much of it. Maybe focus on the deranged shooter more than the gun.

Pretty hard for any simple statistical analysis to figure humans out very well.