Jordan Peterson

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by NPC D4617, Aug 13, 2019.

  1. NPC D4617

    NPC D4617 Well-Known Member

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    What seemed logical?

    I think you are trying to make a point, but in fact you are not. Whether or not someone finds Peterson helpful is subjective. Im 100% certain you didnt watch the video anyways. You just defer to your default bigotry and bias.
     
  2. sirkickyass

    sirkickyass Moderator Emeritus Staff Member

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    Peterson is a person who is beloved by a certain segment of society and has obtained a large degree of notoriety. I've spent time looking into him as well.

    I have spent hours on this and I have NO CLUE what he means by "cultural Marxism" and/or "post modern Marxism." I've read articles about the subject. I've listened to him try to talk about it in context. It's a set of words in search of an idea. As far as I can tell it's a cipher that his adherents project whatever they don't like onto. It feels like he is always coming up with an argument about whatever social problem you care about most.

    For this reason I was very interested in watching his debate with Zizek a few months ago, since it was nominally supposed to be about Marxism. That was a true "the emperor has no clothes" moment. The Lobster King plainly had no clue what he was talking about when confronted with someone with a pretty significant grasp of the philosophical underpinnings of all the ideas that Peterson gestures at but doesn't really describe.

    TL;DR: I'm sure Peterson is helpful to some people as a therapist and as a motivational speaker. But he's closer to Tony Robbins than a real social theorist.
     
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  3. candrew

    candrew Well-Known Member

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    I watched most of the Zizek - Peterson debate and it was a clear case of an up and comer (Peterson) hitting his head on the ceiling.

    Having said that, I've also read Peterson's "12 Rules" book and it's not without merit as a self-improvement document.

    I don't need to agree with someone 100% to find value in what they're saying - not sure when that became a law.
     
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  4. AlaskanAssassin

    AlaskanAssassin Well-Known Member

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    I really enjoy Peterson. I can't speak to all of his philosophical ideas or his take on society's woes (I don't care to take the time to learn more about this....apparently he uses lobsters in his research?), but his messages about personal responsibility, living your life to the fullest, and the dangers of compelled speech resonate with me. I also believe that a lot of his ideas come from a place of sincere compassion for others, and a desire to inspire others to lead a life they will truly enjoy. I have his book and it's sitting on my shelf to read. I'll get to it eventually.

    I will say that the notion that he might be a white supremacist, is a member of the alt-right, is sexist, or is transphobic are laughable. If the bar to be classified as one of these things is so low as to include someone like Jordan Peterson, than these words or classifications no longer have any real meaning.
     
  5. One Brow

    One Brow Well-Known Member

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    She is friendly with white supremacists and other members of the alt-right, regularly speaking to them and engaging in photo-ops with them, but may not be one himself. Her idea of enforced monogamy is classic sexism. Her refusal to use pronouns that others prefer is straight-forward transphobia.
     
  6. dalamon

    dalamon Well-Known Member 2018 Prediction Contest Winner

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    Lobster King got rekd by Zizek of all ppl. Nothing to see here. Everyone go read Marx instead, I promise it’ll be a better read
     
  7. Jonah

    Jonah Well-Known Member

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    Cultural Marxism is just how some conservatives have fairly recently started to refer to Critical Theory, which has been around for many decades. It was developed by disaffected Marxists, mainly in Germany and the United States, in response to the horrors of Stalinism. Critical Theory is most simply a critical look at capitalism from a cultural perspective. Eric Fromm is probably the best known and most influential writer from the movement and he died about forty years ago without ever exactly shattering the foundations of capitalism and threatening our way of life. Anyway, Cultural Marxism sounds much more scary than Critical Theory, so I imagine that’s why Peterson and others have taken to using the term.
     
  8. str8line

    str8line Well-Known Member Contributor 2019 Award Winner

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    I watched it. Late last night with my swerve on. Never heard of him before but he's smart and really well-spoken. I'm not the type to start following someone but I found what he had to say interesting and logical.
     
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  9. NPC D4617

    NPC D4617 Well-Known Member

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    You are misrepresenting his position on pronouns. And acting like a child btw.

    Its funny how you think its ok to fight misgendering with more misgendering. It just proves you arent as moral as you pretend to be.

    If you actually listend to any of Peterson you would know what his actual position is, which is he has no problem calling someone by their prefered pronouns, except he wont do by force of law. Which any sane person would agree. If you think the government should be able force you by gun point to call another person some made up pronoun of their choosing, then you are a psycho. And I dont really care to have civil conversations with you.
     
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  10. One Brow

    One Brow Well-Known Member

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    By all means, describe his position on pronouns in a meaningful, competent way. It's more than Peterson has ever done.

    Perhaps. My wife was just telling me recently how much of a child I still am.

    That would require that I am wrongly identifying Peterson's gender. He genuinely seems feminine to me.

    Suuure.

    https://medium.com/s/story/a-field-guide-to-jordan-petersons-political-arguments-312153eac99a

    tl;dr:
    1) The law he was protesting doesn't require you to use preferred pronouns.
    2) He nonetheless requested a special exemption from the law, so that he would not have to use people's preferred pronouns.

    How do you feel about civil conversations with people who invent legal consequences from thin air to claim persecution that does not exist?
     
  11. Wes Mantooth

    Wes Mantooth Well-Known Member

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    Ain’t no one got time for dat.
     
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  12. jimmy eat jazz

    jimmy eat jazz Well-Known Member

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    I don't have a strong opinion on Peterson, but I find his lobster analogy silly. Yes, all sorts of things exist in the animal kingdom, but I'm not sure that I'm prepared to take the leap and conclude, therefore, that they represent suitable models for how humans should arrange their affairs. Animals also routinely kill and eat each other and prey on the weak. So, by Peterson's logic, these then constitute models for how humans should organize their social institutions?

    As for Peterson's self help stuff, haven't read it, but I imagine it's of the garden variety self-help cliches, rostrums, recycled and repackaged truisms, rah rah cheerleading, secrets to success, happiness, and wealth, etc., reductive gross oversimplification of complexity that any number of hundreds of other people have been writing, publishing, or speaking for some time now and for which I also imagine that there hasn't been anything truly original written or stated for about just as long.
     
  13. Saint Cy of JFC

    Saint Cy of JFC Well-Known Member

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    Peterson is dumb as hell. Some of his views are insanely stupid. He just word salads people into thinking hes an intellectual.
     
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  14. NPC D4617

    NPC D4617 Well-Known Member

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    Lmao.

    Its just above your head.
     
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  15. Saint Cy of JFC

    Saint Cy of JFC Well-Known Member

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    Lol
     
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  16. Zombie

    Zombie Well-Known Member

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    I started to watch this and got distracted by Zizek's constant tugging at his shirt and had to listen instead.

    Dude needs some TC tuggers.
     
  17. sirkickyass

    sirkickyass Moderator Emeritus Staff Member

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    Looks like they are taking it a little farther than just renaming something. They are ascribing nefarious motives etc.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frankfurt_School#Cultural_Marxism_conspiracy_theory
     
  18. Saint Cy of JFC

    Saint Cy of JFC Well-Known Member

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    Look up Jordan Peterson and apple cider if you want a laugh.
     
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  19. Red

    Red Well-Known Member

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    Totally bizarre and highly recommended, lol....
     
  20. str8line

    str8line Well-Known Member Contributor 2019 Award Winner

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    He must have been chasing the cocaine with cider.
     

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