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Should Mitt release his tax returns?

As opposed to a totally unnecessary and costly war in Iraq, an unnecessary and costly war in Afghanistan, and overseeing perhaps the worst economic recessions since the Depression?

To the contrary, it is hard to imagine that Gore could have been any worse than W Bush.

That's a fair take, for realz. But I still shudder to think about how differently worse it could have been. We're just fantasizing anyway, right?
 
That's a fair take, for realz. But I still shudder to think about how differently worse it could have been. We're just fantasizing anyway, right?

Well, we're not fantasizing about Bush. More like reliving the nightmare.

Who knows what Gore would have done, but I'm reasonably certain he would not have invaded Iraq and possibly not Afghanistan. Probably all the other stuff would have happened anyway.

At least I give Bush credit for taking action to intervene with TARP and bailing out the auto industry not succumbing to the brain-dead right wing ideology to let the economy crash (because, golly gee, the government shouldn't intervene in these sorts of things.)
 
Potential problem. It's not a problem, because the number of people showing up to the polls to vote as someone else is miniscule.

I ignore thousands of potential problems every day. Why does this one need to be legislated?

For what it's worth, I find that to be a much more compelling argument than Salty's "millions of people will be disenfranchised" one.
 
For what it's worth, I find that to be a much more compelling argument than Salty's "millions of people will be disenfranchised" one.
Those arguments are not arguing the same problem.

He is arguing why voter id does not need to be enacted, I am arguing why the existing voter id laws should be struck down (or at the very least tweaked).
 
For what it's worth, I find that to be a much more compelling argument than Salty's "millions of people will be disenfranchised" one.

Spoken like a scientist. We can't know if people will be disenfranchised until we have an actual disenfranchisment.
 
That's a fair take, for realz. But I still shudder to think about how differently worse it could have been. We're just fantasizing anyway, right?

Afghanistan was unneccesary? F that. Where Id isagree is that we spent all these lives building them back up. We should have left them in the rubble we left behind.

The invasion yes. Staying and all that money and lives lost staying no.
 
Afghanistan was unneccesary? F that. Where Id isagree is that we spent all these lives building them back up. We should have left them in the rubble we left behind.

The invasion yes. Staying and all that money and lives lost staying no.

I just meant that it is generally acceptable to me to question the overall value of Bush' term .. not Afghanistan specifically ..
 
Afghanistan was unneccesary? F that. Where Id isagree is that we spent all these lives building them back up. We should have left them in the rubble we left behind.

The invasion yes. Staying and all that money and lives lost staying no.

Yes unnecessary. Sorry.

By the way, I see that I made it off your ignore list. Glad to know that.
 
I did not intentionally mean to make that connection. Just think that Gore would have been bad as well

I am actually middle of the road on alot of issues. I cannot be called right on gay marriage, abortion, immigration...I'm not perfect and we all have biases of one kind or another but I really do try to take a sensible approach.

I can see that. I hope we can have some decent discussions, and in the least respect each other. I'm here to learn from you all,
and hopefully share some knowledge as well.
 
You lost me. What was your point?

You were responding to me saying republicans would be going ape **** if dems started pushing these type of gun control laws through. The point is, dems are NOT pushing these type of gun control laws through because every time they try, republicans go ape ****.

Voter id is different though, because even though dems went ape **** over it, it still passed.

This is correct. The far left is still pushing for more gun laws, and Obama has been staying in the middle.
I know some want to paint Obama are a far left socialist, but overall that is far far from the truth.

Obama has been too much like Bush on a lot of things. He's done nothing for gun control.
 
Afghanistan was unneccesary? F that. Where Id isagree is that we spent all these lives building them back up. We should have left them in the rubble we left behind.

The invasion yes. Staying and all that money and lives lost staying no.


Hopefully from here on out we have smaller, more cost effective missions aimed at taking out key targets. I know we are against assassinations, but
it's time to rethink that as well.
 
Apparently the new reason is that he doesn't want people to know how much he gives to the church.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nati...bffba6-ed5a-11e1-866f-60a00f604425_story.html


This is the genesis of my new pet theory. The reverse is true: he doesn't want the church to know how much he makes because they can figure out what his tithing SHOULD have been. ;) I bet a yanked temple recommend during election season would suck for ol' Willard.
 
Apparently the new reason is that he doesn't want people to know how much he gives to the church.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nati...bffba6-ed5a-11e1-866f-60a00f604425_story.html


This is the genesis of my new pet theory. The reverse is true: he doesn't want the church to know how much he makes because they can figure out what his tithing SHOULD have been. ;) I bet a yanked temple recommend during election season would suck for ol' Willard.

That's pretty hilarious.
 
93-Year-Old Tennessee Woman Who Cleaned State Capitol For 30 Years Denied Voter ID
By Marie Diamond

Tennessee's Capitol building in Nashville.
A 93-year-old Tennessee woman who cleaned the state Capitol for 30 years, including the governor’s office, says she won’t be able to vote for the first time in decades after being told this week that her old state ID failed to meet new voter ID regulations.
Thelma Mitchell was even accused of being an undocumented immigrant because she couldn’t produce a birth certificate:
Mitchell, who was delivered by a midwife in Alabama in 1918, has never had a birth certificate. But when she told that to a drivers’ license clerk, he suggested she might be an illegal immigrant.
Thelma Mitchell told WSMV-TV that she went to a state drivers’ license center last week after being told that her old state ID from her cleaning job would not meet new regulations for voter identification.
A spokesman for the House Republican Caucus insisted that Mitchell was given bad information and should’ve been allowed to vote, even with an expired state ID. But even if that’s the case, her ordeal illustrates the inevitable disenfranchisements that result when confusing voting laws enable state officials to apply the law inconsistently.
The incident is the just latest in a series of reports of senior citizens being denied their constitutional right to vote under restrictive new voter ID laws pushed by Republican governors and legislatures. These laws are a transparent attempt to target Democrat constituencies who are less likely to have photo ID’s, and disproportionately affect seniors, college students, the poor and minorities.
As ThinkProgress reported, one 96-year-old Tennessee woman was denied a voter ID because she didn’t have her marriage license. Another senior citizen in Tennessee, 91-year-old Virginia Lasater, couldn’t get the ID she needed to vote because she wasn’t able to stand in a long line at the DMV. A Tennessee agency even told a 86-year-old World War II veteran that he had to pay an unconstitutional poll tax if he wanted to obtain an ID.
 
That's why I felt that the need for ID should be held off until 2016. That would give people more than enough time to get some paperwork done. This election was too early for that and a shame it was passed the way it did.
 
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